Lin-Manuel Miranda’s Father on the Latino Vote and a Life of Activism

>>> OUR NEXT GUEST HAS DEVOTED DECADES TO GIVING LATINO COMMUNITIES A CHOICE IN LATINO COMMUNITIES.

BUT MANY KNOW HIM HAS ARIZONA THE FATHER OF "HAMILTON" CREATOR LIN-MANUEL MIRANDA.

NOW LUIS MIRANDA IS OUT WITH A NEW MEMOIR, "RELENTLESS: MY STORY OF THE LATINO SPIRIT THAT IS TRANSFORMING AMERICA."

WHICH CHRONICLES HIS JOURNEY FROM YOUNG ACTIVIST IN PUERTO RICO TO NEW YORK CITY.

MICHEL MARTIN LOOKS BACK AT A LIFETIME ADVOCACY.

>> THANKS, CHRISTIANE.

LUIS MIRANDA JR., THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR SPEAKING WITH US.

>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR HAVING ME HERE.

>> AS YOUR SON LIN-MANUEL SAYS IN THE FORWARD, THIS BOOK DOES A LOT OF THINGS.

IT'S A MEMOIR, IT'S A STORY OF THE POLITICAL EVOLUTION OF LATINO POWER IN NEW YORK PARTICULARLY, AND IT'S ALSO KIND OF A -- I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO SAY, A MANIFESTO ABOUT WHAT TO SAY ABOUT HOW LEADERS SHOULD BE THINKING ABOUT LATINO VOTERS IN THE CURRENT MOMENT.

IT DOES A LOT OF THINGS.

WHAT MADE YOU WANT TO WRITE THIS BOOK AT THIS TIME?

>> WHEN I STARTED, IT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE THE MANIFESTO PART.

I WAS GETTING INCREASINGLY PISSED OFF THAT I KEPT READING ALL OF THE NEW EXPERTS ON LATINO POLITICS, BUT I'VE NEVER HEARD OF IN MY ENTIRE LIFE, AND I'VE BEEN IN THIS SPACE FOR 45 YEARS.

I KNOW A LOT OF PEOPLE IN THIS SPACE.

BUT THEY HAD READ A COUPLE OF POLLS, AND ALL OF THE SUDDEN THEY WERE EXPERTS.

AND I KEPT COMPLAINING TO MY FRIENDS.

AND MY FRIENDS SAID WHY RATHER THAN COMPLAINING PUT DOWN ON PAPER YOUR 45 YEARS OF EXPERIENCE IN THIS AREA.

SO I STARTED DOING THAT.

AS I DID THAT, MY FAMILY BECAME MORE AND MORE PROTAGONIST IN THE STORY OF POLITICS BECAUSE A LOT OF WHAT WE DO, WE DO IT TOGETHER AS A FAMILY.

AND THEN THE AUTOBIOGRAPHICAL PART BECAME AN IMPORTANT COMPONENT OF IT.

>> YOU CAME TO THE MAINLAND FROM PUERTO RICO WHEN YOU WERE ONLY 19 YEARS OLD.

WHY DID YOU CHOOSE TO GO TO THE MAINLAND?

AND HOW DID YOU GET INTERESTED IN POLITICS?

>> I WAS ALWAYS FASCINATED BY NEW YORK.

IT WAS NOT EVEN THE MAINLAND.

IT WAS NEW YORK.

>> NEW YORK.

>> AND SO COMING TO NEW YORK WAS IMPORTANT TO ME SO WHEN I WAS RECRUITED FOR THE Ph.D PROGRAM IN CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGY, AND THE UNIVERSITY OF PUERTO RICO GAVE ME A SCHOLARSHIP TO COME TO NEW YORK, IT WAS LIKE A SPECIAL COMBO.

I WAS COMING TO NEW YORK.

I WAS GOING TO STUDY CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGY.

AND I WAS GETTING DOLLARS TO BE IN NEW YORK BUT TO GO BACK TO PUERTO RICO, BECAUSE THE SCHOLARSHIP MEANT THAT I WOULD GO BACK TO PUERTO RICO TO TEACH FOR A Ph.D PROGRAM THAT THEY WERE STARTING AT THE UNIVERSITY OF PUERTO RICO.

OF COURSE NONE OF THAT HAPPENED.

>> I'M ALSO FROM NEW YORK, BORN AND RAISED.

AND I WAS REALLY INTERESTED TO READ YOUR ACCOUNTS OF LIKE THE POLITICS OF THE TIME, THE POLITICS OF KIND OF PUERTO RICAN INDEPENDENCE, WHETHER WHAT'S OUR PATH FORWARD?

IS IT TO SEEK INDEPENDENCE, OR IS IT TO SEEK COMMON CAUSE WITH OTHER HISTORICALLY MARGINALIZED PEOPLE AS A PART OF THE UNITED STATES?

IT WAS REALLY SORT OF INTERESTING TO READ THAT.

AND YOU SAY -- AND PEOPLE MAY FORGET THAT THERE WAS A LOT OF, YOU KNOW, THAT THESE CONVERSATIONS WEREN'T ALL THEORETICAL.

SOME OF THEM WERE VIOLENT.

THERE WAS A WHOLE ACTIVIST WING THAT ACTUALLY BELIEVED IN USING VIOLENCE AS A TOOL.

AND YOU WERE VERY KIND OF TORN BETWEEN THE CAPITALIST VISION AND THE SOCIALIST VISION.

BUT TELL ME A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT THAT.

>> WHEN YOU COME FROM PUERTO RICO AND IN YOUR MIND YOU'RE COMING BACK, YOU'RE GOING BACK TO PUERTO RICO, YOUR LIFE HAS A LEG IN NEW YORK AND A LEG IN PUERTO RICO.

SO THE DISCUSSIONS ABOUT WHAT IS THE ROLE OF ACTIVISTS AND POLITICAL OPERATIVES AT THIS POINT -- WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE 70s, RIGHT AFTER THE YOUNG LORDS, THE DEBATE WAS IT'S OUR JOB TO FIGHT FOR PUERTO RICAN DEFENDANTS WITHIN THE UNITED STATES OR THERE WAS AN ENTIRE GROUP OF PEOPLE WHO SAID NO, OUR JOB, BECAUSE MOST OF US ARE GOING TO STAY HERE, IT'S TO BRING JOY TO OTHER MARGINALIZED COMMUNITIES WHO ARE OUR NEIGHBORS AND FIGHT FOR THE DEMOCRATIC RIGHTS AND SCHOOLING AND HOUSING AND HEALTH CARE OF ALL OF OUR COMMUNITIES.

IT TOOK ME A WHILE TO GET THERE.

BUT AT THE END, THAT'S WHERE I LANDED.

>> WHAT IS IT THAT ATTRACTED YOU TO THIS PUBLIC SERVICE?

AND YOU'VE HAD ALL THESE DIFFERENT REALLY INTERESTING, YOU KNOW, ROLES THAT YOU'VE PLAYED IN THE CITY.

WHAT ATTRACT YOU'D TO THAT?

>> I THINK A LOT WAS UPBRINGING.

I GREW UP IN A VERY SMALL TOWN IN PUERTO RICO.

THEY HAD SIX STREETS, THEY'RE STILL THOSE SIX STREETS.

BUT MY PARENTS WERE VERY MUCH INVOLVED IN THE FABRIC OF THE TOWN.

VERY DIFFERENT.

IT WAS A RED CROSS, THE ROTARY CLUB, LIONS INTERNATIONAL, SORT OF THE KINDS OF CIVIC ORGANIZATIONS THAT WORK IN SMALL PLACES AND THAT HELP SMALL PLACES.

SO WE WERE ALWAYS INVOLVED IN SOME MOVEMENT HELPING SOMEONE.

SO COMING TO NEW YORK, I COULD NOT SEE ANY OTHER WAY THAN GETTING INVOLVED.

IN FACT, WHEN MY WIFE AND I FINISHED SETTLING IN WASHINGTON HEIGHTS 43 YEARS AGO, FOR ME IT WAS IMPORTANT TO END UP IN A NEIGHBORHOOD IN NEW YORK WHERE IT FELT LIKE A SMALL TOWN, WHERE PEOPLE KNEW EACH OTHER, WHERE PEOPLE WILL GOSSIP WITH EACH OTHER, WILL FIGHT WITH EACH OTHER, BUT WOULD HELP EACH OTHER AS WELL.

>> ALL RIGHT.

SO LET'S FAST FORWARD IN NEW YORK.

YOU OBVIOUSLY BELIEVE IN EQUITY.

YOU OBVIOUSLY BELIEVE IN INCLUSION.

BUT WHEN IT COMES TO YOUR KIDS, YOU ALSO BELIEVE IN DOING WHAT'S RIGHT FOR THEM.

YOU WERE VERY AGGRESSIVE ABOUT MAKING SURE THAT WHAT THEY NEEDED WAS TO GO TO A SCHOOL OUTSIDE THE NEIGHBORHOOD, THEN THAT'S WHAT THEY DID.

I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE, PROGRESSIVES, A LOT OF PEOPLE OF COLOR KIND OF FACE THAT DILEMMA, RIGHT?

AND I WAS JUST CURIOUS ABOUT HOW YOU THOUGHT ABOUT THAT.

>> WE WORKED VERY HARD ABOUT OPPORTUNITIES WHEN WE MOVED IN TO WASHINGTON HEIGHTS AND BOUGHT OUR LITTLE HOUSE, THERE WAS NO EXTRA MONEY FOR PRIVATE SCHOOLS.

AND OUR NEIGHBORHOOD, OUR SCHOOL DISTRICT WAS NUMBER 32 OUT OF 32 ON MATH AND READING ACHIEVEMENT.

SO THE GOAL THEN FOR US AS A FAMILY WAS WHAT IS 80 THERE THAT OUR KIDS CAN TAKE ADVANTAGE OF.

THAT'S HOW WE FOUND ABOUT HUNTER CAMPUS SCHOOLS AND SORT OF ENROLLING MANUEL IN THE TESTING TO SEE IF HE WILL BE ACCEPTED.

WE FOUND A MAGNET SCHOOLS THAT WOULD BE OUTSIDE OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD.

ALL OF THIS MEANT THAT AS MY WIFE AND I WERE WORKING SEVERAL JOBS AT THE SAME TIME, WE WERE JUGGLING HOW IS LUISITA GETTING TO 137th STREET?

HOW IS MANUEL GETTING TO 96th STREET ON THE EAST SIDE?

BUT WE ALWAYS THOUGHT THAT, AND I JUST THINK THAT THAT'S THE MODEL OF PEOPLE WHO COME INTO THIS COUNTRY, THAT OUR KIDS WERE GOING TO HAVE A BETTER LIFE HERE.

I GET ASKED ALL THE TIME HOW YOU FEEL WHEN THEY CALL YOU LIN-MANUEL'S DAD, WHEN YOU HAVE THIS OTHER LIFE.

I'M LIKE, WELL, MY LIFE, MOST OF MY LIFE WAS HOW CAN MY KID DO BETTER THAN ME.

SO IF I BECAME LIN-MANUEL'S DAD, I ACCOMPLISHED THE MAIN GOAL IN LIFE.

BUT WE COULD NOT PURCHASE ADDITIONAL SERVICES.

SO WE WENT OUT THERE AND HUSTLED FOR OUR KIDS AND OUR FAMILY.

AND THAT'S HOW I DI GET INVOLVED IN THE CHARTER MOVEMENT.

AS A DEMOCRAT IN NEW YORK, WHEN IT WAS SEEN AS A REPUBLICAN REALITY.

>> ONE OF THE REASONS I WAS ALSO REALLY INTERESTED IN THAT STORY IS IF PEOPLE HAVE SEEN, YOU KNOW, YOUR SON'S FIRST PLAY, BROADWAY PLAY "IN THE HEIGHTS," THAT'S KIND OF ONE OF THE DILEMMAS, RIGHT?

DO I STAY DOOR I GO.

I WAS WONDERING IF YOU THINK THAT IN SORT OF SUBCONSCIOUSLY THAT THAT STORY IN A WAY CAME FROM YOUR OWN FAMILY'S DEBATES ABOUT THESE THINGS.

>> -- IT'S THE DEBATE THAT EXISTS TO THIS DAY WHERE LIN-MANUEL FINISHED WESLEYAN AND CAME BACK TO WASHINGTON HEIGHTS.

AND IN THE HEIGHTS BECOMES A HIT.

HE COULD GO ANYWHERE.

HE'S SETTLED IN WASHINGTON HEIGHTS WHERE HE IS STILL RAISING HIS KIDS.

MY WIFE AND I DECIDED AFTER MUCH DEBATE THAT WE'RE HAPPY HERE.

WE'RE GOING STAY HERE AND CONTINUE TO STICK IT OUT IN THIS NEIGHBORHOOD AND MAKE SURE THAT THAT NEIGHBORHOOD SURVIVES.

AND THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE GONE THROUGH THE STRUGGLES AND THE BACK TIES STAY IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD IN WHATEVER NEXT THE NEIGHBORHOOD IS.

>> SO IN THE TIME WE HAVE LEFT, I WANT TO TALK ABOUT YOUR -- THE OTHER PART OF YOUR BOOK, THE MANIFESTO.

WHAT IS IT THAT YOU THINK THAT A LOT OF PUNDITS AND THE EXPERTS ARE GETTING WRONG ABOUT THE SO-CALLED LATINO VOTE?

>> I THINK THAT, FIRST, THAT AS IT COMES TO LATINO POLITICS, YOU CANNOT ANALYZE LATINO POLITICS IN THE BLACK AFRICAN AMERICAN POLITICS WHITE PARADIGM.

I THINK THAT WHITE POLITICIANS DECIDED THAT BECAUSE WE'RE NOT WHITE, WE MUST BE BLACK.

AND SO ARE ALL TOGETHER IN THE POLITICAL ARENA.

AND THAT'S NOT TRUE.

LATINOS HAVE NEVER VOTED TECHNICALLY FOR ANY CANDIDATE OR PARTY.

JUST REMEMBER, GEORGE BUSH GOT 42% OF THE LATINO VOTE NATIONWIDE.

THE SECOND IS THAT WE'RE NOT TURNING REPUBLICANS.

WE ARE TURNING INTO MORE PERSUADABLE VOTERS.

THE ONLY REAL LATINO POLL THAT HAS BEEN DONE -- OTHER POLLS WERE 18%.

AND THE STANDARD ERROR IS 15%.

SO YOU REALLY CAN CONCLUDE VERY LITTLE.

BUT IN ALL LATINO POLL, SUPPORT FOR BIDEN HAD DROPPED FROM THE 66, 67% THAT HE GOT IN THE ELECTION TO 49%.

BUT TRUMP'S SUPPORT HAD NOT INCREASED.

WHAT HAPPENED IS THAT THEN YOU HAVE THIS 17% OF LATINOS WHO ARE WONDERING WHO ARE WE VOTING FOR?

AND THAT'S WHERE THE PERSUADABLE PART BEGINS.

AND THIRD, OUR PROPENSITY IS TO VOTE DEMOCRAT, BUT ARE GOING TO HAVE TO FIGHT FOR THOSE VOTES, NOT BECAUSE THEY'RE TURNING REPUBLICAN, BUT BECAUSE THEY'LL STAY HOME AND NOT VOTE FOR ANYBODY.

>> YOU SAY -- YOU POINT OUT THAT ABOUT A QUARTER OF THE LATINO COMMUNITY, AS YOU DESCRIBE IT, ARE DONALD TRUMP ADMIRERS OR SUPPORTERS.

AND YOU SAY THAT WHEN HE SPEAKS ABOUT RACE AND IMMIGRANTS, EVEN HIS LATINO FANS CAN FROWN, BUT THEY ALSO LIKE HIM.

WHAT DO THEY LIKE ABOUT HIM?

>> THEY LIKE THAT HE'S BLUNT.

THEY LIKE THAT HE'S ENTERTAINING.

THEY LIKE THAT HE SEEMS TO KNOW EVERYTHING.

GOD, HE SCRATCH THE SURFACE.

90% OF WHAT COMES OUT OF THAT DEMON'S MOUTH IS FALSE.

BUT THERE IS THIS AURA AROUND HIM THAT HE IS POWERFUL, THAT HE IS TELLING THE TRUTH, AND THAT HE IS TELLING IT AS IT IS.

>> ONE OF THE THINGS THAT YOU SAY THAT IS INTERESTING, WHEN HE TALKS ABOUT PROVIDING HONEST WORK, INSTEAD OF A GOVERNMENT HANDOUT, MANY LATINOS LISTEN.

AND FOR MANY IMMIGRANTS, GOVERNMENTS ARE NOT HONEST AND WELL-INTENTIONED.

A AND YOU SAY THAT SOME LATINOS ARE INVESTED IN WHAT TRUMP REPRESENTS BECAUSE THEY'VE COME FROM COUNTRIES THAT WERE RUINED BY CORRUPT DICTATORS.

SO WHERE DO YOU THINK THE DEMOCRATS ARE GETTING THIS WRONG?

>> THAT THEY'RE TREATING US AS A VOTING BLOC.

AND WE ARE A BLOC, BUT NOT A VOTING BLOC.

AND YOU NEED TO UNDERSTAND AS LATINOS DISPERSE THROUGHOUT THE COUNTRY, WHERE WE COME FROM, IT'S IMPORTANT.

THE POLITICAL SITUATION OF THE COUNTRY WHERE WE COMES FROM, IT'S ALSO IMPORTANT.

THE GENERATION THAT WE BELONG TO, IT'S IMPORTANT.

THE GEOGRAPHY, IT'S IMPORTANT.

WHERE WERE WE BORN?

TWO-THIRDS OF LATINOS NOW ARE BORN IN THE UNITED STATES.

SO THEY ARE ALL OF THIS VARIABLES THAT ARE GOING TO IMPACT OUR POLITICAL REALITY.

AND AS DEMOCRATS, WE'RE NOT DOING THAT.

I'LL GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE.

2000, WE SPEND LATINO VICTORY FUND OF WHICH I'M THE CHAIR A LOT OF RESOURCES IN GEORGIA.

EVEN THOUGH LATINOS ARE ONLY 3% OF THE VOTE IN GEORGIA, BUT WE KNEW THAT THEY WERE RIPE IN A PURPLE STATE TO BE TAKEN.

REPUBLICANS DON'T HAVE TO WIN THE LATINO VOTE.

THEY JUST NEED TO CORRODE AND TAKE AWAY ENOUGH FOR US TO LOSE THOSE ELECTORAL VOTES.

SO WE SPENT A LOT OF TIME IN GEORGIA.

YOU HAVE TO INVEST IN A COMMUNITY IF YOU WANT THOSE VOTES.

>> SO BEFORE WE LET YOU GO, I MEAN, YOU'VE HAD HOW MANY LIVES?

YOU'VE HAD A LIFE AS A SCHOLAR.

YOU'VE HAD A LIFE AS A SORT OF A POLITICAL ACTIVIST, AS A PUBLIC SERVANT.

YOU'VE RAISED ONE OF THE GREAT CULTURAL FIGURES OF OUR TIME.

YOU KNOW, AND WHAT'S NEXT FOR YOU?

>> I HAD A HEART ATTACK 2017.

SO MY OUTLOOK OF LIFE HAS CHANGED.

I WOULD DO SEVERAL THINGS.

I WANT TO FIND A SPACE IN DOING DOCUMENTARIES.

I JUST HOPE IT'S A GREAT WAY OF TELLING STORIES THAT I CARE ABOUT WHERE I CAN DO AS A SHORT OR DO AS A 90-MINUTE.

I WANT TO SPEND MORE TIME WITH MY WIFE.

WE HAVE BEEN TOGETHER FOR 46 YEARS, AND ALWAYS DOING STUFF AND SPENDING SO MUCH TIME AND SOMETHING THAT COVID TOLD US WHEN WE WERE IN SECLUSION IS THAT WE ACTUALLY LIKE EACH OTHER, AND THAT WE'D LIKE BEING WITH EACH OTHER.

AND I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT THE NEXT GENERATION OF GRANDCHILDREN GO AHEAD WITH A GREAT BANG.

WE LOVE OUR GRANDCHILDREN.

SO I WANT TO SPEND MORE TIME WITH MY GRANDCHILDREN.

I WANT TO DO MANY OTHER THINGS THAT I HAVEN'T DONE YET.

>> WELL, LUIS MIRANDA JR., THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR SPEAKING WITH US.

>> THANK YOU.

THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.