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>>> HELLO, EVERYONE.

WELCOME TO "AMANPOUR & COMPANY."

HERE'S WHAT'S COMING UP.

>> WE'RE ALL AMERICANS.

AND TOGETHER, LET'S ALL CHOOSE KAMALA HARRIS!

>> A CALL TO ACTION AT THE DEMOCRATIC CONVENTION AS THE PARTY STEELS ITSELF FOR A TOUGH FIGHT TO COME.

LESLIE VINJAMURI AND STEPHANIE FLANDERS LOOK AHEAD.

THEN -- >> WE WERE LOOKING AT EACH OTHER.

WE FIGURED OUT, WE'RE NOT ONLY COMPETITORS.

WE'RE PEOPLE.

>> AN EXTRAORDINARY TENNIS RIVALRY TURNED INTO A DEEP FRIENDSHIP.

I SPEAK WITH TWO OF THE GREATS, MARTINA NAVRATILOVA AND CHRIS EVERT.

AND -- >> THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION ATTEMPTED SOME OF THE MOST MONSTROUS POLICIES WE'VE EVER SEEN.

>> DIVING INTO AMERICA'S IMMIGRATION CRISIS WITH NEW YORKER STAFF WRITER JONATHAN BLITZER.

>>> "AMANPOUR & COMPANY" IS MADE POSSIBLE BY -- THE ANDERSON FAMILY ENDOWMENT.

JIM ATTWOOD AND LESLIE WILLIAMS.

CANDACE KING WEIR.

THE SYLVIA A.

AND SIMON B. POYTA PROGRAMMING ENDOWMENT TO FIGHT ANTISEMITISM.

THE LEILA AND MICKEY STRAUS FAMILY CHARITABLE TRUST.

MARK J. BLECHNER.

THE FILOMEN D'AGOSTINO FOUNDATION.

SETON J. MELVIN.

THE PETER G. PETERSON AND JOAN GANZ COONEY FUND.

CHARLES ROSENBLUM.

KOO AND PATRICIA YUEN.

COMMITTED TO BRIDGING CULTURAL DIFFERENCES IN OUR COMMUNITIES.

BARBARA HOPE ZUCKERBERG AND JEFFREY KATZ AND BETH ROGERS.

AND BY CONTRIBUTIONS TO YOUR PBS STATION FROM VIEWERS LIKE YOU.

THANK YOU.

>>> WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM.

AFTER WHAT FOR THEM WAS A CATHARTIC WEEK IN CHICAGO, THE DEMOCRATS WRAPPED THEIR CONVENTION WITH THE HISTORIC NOMINATION OF VICE PRESIDENT KAMALA HARRIS.

BUT WELL BEFORE THE LAST BALLOON FALLS, DEMOCRATS ARE STEELING THEMSELVES TO A TOUGH FIGHT AHEAD.

FORMER PRESIDENT BILL CLINTON WARNS, YOU SHOULD NEVER UNDERESTIMATE YOUR ADVERSARY.

IN HIS ACCEPTANCE SPEECH, VICE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE TIM WALZ WAS IN FULL COACH MODE.

>> OUR JOB FOR EVERYONE WATCHING IS TO GET IN THE TRENCHES AND DO THE BLOCKING AND TACKLING.

ONE INCH AT A TIME.

ONE YARD AT A TIME.

ONE PHONE CALL AT A TIME.

ONE DOOR KNOCK AT A TIME.

ONE $5 DONATION AT A TIME.

>> HIS FAMILY WAS ALL IN WITH SON GUS EXCLAIMING THAT'S MY DAD.

EVEN AS TIM WALZ WAS EXHORTING AND OPRAH EXTOLLING, NEWS OF A NEW CHALLENGE TO THE DEMOCRATS BROKE AND THAT IS THE BUREAU OF LABOR STATISTICS REPORTS THAT THE ECONOMY CREATED MORE THAN 800,000 FEWER JOBS THAN ORIGINALLY REPORTED.

SO WHAT POLICY AND MESSAGING DOES HARRIS NEED IN THE NEXT 75 DAYS?

STEPHANIE FLANDERS IS THE HEAD OF BLOOMBERG ECONOMICS AND "THE DA VINCI CODE" IS THE DIRECTOR OF U.S. AND AMERICAS PROGRAM CHATHAM HOUSE.

WELCOME BOTH OF YOU TO THE PROGRAM.

SO STEPHANIE, I WANT TO ASK YOU FIRST.

AS WE TALK, YOU ARE AT THE CONVENTION STILL AND IT'S WINDING DOWN.

SO WHAT DO YOU THINK THIS WEEK TOLD YOU AND TOLD AMERICA ABOUT THIS BATTLE FOR THE MANTLE OF CHANGE?

IS IT KAMALA HARRIS OR DO YOU THINK DONALD TRUMP HOLDS THAT CARD AS HE SAYS HE WANTS TO ESSENTIALLY CHANGE THE WHOLE ESTABLISHMENT?

>> I THINK, CERTAINLY, THERE WAS A LOT OF TALK ABOUT 2008.

I LOST COUNT OVER THE COURSE OF THE WEEK THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE TALKING ABOUT AMERICA IS GETTING THEIR HOPE BACK.

IT FEELS LIKE 2008 ALL OVER AGAIN.

THAT IS OBVIOUSLY HOPEFUL FROM THE DEMOCRATIC FAITHFUL.

AT SOME LEVEL, RELATIVE TO THE PREVIOUS LINEUP WE HAD OF PRESIDENT BIDEN AND FORMER PRESIDENT TRUMP, SHE'S CHANGED.

SHE'S THE ONE WHO HASN'T BEEN PRESIDENT BEFORE.

AND SHE ALSO CERTAINLY REPRESENTS THE FIRST WOMAN, OF COLOR, ALL OF THOSE THINGS.

THEY'RE TRYING TO GIVE A SENSE THERE'S CHANGE.

EVERY TIME I'M TALKING TO POLICY ADVISERS AND THIS WAS NOT A WEEK FOR POLICY DETAIL, ALL THE SPEECHES WERE STEERING WELL CLEAR OF THAT.

WHEN YOU TALK TO THOSE ADVISERS, YOU CAN SEE IN THEIR OWN MINDS THEY'RE STRUGGLING WITH THAT MESSAGE.

HOW MUCH OF A CHANGE, HOW MUCH ARE THEY HOLDING ON TO THE LEGACY OF THE BIDEN YEARS WHICH THEY CONSIDER TO HAVE BEEN A SUCCESS EVEN IF A LOT OF VOTERS DO NOT.

>> SO THAT'S REALLY INTERESTING THE WAY YOU SAY THEY SKIRTED AND STEERED CAREFULLY AWAY FROM CONCRETE POLICY.

WE'LL GET INTO THAT.

IT IS REALLY VITAL.

FIRST, LESLIE, I WANT TO ASK YOU.

APART FROM THE GENERATIONAL DIFFERENCE THAT KAMALA HARRIS DOES REPRESENT NOW, SHE IS MUCH YOUNGER THAN DONALD TRUMP.

THERE IS ALSO THE GENDER ISSUE.

I'M REALLY INTERESTED IN WHAT YOU TWEETED ABOUT THE CONVENTION.

WE'RE GOING TO PUT THAT UP.

BASICALLY, HOW NORMAL IT IS TO SEE, YOU KNOW, TO SEE A WOMAN NOW.

JUST TAKE A MOMENT.

THERE IS A WOMAN SITTING, WAITING TO SPEAK ON THURSDAY.

HER DAD FROM JAMAICA, HER MOM FROM INDIA, AND SHE'S LEADING THE POLLS TO BE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND IT DOES IT THOUGH, LESLIE?

>> LOOK, IT IS FOR MANY PEOPLE GOING TO BE A VERY HARD DECISION TO MAKE.

AT THE CONVENTION, YES, IT SEEMS NORMAL.

SHE'S A WOMAN.

SHE'S CLEARLY AMERICAN.

SHE'S VERY AMERICAN.

THAT IMMIGRANT GROUNLD IS VERY STRONG BUT SHE'S ALL AMERICAN, FROM CALIFORNIA.

SHE'S GOT A VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE IN TIM WALZ FROM NEBRASKA.

MY HOME STATE, WHO COULDN'T BE MORE OF AN ALL-AMERICAN COACH, DAD, ARMY NATIONAL GUARD.

SO I THINK THERE IS A BALANCE HERE.

THERE IS A SENSE OF IT BEING NORMAL, OF THE STYLE OF COMMUNICATION BEING NONELITIST.

AND I THINK THIS IS REALLY CRITICAL WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT THE LAST FEMALE TO RUN, HILLARY CLINTON WAS REALLY ATTACKED AS BEING PART OF THE ESTABLISHMENT AND VERY MUCH AN ELITIST.

I THINK THE RHETORIC AND THE DISCOURSE COMING OUT OF THIS CAMPAIGN IS REALLY AIMED AT BEING SOMETHING VERY DIFFERENT.

VERY EVERYDAY.

VERY MUCH ABOUT NEIGHBORS, EVERYDAY AMERICA.

NONELITIST.

SO IT HAS A FEELING OF NORMAL.

YOU'RE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT.

A LOT OF PEOPLE WHEN THEY ARE ULTIMATELY FACED WITH THAT DECISION IN NOVEMBER, WE SAY IT'S ABOUT THE ECONOMY.

WE SAY IT'S ABOUT PRICES AND INFLATION.

WE SAY IT'S ABOUT REPRODUCTIVE RIGHTS BUT TIME AND AGAIN, IT IS CAN I IMAGINE THAT PERSON REPRESENTING ME?

AND THAT IS A DIFFICULT ASK FOR A LOT OF AMERICANS, ESPECIALLY THOSE AMERICANS THAT WILL SWING THIS ELECTION.

>> IT'S REALLY FASCINATING.

BILL CLINTON HAD HIS MOMENT ON THE STAGE AND HE DID ADDRESS THE ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM THAT WE HAVE A LOT OF WORK IN HIS WORDS TO DO, IF THE DEMOCRATS ARE GOING TO WIN, AND THE ECONOMY HAS TO STAY FRONT AND CENTER.

I'M GOING TO PLAY A SOUNDBITE FROM HIS SPEECH WHERE HE TALKS ABOUT WHO HISTORICALLY HAS CREATED THE MOST JOBS FOR AMERICANS.

TAKE A LISTEN.

>> SINCE THE END OF THE COLD WAR IN 1989, AMERICA HAS CREATED ABOUT 51 MILLION NEW JOBS.

I SWEAR, I CHECKED THIS THREE TIMES.

EVEN I COULDN'T BELIEVE IT.

WHAT IS THE SCORE?

DEMOCRATS, 50, REPUBLICANS, 1.

>> STEPHANIE, DO THE DEMOCRATS HAVE A NATURAL TRUST WHEN IT COMES TO THE ECONOMY GIVEN THOSE FIGURES?

>> YOU KNOW, THE ECONOMIC CYCLE OBVIOUSLY HAS A LOT TO DO WITH IT.

EVEN AS WE SPEAK NOW, THERE IS A BIG MEETING OF THE GREAT CENTRAL BANKERS IN JACKSON HOLE IN WYOMING WHERE PROBABLY THEY'LL BE TALKING ABOUT THINGS THAT COULD POTENTIALLY AFFECT THE GLOBAL ECONOMY.

CERTAINLY THE ECONOMIC TERRAIN OF THE ELECTION MORE THAN ANYTHING THAT HAPPENED HERE IN CHICAGO THIS WEEK.

I MEAN, I HAVE NOT GONE BACK AND CHECKED THAT A FOURTH TIME, THE NUMBERS.

I DO KNOW THAT HE WAS INCREDIBLY PROUD OF JOB CREATION UNDER HIS WATCH.

I SUSPECT IF YOU START THAT NUMBER FROM THE 1980s, YOU MIGHT GET A SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT PICTURE.

THE DEMOCRATIC ADMINISTRATIONS HAVE BEEN IN REASON YEARS, ADMINISTRATIONS WHERE YOU SAW RELATIVELY STRONG ECONOMIC GROWTH.

CERTAINLY UNDER THE CLINTON YEARS.

THEY WERE PERIODS OF LOW INFLATION AS WELL AS JOB CREATION.

I THINK WHAT HAS FRUSTRATED THE BIDEN TEAM, IN THE LAST FEW YEARS, THEY FEEL LIKE THEY HAVE A LOT OF GOOD THINGS TO SAY CERTAINLY ON THE JOB CREATION FRONT.

THE LEGACY OF INFLATION WHICH IS EVERY WEEK, EVEN THOUGH THE HEADLINE NUMBER HAS GONE BACK DOWN, I THINK THEY UNDERESTIMATED THAT WOULD LINGER WITH VOTERS.

WE'VE SEEN THAT ALL OVER THE WORLD.

CERTAINLY THIS IS SOMETHING HARRIS IS STRUGGLING WITH.

IN HER SPEECH WHERE SHE STARTED TO LAY OUT HER PROPOSALS, THE FIRST HALF WAS STILL SOUNDING A BIT LIKE PRESIDENT BIDEN SAYING YOU SHOULD FEEL BETTER ABOUT THE ECONOMY THAN YOU DO.

LISTEN TO THESE GREAT NUMBERS.

SHE THEN THAT I HAVE HAD TO SAY WE KNOW THAT PEOPLE ARE STILL HURTING.

I THINK THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO TILT THAT BALANCE EVEN FURTHER OVER THE NEXT FEW WEEKS IF THEY REALLY WANT TO SPEAK TO THIS SLIVER OF UNDECIDEDED VOTERS IN PLACES LIKE PENNSYLVANIA.

>> AND OBVIOUSLY, UNDECIDEDS INCLUDE YOUNG PEOPLE AS WELL.

AND YOUR REFLECTION ON THE ENERGY AND THE YOUTH ENGAGEMENT AT THE DNC, WHAT DO YOU THINK THAT SAID?

>> WELL, THERE'S TREMENDOUS ENERGY -- >> LESLIE?

>> TREMENDOUS ENERGY AMONGST YOUNG VOTERS.

THE ENTHUSIASM GAP.

WHAT WE SAW WHEN PRESIDENT BIDEN WAS THE NOMINEE RUNNING AGAINST DONALD TRUMP.

THE ENTHUSIASM, THE INTEREST IN THIS ELECTION HAD REALLY JUST GONE THROUGH THE FLOOR.

IT WAS REALLY QUITE A DIRE SITUATION ACROSS THE COUNTRY AND ESPECIALLY FOR THE DEMOCRATS.

AND WILL THAT HAS REALLY CHANGED.

AND PART OF THAT IS UNDOUBTEDLY THE 18 TO 29-YEAR-OLDS, THAT CATEGORY THAT WE MEASURE AS YOUNG VOTERS ARE VERY ENERGIZED.

THE USE OF SOCIAL MEDIA IN THIS CAMPAIGN IS VERY SOPHISTICATED SO FAR.

AND WE CAN EXPECT THE MOBILIZATION TO BE SIGNIFICANT.

WHETHER WE ARE TALKING GOING THE ECONOMY, INFLATION, JOB CREATION, NONE OF IT MATTERS AT THE AGGREGATE LEVEL.

WHAT MATTERS IS HOW IT BREAKS DOWN FOR YOUNG VOTERS AND ESPECIALLY HOW IT BREAKS DOWN FOR THOSE TARGET VOTERS IN THOSE SWING STATES.

AND THAT'S WHAT THE BIG PLAY IS GOING TO HAVE TO BE FOR.

>> LET'S TALK A LITTLE ABOUT DONALD TRUMP AND SORT OF THE FAKES THAT HAVE BEEN GOING AROUND.

THERE IS THIS FAKE THING CREATED BY PAIRKS SHOWED KAMALA HARRIS AT A RALLY.

THE FAKE BANGER USING THE FAMOUS, UNCLE SAM WANTS YOU TO VOTE FOR DONALD TRUMP USING TAYLOR SWIFT.

STEPHANIE, YOU'RE THERE.

WHAT DO YOU THINK THE EFFECT OF THAT IS IN TODAY'S WORLD WHERE SO MANY GET THEIR MESSAGING AND INFO FROM SOCIAL MEDIA?

>> WELL, I THINK IT'S INTERESTING.

WE'VE HAD SEVERAL WEEKS WHERE I WOULD SAY THE GROUND GAME, THE NEW VERSION OF THE GROUND GAME WHICH IS FOUGHT ON SOCIAL MEDIA, THE HARRIS CAMPAIGN HAD BEEN WINNING HANDS-DOWN.

THE MEMES, ALL THE THINGS THAT YOU'VE TALKED ABOUT MANY TIMES.

CERTAINLY IN TERMS OF THE YOUNG PEOPLE.

AND I HAVE BEEN STRUCK, MY COLLEAGUES AT BLOOMBERG WHO ARE MUCH MORE KNEE-DEEP IN SEEING SOMETHING, AI OR TROLLING.

MOST ARE FAILING TO GAIN TRACTION WHEN YOU LOOK AT HOW MANY LIKES THEY'RE GETTING.

HOW MANY TIMES THEY'RE GETTING RETWEETED.

THERE'S BEEN QUITE A LOT TO SUGGEST THAT KAMALA HARRIS IS AN ALCOHOLIC WITH FRANKLY RATHER ABSURD FAKE PHOTOS.

THEY HAVE NOT GAINED THE KIND OF TRACTION THAT YOU MIGHT HAVE FEARED.

BUT CLEARLY, THERE WILL BE ONE THAT DOES GET THROUGH.

AND IT GOES TO THE RELATIVELY URGENT NEED, IF YOU'RE SITTING ON THE DEMOCRAT SIDE, TO ESTABLISH YOUR MESSAGE EARLY.

SO PEOPLE ARE PREINOCULATED.

THEY SEE THIS STUFF AND IT DOESN'T RING TRUE BECAUSE THEY ALREADY HAVE AN IDEA IN THEIR HEAD OF WHAT IT REPRESENTS AND WHO SHE IS.

>> I'M GOING TO PLAY THIS SOUNDBITE.

IT GOES TO TRUMP'S HISTORIC NASTINESS, PARTICULARLY WHEN IT COME TO WOMEN.

AND THIS IS TALKING ABOUT KAMALA HARRIS IN A VERY QUOTE, UNQUOTE TRASHY WAY.

>> IT REMINDS ME, THERE WAS THIS BAG THAT A VERY FAMOUS DESIGNER DESIGNED.

THIS WAS SEVERAL YEARS AGO.

IT WAS LITERALLY A TRASH BAG.

THEY SOLD IT FOR LIKE $2,000 THINKING PEOPLE WOULD BUY IT.

IT'S A SIMILAR SITUATION WITH KAMALA HARRIS.

>> I MEAN, IT IS IN FACT GROTESQUE, THAT KIND OF PERSONAL ATTACK.

DO YOU THINK THE SORT OF STATUTE OF LIMITATIONS ON TRUMP'S NICKNAMES, THE NASTY WORDS HE CALLS PEOPLE, EVEN PEOPLE HAVE SAID HE'S LOSING HIS SENSE OF HUMOR.

DO YOU THINK THAT THAT IS PAST ITS SELL-BY DATE NOW?

>> NO.

THIS IS AGAIN AN ELECTION WHERE PEOPLE ARE LARGELY LOCKED IN TO THEIR CANDIDATE, ESPECIALLY PEOPLE WHO SUPPORT DONALD TRUMP.

I THINK THE CONCERN, THERE ARE VERY FEW, WE TALK ABOUT UNDECIDED VOTERS.

THERE ARE VERY FEW UNDECIDED VOTERS.

THEY'RE UNDECIDED ABOUT WHETHER THEY WILL VOTE.

MY CONCERN WITH THE DEEP FAKES, THE NASTINESS, THE RHETORIC, IS THAT IT MIGHT CAUSE CONCERN AMONGST SOME VOTERS WHO WOULD OTHERWISE GET OUT OF BED AND VOTE FOR KAMALA HARRIS.

THEY MIGHT DECIDE, NOT SO SURE.

I'LL JUST STAY HOME.

AND THAT I THINK IS THE REAL CONCERN.

ONE OF THE LINES THAT SIT POTENTIALLY THE MOST DANGEROUS IS THIS ATTEMPT TO FRAME HER AS AS SOCIALIST, AS A COMMUNIST.

I HAVE HEARD IN MY CONVERSATIONS WITH WHAT WE MIGHT CALL WORKING CLASS AMERICANS, MIDDLE CLASS, WHOSE INTERESTS ARE BEING REPRESENTED TO THE EXTENT THAT WE KNOW KAMALA HARRIS'S ECONOMIC POLICIES, THEIR INTERESTS ARE BEING REPRESENTED AND THEY ARE CONCERNED THAT SHE'S GIVING AWAY THE STORE FOR FREE.

SO SOME OF THAT ATTEMPT TO FRAME HER AS SOCIALIST IS, MIGHT WORK.

AND THAT I THINK WILL BE A VERY TRICKY AND IMPORTANT AVENUE THAT PERSUADING PEOPLE THAT YOU CAN DO THINGS FOR PEOPLE, THAT YOU CAN GIVE THEM $25,000 TOWARD THEIR FIRST HOUSE AND IT WON'T TANK THE ECONOMY.

THAT IS REALLY A BIG CHALLENGE, I THINK, GOING FORWARD.

>> AND STEPHANIE, I HAVE TO ASK YOU.

I KNOW A FRIVOLOUS QUESTION, OR IS IT?

WHAT IS THE OBSESSION WITH THE TAN SUIT?

KAMALA HARRIS TURNED UP IN THAT THE FIRST NIGHT.

IT'S BY A GREAT DESIGNER.

THEN WE HAVE BARACK OBAMA IN HIS TAN SUIT FROM YEARS AGO.

WHAT IS GOING ON?

WHY DOES THAT MATTER?

>> I COULD ASK YOU THE SAME QUESTION.

WHY WOULD YOU EVEN ASK ME ABOUT IT?

>> YOU'RE RIGHT.

WHY AM I ASKING YOU?

>> IT WAS SLIGHTLY BIGGER OUTSIDE.

NOT THE SUIT BUT THE DISCUSSION.

I'M REFLECTING ON THAT.

BUT ALSO, ON WHAT YOU'VE BEEN SAYING.

DO YOU THINK SHE WAS TROLLING?

>> YOU MENTIONED TAYLOR SWIFT.

I KNOW FROM MY VERY OBSESSIVE SWIFTY DAUGHTER THAT THERE'S A WHOLE LOT OF DIFFERENT LEVELS THAT GO ON ON SOCIAL MEDIA IN TERMS OF WHAT THEY CALL CLOWNING, LITTLE CLUES, AND YOU NEVER REALLY KNOW WHETHER YOU'RE JUST READING WAY TOO MUCH INTO A DRESS THAT SHE WORE OR A PARTICULAR BROACH OR WHETHER IT IS PART OF SOME SECRET LANGUAGE.

IT ALL INVOLVES PEOPLE TALKING ABOUT KAMALA HARRIS AND TALKING ABOUT HER LOOKING PRETTY GREAT.

OFFICIAL THAT'S THE WORST THAT WE GET, THE DEMOCRATS WILL BE DOING PRETTY WELL.

>> COULD WE JUST FOR THE RECORD SAY PLENTY OF REPUBLICANS HAVE WORN TAN SUITS.

THEY LOOK GREAT.

TAN SUITS ARE GREAT.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

>>> NOW, WHILE THE ECONOMY IS THE TOP ISSUE FOR VOTERS, IMMIGRATION ISN'T FAR BEHIND.

WE HEARD YESTERDAY FROM EL PASO CONGRESSWOMAN VERONICA ESCOBAR, AND NOW THE STAFF WRITER FOR THE NEW YORKERS JONATHAN BLITZER IS TALKING GOING WHY KAMALA HARRIS AND WHY BORDER POLICY IS SUCH A VEXING PROBLEM IN THE UNITED STATES.

>> THANK YOU.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US US.

LET'S TALK ABOUT IMMIGRATION.

YOU'VE BEEN REPORTING ON THIS FOR QUITE SOME TIME.

YOU'VE HAD A RECENT PIECE, THE REAL STORY ON KAMALA HARRIS IN THE NEW YORKER.

FROM THE TRUMP SIDE, PEOPLE WHO SUPPORT THE PRESIDENT, THEY ARE LABELING KAMALA HARRIS AS THE BORDER CZAR.

A FAILED ONE, AN EFFECTIVE ONE.

IS THAT FAIR?

>> IN A WORD, NO.

IN A WORD IT'S INACCURATE.

THE REASON FOR IT IS FIRST OF ALL THAT THE VICE PRESIDENT WAS NEVER IN CHARGE OF THE BORDER.

IN FACT, THERE IS NO ONE WHO EVER HAD A TITLE QUITE LIKE THE ONE REPUBLICANS WISH EXISTED THAT WOULD ALLOW IT TO SHIFT TO A SINGLE PERSON.

WHAT THEY WERE RESPONSIBLE FOR IN THE EARLY YEARS OF THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION WAS TO CAUSE ROOT CAUSES, THREE COUNTRIES IN CENTRAL AMERICA, GUATEMALA, EL SALVADOR AND HONDURAS THAT HAVE HISTORICALLY SENT LARGE NUMBER OF FAMILY TO THE SOUTHERN BORDER.

SO SHE WAS IN CHARGE OF THE FRANKLY RATHER THANKLESS TASK OF NEEDING TO ADDRESS SOME OF THE UNDERLYING REASONS WHY PEOPLE WERE FLEEING THEIR HOMES IN SUCH LARGE NUMBERS.

AS A POLITICAL MATTER, IT IS A DREADED SUBJECT FOR SOMEONE WITH BROADER POLITICAL AMBITIONS.

ON A GOOD DAY, IF YOU'RE ABLE TO CUT THROUGH ALL THE COMPLEX POLICY QUESTIONS, ALL THE COMPLEX REGIONAL, POLITICAL QUESTIONS, YOU'RE LOOKING AT THE WORK OF YEARS, IF NOT DECADES, TO BEGIN TO IMPROVE CONDITIONS ON THE GROUND THAT WOULD FUNDAMENTALLY CHANGE PEOPLE'S CALCULUS TO WHETHER OR NOT THEY WANT TO STAY HOME OR LEAVE THE UNITED STATES.

SO IT'S VERY HARD TO GET ENGAGED IN THAT WORK AND TO HAVE AN IMMEDIATE, TANGIBLE DEMONSTRATION OF SUCCESS.

AND THEN THE OTHER COMPLICATING FACTOR HAS BEEN IN THE LAST COUPLE OF YEARS, THERE'S BEEN A PROFOUND SHIFT IN WHO IS ARRIVING AT THE U.S. SOUTHERN BORDER.

NOW IT IS A MUCH MORE GLOBAL POPULATION.

IT WAS A KIND OF DOUBLY THANKLESS JOB.

IT WAS AGAIN QUITE COMPLEX ON A GOOD DAY.

NOW THE GLOBAL FORCES DRIVING MASS MIGRATION ARE SO MUCH MORE VARIED AND INTERNATIONAL, IT IS NOT ENOUGH JUST TO BE CENTERED ON CENTRAL AMERICA.

ALL OF THEM, THE MIXED BAG OF THE IMMIGRATION POLICIES, AND IT DOESN'T LAND.

>> WHEN YOU LOOK AT HOW THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION TRIES TO CONTRAST ITSELF WITH WHAT HAS BEEN HAPPENING ON THE BORDER IN THE PAST TWO YEARS VERSUS, SAY, THE LAST TWO YEARS OF THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION, WHAT ARE THEY GETTING RIGHT?

WHAT ARE THEY GETTING WRONG?

>> THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION DID NOT HAVE SUCCESS IN MANAGING NUMBER AT THE BORDER QUITE LIKE THEY WANT YOU TO THINK THEY DID.

THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION ATTEMPTED SOME OF THE MOST MONSTROUS POLICIES WE'VE EVER SEEN AT THE SOUTHERN BORDER.

MOST ESPECIALLY SEPARATING FAMILY IN AN EFFORT TO DISCOURAGE PEOPLE.

THAT WAS 2018.

IN 2019 YOU HAD THE LARGEST BORDER ARRIVALS IN YEARS.

ULTIMATELY WHAT ALLOWED THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION TO CLAIM SUCCESS AT THE SOUTHERN BORDER, IN SO FAR AS THEY FELT LIKE THEY HAD STEMMED THE TIDE OF ARRIVALS WAS A COMBINATION OF THINGS.

A BIG FACTOR WAS THE PANDEMIC.

SO THAT WAS A VERY UNIQUE HISTORICAL CIRCUMSTANCE.

I THINK WHAT IS REALLY TROUBLED THEIR CASE AGAINST THE CURRENT ADMINISTRATION IS THE FACT THAT IN THE LAST YEAR, THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION HAS, I THINK, REALLY THAT I HAVE HAD MUCH MORE FORCEFUL ON THE BORDER ISSUE.

AND AS YOU KNOW, THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION HAD BACKED THIS SENATE NEGOTIATION, A BIPARTISAN SENATE NEGOTIATION THAT WAS BASICALLY WILLING TO REALLY SUBSTANTIALLY OVERHAUL HOW ASYLUM WORKED AT THE SOUTHERN BORDER.

IT WAS WRITTEN BY ONE OF THE MOST CONSERVATIVE MEMBERS OF THE SENATE.

AND WHAT HAPPENED WAS AS THIS BILL EMERGED IN FEBRUARY OF THIS YEAR, REPUBLICANS GOT WORD FROM TRUMP HIMSELF THAT HE WANTED THEM TO SABOTAGE THE DEAL BECAUSE IT WAS SUCH A POTENT CAMPAIGN ISSUE FOR THEM.

SO THE DEMOCRATS EVER SINCE PITCHED THEMSELVES AS THE PARTY ACTUALLY WILLING TO BE TOUGH AND PRACTICAL AT THE SOUTHERN BORDER WHEN IT COME TO ISSUES WHILE THEY ARE ANILISTIC ABOUT THAT, BROADER VALUES.

THEY'RE JUST IN IT FOR THE CYNICISM.

I THINK REPUBLICANS IN THAT SENSE HAVE AN UPHILL BATTLE IN PROVING THAT THEY SUBSTANTIALLY CARE ABOUT THE ISSUE.

>> I WONDER IF THE DEMOCRATS ARE SEEING A SIGNIFICANT PUSHBACK FROM THE MORE PROGRESSIVE WING WITH THE KIND OF RHETORIC THAT THEY'RE USING AND MAYBE THE POLICY THAT ADVOCATING FOR.

HEY, YOU'RE BEHAVING AND ADVOCATING WAYS THAT ARE INHUMANE OR UNCOMPASSIONATE.

>> I'M GLAD YOU MENTIONED THAT.

IT'S BEEN EXTREMELY STRIKING TO ME.

HERE AT THE CONVENTION AND IN GENERAL IN THE CAMPAIGN LANDSCAPE RIGHT NOW HOW MUTED THIS ISSUE HAS BEEN AMONG DEMOCRATS, PARTICULARLY THE MORE PROGRESSIVE BACKED.

I THINK THERE'S A WIDESPREAD CONSENSUS IN THE PARTY THAT IS ASYLUM SYSTEM HAS SORT OF BEEN OVERTAKEN AT THIS POINT BY DYSFUNCTION, BY POLITICAL ATTACKS.

THAT IT IS NOT WORKING THE WAY IT'S SUPPOSED TO WORK.

AND I REALLY THINK THIS HAS BEEN A MARKED SHIFT SINCE I WOULD SAY THE SUMMER OF 2022 WHEN THE GOVERNOR OF TEXAS STARTED BUSING MIGRANTS IN HUGE NUMBER TO DEMOCRATIC CITIES ACROSS THE COUNTRY, DOING IT WITHOUT COORDINATING WITHOUT LOCAL OR STATE AUTHORITIES.

YOU HAVE SEEN A REAL RECOGNITION INSIDE THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY THAT SOMETHING HAS TO BE DONE WITH ASYLUM.

IT HAS TO BE RECKONED WITH, THIS ISSUE, IN SOME FORM OR ANOTHER.

SO THERE IS LESS DISSENSION THAN THERE EVER HAS BEEN WHEN IT COME TO THE BORDER.

BUT THE WAY THAT IT IS FELT, GO THE WAY IN WHICH IT TROUBLES THE MOST IS THE DEGREE TO WHICH IT HAS EFFECTIVELY HIJACKED THE BROADER CONVERSATION ABOUT IMMIGRATION IN AMERICA.

A LOT OF THE OTHER KEY PRIORITIES FOR DEMOCRATS HAVE EFFECTIVELY FALLEN OUT OF THE CONVERSATION.

IT IS VERY FASCINATING TO SEE.

A MAJOR POLICY WENT INTO EFFECT.

A REALLY LAUDABLE EFFORT TO UNDOCUMENTED SPOUSES OF U.S. CITIZENS.

HALF A MILLION OF THEM, TO REGULARIZE THEIR STATUS.

THIS IS THE BIGGEST RELIEF EFFORT FROM A U.S. ADMINISTRATION SINCE DACA IN 2012.

IT LITERALLY WENT INTO EFFECT THE DAY THE CONVENTION STARTED.

THIS IS A HUGE WIN FOR IMMIGRANT FAMILIES ACROSS THE COUNTRY.

AND IT BARELY GOT MENTIONED IF AT ALL.

INSTEAD WHAT GOT MENTIONED WAS THE BORDER AND HOW THE NUMBER HAVE DROPPED.

AND THEY HAVE DROPPED.

BUT THAT HAS BEEN THE STRENGTH.

>> HOW DO YOU THINK THE CRITIQUES FROM THE LEFT AND THE RIGHT HAVE SHAPED KAMALA HARRIS'S THINKING ABOUT WHAT SHE WILL EVENTUALLY DO IF SHE'S ELECTED PRESIDENT?

>> I THINK THE VICE PRESIDENT IS SORT OF LAUNCHING HERSELF AS A PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE AT A, AT AN INTERESTING MOMENT IN THE ART OF THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION'S EVOLVING APPROACH TO IMMIGRATION AND THE BORDER.

THE ADMINISTRATION HAS HIT A SWEET SPOT RHETORICALLY, ANYWAY.

ALSO IN TERMS OF POLICY.

BUT THEY'VE MANAGED TO HAVE A THEORY OF THE CASE THAT THEY CAN ARTICULATE.

THE THEORY OF THE CASE IS THAT WE HAVE TO BE MUCH TOUGHER ON ASYLUM SEEKERS WHEN THEY ARE CROSSING IN BETWEEN PORTS OF ENTRY.

IN OTHER WORDS, WHEN THEY'RE PASSING ILLEGALLY.

WHEN THEY'RE NOT PRESENTING THEMSELVES FOR ENTRY.

AT THE SAME TIME THE ADMINISTRATION SAYS IT'S OKAY.

WE'RE NOT CLOSING THE DOOR ON PEOPLE IN DESPERATE NEED TO ARRIVE TO COME INTO THE UNITED STATES.

WE'RE CREATING OTHER LEGAL CHANNELS TO DO SO.

THEY ARE ALLOWING PEOPLE TO USE AN APP TO SCHEDULE THE ACTUAL DATE AND TIME THAT THEY ARRIVE AT THE SOUTHERN BORDER SO IT IS MORE ORDERLY AND MANAGEABLE WHEN THEY ARRIVE.

THE ADMINISTRATION HAS CREATED A PAROLE PROGRAM WHICH IS VERY SUBSTANTIAL, VERY SIGNIFICANT, IN WHICH THEY BASICALLY ALLOW 30,000 MIGRANTS A MONTH TO ALLOW THEM TO COME INTO THE COUNTRY IF THEY HAVE A SPONSOR IN THE UNITED STATES.

THIS HAS BEEN HELD UP AND YOU THE EFFECTS HAVE BEEN SIGNIFICANT.

THE NUMBER OF RIVALS AT THE SOUTHERN BORDER HAVE DROPPED BY 90% AS A RESULT OF THE ADMINISTRATION CREATING OTHER LEGAL NEWS FOR PEOPLE IN THE COUNTRY.

SO HARRIS HAS DIFFERENT WAYS WITH THIS ISSUE.

WE HAVE TO BE TOUGH AT THE SOUTHERN BORDER.

WE HAVE TO BE ORDERLY BUT WE HAVE TO CREATE OTHER NEWS FOR PEOPLE TO ENTER LEGALLY.

I THINK THAT IS ACTUALLY A FAIRLY COMPELLING ARGUMENT AND I THINK IT IS ONE THAT SHE HAS MADE.

AND THEN COUPLED WITH ALL THAT IS THE FACT THAT REPUBLICANS HAD THIS BILL EARLIER IN THE YEAR SO DEMOCRATS HAVE THE CLAIM, LOOK, WE WANT TO DEAL WITH THIS ISSUE.

THEY DON'T.

>> IN BOTH REPORTING FOR THE NEW YORKER AS WELL AS YOUR BOOK THAT IS CALLED "EVERYONE WHO IS GONE IS HERE," YOU LOOK MORE DEEPLY INTO THE ROOT CAUSES OF WHAT IS PROPELLING PEOPLE TO LEAVE THEIR COUNTRIES AND TRY TO GET INTO THE UNITED STATES, AND ALSO THE POLICIES OF U.S. POLICY AND HOW WE DEAL WITH THAT.

FOR EXAMPLE, YOU WRITE ABOUT DEPORTATIONS AND WHAT THAT ACTUALLY ENDED UP DOING TO GANG VIOLENCE IN THOSE COUNTRIES WHICH SORT OF GOES BACK INTO FEEDING THAT CYCLE WHICH IS WHEN YOU CREATE MORE UNSAFE AND UNSTABLE PLACES, PEOPLE HAVE A TENDENCY TO WANT TO LEAVE THOSE PLACES TOWARD SAFETY.

WHICH MIGHT BE THE U.S. BORDER, RIGHT?

>> MY BOOK, A LOT OF MY REPORTING HAS BEEN ABOUT THE UNITED STATES AND CENTRAL AMERICA.

YOU CAN SEE SUCH DRAMATIC WAYS, THE INTERCONNECTEDNESS OF THE U.S.

IN THE REGION TO SAY THAT IT ALMOST CAN'T ACCOUNT FOR.

ALL OF THESE POINTS OF CONNECTION ARE JUST A FACT OF LIFE.

BUT ONE OF THE REASONS WHY THEY'RE PART OF THIS LANDSCAPE IS BECAUSE OF THE HISTORY OF U.S. POLICY.

U.S. FOREIGN POLICY IN CENTRAL AMERICA.

U.S. FOREIGN POLICY IN RESPONSE TO DOMESTIC POLITICAL PRESSURES.

IT FUNDAMENTALLY CHANGES THE WORLD IN WHICH WE LIVE AND IT FUNDAMENTALLY CHANGES PEOPLE'S NEED TO LEAVE.

NO ONE WANTS TO LEAVE HOME.

THEY LEAVE BECAUSE THEY DON'T HAVE A CHOICE.

THE U.S. AND CENTRAL AMERICA, IT'S AN ESPECIALLY DRAMATIC EXAMPLE.

THROUGH THE 1980s THERE WERE CIVIL WARS RAGING THROUGHOUT CENTRAL AMERICA.

THE U.S. INTERVENED BECAUSE OF THE COLD WAR NFL.

YOU HAVE THE UNITED STATES SUPPORTING SUPPRESSIVE REGIMES IN THE REGION THAT WERE DRIVING PEOPLE TO LEAVE BECAUSE THEY WERE GETTING BRUTALIZED AND THEY ARE ARMING THE GOVERNMENTS TO PROVIDE, AND THEN WHEN PEOPLE ARRIVE AT THE BORDER, THE U.S.

IN A DISCRIMINATORY WAY REJECTED ALL OF THE CLAIM OF PEOPLE COMING FROM CENTRAL AMERICA.

TO ACKNOWLEDGE THEM WOULD BE ACKNOWLEDGING AMERICAN COMPLICITY IN THIS VIOLENCE.

THEN YOU FAST FORWARD A DECADE AND YOU HAVE THE CRIME IN AMERICA RESULTING IN MASS DEPORTATION OF PEOPLE WHO ARE HARDENED IN THE CITY LIKE LOS ANGELES.

IT LED TO A GANG CULTURE IN CENTRAL AMERICA.

THE GANG CULTURE THAT REALLY BEGAN IN THE UNITED STATES.

WE FAST FORWARD TO 2016, SAY, WHEN YOU HAVE SOMEONE LIKE DONALD TRUMP TALKING ABOUT THE GANG MS 13 LIKE IT IS A HOUSEHOLD NAME.

IT IS FASCINATING FOR PEOPLE TO KNOW GO THE HISTORY.

IT BEGAN IN LOS ANGELES IN THE 1980s AND TURNED AGAINST IMMIGRANTS EVERYWHERE BY A DEMAGOGUE WHO WANTS TO MAKE IT SEEM LIKE THESE GANGS BEGAN AND ARE CONVERGING ON AMERICA AS THOUGH AMERICA DIDN'T HAVE A PART IN ALL THIS.

>> HOW DO YOU THINK THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION, IF THERE IS A SECOND TRUMP ADMINISTRATION, WOULD DEAL WITH THIS?

YOU'VE SEEN SOME OF THE ADVISERS CALL FOR USING FEDERAL TROOPS OR MASS DEPORTATIONS.

YOU'VE SEEN EFFORTS DETAILED IN THE PROJECT 2025 DOCUMENTS THAT HAVE BEEN FLOATING AROUND.

WHAT DO YOU SEE AS THE KIND OF POTENTIAL, I GUESS, LEGAL INTERNATIONAL RAMIFICATIONS IF THE SECOND TRUMP ADMINISTRATION WAS ABLE TO CARRY THE POLICIES OUT?

>> SO OBVIOUSLY, THE MAGA MOVEMENT, TRUMP WORLD, PEOPLE WHO ARE QUITE INFLUENTIAL IN THE SECOND TRUMP ADMINISTRATION HAVE SPOKEN VERY EXPLICITLY ABOUT PLANS TO, YOU KNOW, ARREST PEOPLE IN HUGE NUMBER, TO HOLD PEOPLE ACROSS THE COUNTRY.

I THINK IT IS IMPORTANT TO TAKE THESE PEOPLE AT THEIR WORD WHEN THEY SPEAK THIS WAY.

I FEEL COMPELLED BECAUSE I CAN THINK IMMEDIATELY OF ALL THE COMPLICATING FACTORS, THE RESOURCE RESTRAINTS, THE AGENCY AND INSTITUTIONAL HOLD-UPS, SOME OF THE LEGAL CHALLENGES THAT WOULD OBVIOUSLY ARISE IF THE ADMINISTRATION WITH THESE POLICIES.

SO I DON'T THINK IT IS A CLEAR OUTLINE.

IT IS HARD TO KNOW WHAT IT WOULD LOOK LIKE.

THE FACT THAT THIS IS SUCH A FUNDAMENTAL VIEW OF TRUMP AND OF THE PEOPLE IN HIS ORBIT HAS TO BE RECKONED WITH BECAUSE YOU HAVE SUCH A LARGE UNDOCUMENTED POPULATION IN THE UNITED STATES.

IMMIGRATION ENFORCEMENT HAS A LOT OF DISCRETION IN TERMS OF WHO THE GOVERNMENT GOES AFTER.

ONE OF THE THINGS YOU SEE, PARTICULARLY IN THE SECOND AFTER OF THE OBAMA YEARS ON WITH DEMOCRATS IS THE DESIRE TO EXERCISE MUCH MORE DISCRETION IN WHO THE GOVERNMENT TARGETS.

I THINK THE SCARIEST THING ABOUT THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION, PARTICULARLY A TRUMP ADMINISTRATION 2.0, SO TO SPEAK, IS THAT THERE WILL BE NO PRIORITIES FOR WHO THE GOVERNMENT TARGETS FOR ARREST.

IT WOULD BE A FREE-FOR-ALL.

I THINK THAT'S A VERY SCARY PROSPECT.

IT MEANS ANYONE COULD BE TARGETED AND IT CERTAINLY MEANS THAT RACIAL PROFILING IS A KEY PART OF WHAT IMMIGRATION ENFORCEMENT INCREASINGLY LOOKS LIKE.

SO RIGHT NOW AGENCIES LIKE I.C.E.

HAVE GUIDING PRINCIPLES, FOR INSTANCE, WHERE THEY CAN'T MAKE ARRESTS.

SCHOOLS, CHURCHES, HOSPITALS.

I THINK THAT WILL BE THROWN OUT THE WINDOW.

THE IDEA THAT THERE ARE MITIGATING FACTORS FOR HOW TO CONSIDER SOMEONE'S IMMIGRATION CASE, IF THEY HAVE FAMILY THAT DEPENDS ON THEM, IF THEY'VE BEEN HERE A LONG TIME.

THAT WILL BE THROWN RIGHT OUT THE WINDOW.

SO I THINK THE RANDOMNESS THAT EVERYONE WILL HAVE TO LOOK OVER THEIR SHOULDER BECAUSE THE GOVERNMENT WILL COME AFTER THEM RANDOMLY IN ANY WAY IS AMONG THE SCARIEST, SOME OF THE PLANS YOU'VE HEARD THAT TRUMP HIMSELF TEASES, I DON'T KNOW HOW TO DESCRIBE IT.

MILITARY INVOLVEMENT IN THE WIDER REGION TO STEM MIGRATION.

THERE IS A LOT OF TALK IN TRUMP'S INNER CIRCLE ABOUT MILITARY INCURSION INTO MEXICO.

I DON'T KNOW WHAT THIS LOOKS LIKE.

THIS IS AN OUTLANDISH PROSPECT.

IT GETS TALKED ABOUT ENOUGH FOR US TO HAVE TO PAY LEAD.

THIS CAME UP DURING THE FIRST TERM.

I THINK IT WAS MIKE POMPEO IN HIS MEMOIR DESCRIBING, THERE WASN'T DAY THAT WENT BY IN WHICH TRUMP DNT ASK HIM, HOW WOULD WE FARE IN A WAR AGAINST MEXICO?

THAT'S AN ABSOLUTELY LUNATIC NOTION.

IT IS TIED TO THIS GREAT OBSESSION WITH IMMIGRATION ENFORCEMENT.

>> STAFF WRITER FOR THE NEW YORKER AND AUTHOR OF THE BOOK, "EVERYONE WHO IS GONE IS HERE."

THANKS SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.

>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

>>> NEXT TO AN EXTRAORDINARY STORY OF TWO WOMEN WHO MADE HISTORY IN ANOTHER ARENA.

TENNIS STARS CHRIS EVERT AND MARTINA NAVRATILOVA HAD ONE OF THE GREAT SPORTS RIVALRIES.

EACH HOLDING THE TOP SPOT AT NUMBER ONE.

EACH HOLDING 18 MAJOR SINGLES TITLES.

OVER TIME THESE FIERCE COMPETITORS BECAME GREAT FRIENDS.

THAT FRIENDSHIP BECAME A CRUCIAL SYSTEM OF SUPPORT AS THEY EACH WERE DIAGNOSED ALMOST SIMULTANEOUSLY WITH DIFFERENT FORM OF CANCER.

AHEAD OF NEXT WEEK'S U.S. OPEN WHEN THEY'LL BOTH BE COMMENTATING, I SAT DOWN WITH THEM TO EXPLORE THEIR RIVALRY AND THEIR PROFOUND FRIENDSHIP.

WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM.

I WANT YOU TO TAKE ME BACK JUST FOR A MOMENT TO THE FINALS OF THE FRENCH OPEN WHEN YOU BOTH PRESENTED IN A JOINT CAPACITY THE FEMALE TROPHY.

>> YOU KNOW, IT WAS AN HONOR.

I HAVE TO SAY, I HAVE TO BE HONEST.

I WAS NOT ON THE ROSTER TO PRESENT THAT TROPHY ON THIS BIG 50th FOR ME.

MARTINA WAS ON THE ROSTER.

WHEN SHE HEARD THAT IT WAS MY 50th ANNIVERSARY, SHE QUICKLY WENT TO THE FRENCH FEDERATION AND SAID NO, NO, NO, CHRISSY HAS TO PRESENT THIS WITH ME.

IT'S HER DAY, TOO.

SO THAT IS HOW GENEROUS OF A FRIEND SHE WAS.

WE BOTH GOT TO PRESENT IT WHICH WAS GREAT.

IT KIND OF WAS GLORIFYING NOT ONLY MY 50th BUT ALSO THE RIVALRY.

THAT SOMEHOW, SOME OF OUR MOST INTERESTING MATCHES WERE AT THE FRENCH OPEN.

IT WAS QUITE A THRILL.

AND YOU KNOW, WE'RE SO FAR AWAY FROM THAT TIME PERIOD OF COMPETING THAT YOU FEEL LIKE A LITTLE BIT OF A STRANGER WHEN YOU WALK IN ON THAT RED CLAY COURT.

>> MARTINA, THAT'S AN INCREDIBLE ANECDOTE THAT YOU SUGGESTED CHRISSY JOIN YOU.

IT DOES TALK ABOUT YOUR RELATIONSHIP, YOUR FRIENDSHIP, YOUR RIVALRY.

AND I WANT TO FIRST ASK BUT THE EPIC BATTLES YOU FOUGHT ACROSS THE NET AT ROLAND GARROS.

WHAT STANDS OUT TO YOU ABOUT SOME OF THE MATCHES?

>> OH, MY GOODNESS.

THERE ARE SO MANY.

THERE ARE A FEW.

FOR ME IT WAS MORE ABOUT THE 50-YEAR ANNIVERSARY.

IT WAS THAT WE WERE BOTH THERE AFTER OUR EPIC BATTLES WITH CANCER.

IT WAS MORE SYMBOLIC ON THAT FRONT RATHER THAN THE ANNIVERSARIES.

BUT I LOST TO CHRIS IN '75 IN THE FINALS AND THEN WE PLAYED DOUBLES TOGETHER AND WE WARMED UP FOR THE FINAL TOGETHER.

WE WERE THE ONLY PEOPLE THERE.

SO OKAY, WE'LL WARM UP FOR THE FINAL TOGETHER.

AND THEN SHE, OF COURSE, WIPED THE COURT WITH ME.

>> YOU THINK OH, THEY PRACTICED TOGETHER.

THEY WERE MEETING EACH OTHER IN THE FINAL.

AND I HEAR YOU ALSO HAD LUNCH TOGETHER BEFORE HAND.

TELL ME ABOUT HOW THAT WAS.

THE TWO OF YOU.

DOES THAT EVEN HAPPEN NOW?

DO PLAYERS HAVE THAT KIND OF RELATIONSHIP NOW?

>> YES.

IN OUR DAY, WASN'T BIG BUSINESS AND THERE WASN'T A LOT OF PRIZE MONEY AND IT WAS JUST, WOMEN'S TENNIS WAS JUST FORMING.

SO WE ALL HAD CAMARADERIE AND WE TRAVELED TOGETHER LIKE IN A PACK.

AND NOW IT'S BIG BUSINESS.

I MAY NOT, YOU'RE TALKING MILLIONS AND MILLIONS AND MILLIONS OF DOLLARS, PRIZE MONEY, ENDORSEMENTS, BUSINESSES.

THESE TEAMS ARE CONSTRUCTED OF LIKE FIVE OR SIX PEOPLE WITH THE PHYSIOAND THE HITTING PARTNER AND THE COACH.

IT'S SO DIFFERENT.

EVERYONE REALLY STICKS TO THEMSELVES NOW.

IT CAN'T BE DONE NOW.

NO.

>> YOU MENTIONED THE MONEY.

MARTINA, YOU'RE KNOWN FOR HAVING BEEN THE FIRST TO WIN A MILLION DOLLARS IN PRIZE MONEY IN ONE YEAR.

BY 1986, I THINK, YOU HAD WON $10 MILLION.

YOU BROKE ALL SORTS OF EARNINGS RECORDS.

>> WELL, THE GROWTH WAS EXPONENTIAL.

I THINK IT WAS 971 WHEN BILLIE JEAN WON $100,000 AND SHE WON 19 OUT OF 31 TOURNAMENTS SHE PLAYED IN.

THAT'S WHAT IT TOOK TO WIN $100,000.

SO 15 YEARS LATER, I WON $1 MILLION.

NOW THEY'RE GETTING $3 MILLION FOR WINNING ONE TOURNAMENT.

ON TOP OF THAT, WE WERE NOT GETTING EQUAL MONEY WITH THE MEN OTHER THAN THE U.S. OPEN.

SO IT'S BEEN AN AMAZING GROWTH, OBVIOUSLY.

PARTICULARLY FOR THE WOMEN.

AND WE'VE BEEN LEADING THE WAY FOR WOMEN TO ASK FOR MORE MONEY, BETTER SALARIES BECAUSE OF WHAT THEY SEE ON THE TENNIS TOUR.

SO WE'VE BEEN PAVING THE WAY FOR WOMEN EVERYWHERE.

NOT JUST IN SPORTS.

>> YOU MENTIONED, BILLIE JEAN, YOUR FRIEND, SHE PLAYED AGAINST BOTH OF YOU AND SHE WAS THE EARLY FORERUNNER FOR THIS EQUAL PAY.

WHAT WAS IT LIKE WHEN YOU TWO FIRST MET EACH OTHER?

WHEN YOU CAME ON THE STAGE, YOU WERE A TEENAGER.

YOU HAD THIS STRAIGHT HAIR PULLED IN A PONYTAIL.

FIRST WITH THE DOUBLE HANDED BACKHAND.

AND LOTS OF YOUNG GIRLS LOOKED UP TO YOU.

AND I GUESS WERE INSPIRED TO COME INTO THE GAME.

WHAT WAS IT LIKE BLAZING THAT PATH?

>> WELL, I MEAN -- GOSH.

I HAD MY FIRST, I WAS A TOP JUNIOR PLAYER AND THEN I HAD MY FIRST BIG WIN OVER NUMBER ONE IN THE WORLD, MARGARET COURT WHEN I WAS 15 YEARS OLD.

THAT'S PROBABLY WHEN IT ALL STARTED.

I THINK THAT MARTINA AND BILLIE JEAN, I WAS IN THE ERA OF TWO VERY STRONG, STRONG WOMEN.

I THINK IF I HAD ONE THING THAT I CAN REMEMBER THE MOST WAS THAT I BROUGHT, I THINK I HELPED TO BRING A LOT OF YOUNG GIRLS INTO THE SPORT AND SAY, OKAY.

IT'S OKAY.

YOU KNOW, IT'S OKAY TO SWEAT.

IT'S OKAY TO HAVE MUSCLES.

IT'S OKAY TO GET MAD ON THE COURT.

IT'S OKAY TO BE STRONG.

I WENT OUT OF MY WAY, I HAVE TO ADMIT.

I WORE THE PIG TAILS WITH THE RIBBONS AND THE RUFFLES ON MY BLOOMERS AND I WORE NAIL POLISH.

I STILL WANTED TO BE A TEENAGE GIRL.

THERE IS ALWAYS A LITTLE PUSH AND PULL.

I WANT TO BE A HIGH SCHOOL GIRL AND I WANT TO GO OUT ON DATES BUT I WANT TO BE THIS TOUGH COMPETITOR ON THE COURT.

NOW I THINK THAT WAS SOMETHING THAT I THINK NOWADAYS, YOU KNOW, LOOK WHAT HAS HAPPENED NOW.

THESE WOMEN TENNIS PLAYERS, THEY HAVE THE MOST BEAUTIFUL, STRONG, MUSCULAR BODIES.

THEY'RE TOUGH ON THE COURT.

THEY'RE SMART.

AND THIS IS WHAT IT HAS COME TO FROM THE LAST 50 YEARS OF PROGRESSION.

>> MARTINA, YOU'RE THE ONE WHO PIONEERED, RIGHT?

THE TOUGH, STRONG BODY, THE MUSCLES, THE DIET, THE TRAINING, RIGHT?

NO?

YEAH!

FOR WOMEN'S TENNIS FOR SURE.

>> YEAH, I TOOK IT TO A DIFFERENT LEVEL.

BUT BILLIE JEAN AND MARGARET, THEY WERE TAKING IT TO A DIFFERENT LEVEL.

THE DIET AS WELL.

I THINK NOWADAYS, SOME OF THE PLAYERS ARE WEARING MORE MASCARA THAN CHRIS EVER DID.

BUT THEY ARE IN BETTER SHAPE BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO BE.

EVERYBODY IS HITTING THE BALL BIGGER, HARDER, TRACTS ENABLE YOU TO SWING BIGGER AND YOU HAVE TO BE IN BETTER SHAPE.

YOU HAVE TO BE FAST.

BUT YEAH, THE MASCARA IS STILL THERE.

CHRISSY WAS THE EPITOME OF AN ATHLETE WHO WAS FEMININE.

I WAS JUST AN ATHLETE.

I WAS NEVER FEMININE.

I NEVER FELT THAT WAY.

BUT ALWAYS A WOMAN AND COMPETING THE BEST I COULD.

MY MOM USED TO TELL ME, WEAR LONG SLEEVES SO I WOULD HIDE MY MUSCLES.

AT THE END OF THE DAY, THIS IS WHAT IT IS AND I WORE SLEEVELESS SO HERE WE ARE.

>> YOU HAD COME FROM, AT THAT TIME THE COMMUNIST BLOC, CZECHOSLOVAKIA.

YOU WERE OPENLY GAY WHEN YOU CAME OUT, I THINK IT WAS IN 1981 AND YOU GOT CRITICISM FOR THAT, OR SOME BACK LASH AT THE TIME.

CAN I JUST ASK YOU TO TAKE US BACK TO WHAT IT TOOK TO DEFECT?

WHAT MADE YOU DECIDE AT THAT YOUNG AGE, YOU WERE A TEENAGER, TO LEAVE YOUR HOME AND KNOW THAT YOU COULDN'T GO BACK EXCEPT UNDER RISK OF PRISON AND ARREST.

>> YEAH.

THAT WAS THE HARDEST AND BIGGEST DECISION OF MY LIFE.

I REALIZED THAT SUMMER IN 1975, THAT I WAS NOT FREE TO MAKE MY OWN CHOICES.

THAT I WAS ALWAYS GOING TO BE AT THE BECK AND CALL OF THE FEDERATION OR SOME GUY THAT WOULD DECIDE WHETHER I CAN OR CANNOT GO TO THE U.S. OPEN OR WIMBLEDON OR WHATEVER.

SO THAT'S WHEN I DECIDED, I CAN'T BE BEHOLDEN TO SOMEONE AND I NEEDED TO BE FREE TO PURSUE MY DREAM.

AND I KNEW IT WAS A ONE-WAY TICKET FROM MY HOME COUNTRY.

IT WAS BRUTAL.

I KNEW THAT I WOULD BE OKAY.

I KNEW MY FAMILY WOULD BE OKAY.

THAT ONE DAY WE WOULD HOPEFULLY BE TOGETHER AGAIN.

I KNEW THAT WAS THE ONLY WAY FOR ME TO HAVE MOO FORWARD AND NOT JUST DISAPPEAR INTO THE COMMUNIST PIT HOLE.

>> AND CHRISSY, YOU TALK ABOUT WHEN MARTINA DID GO BACK, WHEN YOU BOTH PLAYED IN THE FED CUP IN PRAGUE, IT WAS THE FIRST TIME MARTINA HAD BEEN BACK SINCE HER DEFECTION.

AND THE MEDIA WAS BANNED FROM TALKING ABOUT HER.

OFFICIALS DIDN'T MENTION HER NAME.

WHAT DO YOU REMEMBER OF THAT?

>> I REMEMBER WHEN MARTINA CALLED ME TO ASK ME TO PLAY AND FOR HER TO SAY, I REALLY, IT WOULD MEAN A LOT TO ME IF YOU WERE ON THE TEAM WITH ME BUT I CAN'T GUARANTEE YOUR SAFETY.

AND I WAS LIKE, BELOW, NO, NO.

I JUMPED AT THE CHANCE TO BE WITH MY FRIEND AND I WAS REALLY CURIOUS TO SEE HOW THEY WOULD REACT.

AS SOON AS WE LANDED, AS SOON AS WE GOT OUT THERE ON THE COURT, BEFORE OUR FIRST MATCH, THERE WAS A STANDING OVATION FOR MARTINA.

AND WOMEN WERE CRYING.

WOMEN WERE CRYING BECAUSE MARTINA DID WHAT THEY ALWAYS WOULD DREAM ABOUT DOING BUT WERE TOO AFRAID TO DO.

MARTINA DEFECTED FROM A COUNTRY AND FOUND HER FREEDOM IN AMERICA.

SO THEY WERE VERY, VERY, VERY SUPPORTIVE OF MARTINA EVEN IN THE FINALS WHEN WE PLAYED CZECHOSLOVAKIA.

IRONICALLY, AT THAT TIME IT WAS CZECHOSLOVAKIA.

NOW IT'S THE CZECH REPUBLIC.

EVEN THE OFFICIALS, THE GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS WHO WERE WATCHING WHO NEVER UTTERED HER NAME AND NEVER SAW HER NAME IN PRINT, AT THE END, EVERYBODY GAVE MARTINA A STANDING OVATION.

SO I MEAN, IT REALLY SURPASSED ANYTHING SPORTS.

IT WENT INTO HUMAN LIFE.

THAT TRANSFORMED INTO A WHOLE OTHER AREA OF POLITICS AND LIFE AND LOVE AND THE PURITY OF, YOU KNOW, WHAT SPORTS CAN DO.

>> MARTINA, IT MUST HAVE BEEN REALLY MOVING AND VINDICATING FOR YOU.

>> IT WAS AMAZING.

IT WAS SO BITTERSWEET.

I MISSED ALL THOSE YEARS WITH MY FAMILY.

I MISSED ALL THOSE YEARS BEING IN MY COUNTRY.

NOW I WAS SHOWING PEOPLE WHAT CAN BE DONE AND KIND OF SHOWING UP TO THE GOVERNMENT.

I SAW MAY GRANDMOTHER FOR THE FIRST TIME WHEN I WAS GOING BACK TO THE AIRPORT WHEN SHE PASSED AWAY TWO MONTHS LATER.

THEN I CRIED.

I CRIED WHEN THE PLANE TOOK OFF.

I COULD LEAVE BUT 30 MILLION PEOPLE IN THE COUNTRY COULDN'T LEAVE.

SO WE UPLIFTED THE PEOPLE WHO DID SEE US PLAY.

AND THEY DID END UP WRITING ABOUT ME IN THE NEWSPAPER.

THEY COULDN'T NOT WRITE ABOUT IT.

>> YOUR RIVALRY, YOUR FRIENDSHIP CRYSTALLIZED AND TOOK A WHOLE DIFFERENT TURN WHEN THE BOTH OF YOU GOT CANCER PRACTICALLY AT THE SAME TIME.

IT IS AN EXTRAORDINARY STORY.

YOU'VE DONE IT, ONE MAJOR INTERVIEW ABOUT IT AND IT IS INCREDIBLY MOVING.

CHRIS, WALK US THROUGH A LITTLE BIT OF YOUR PART OF THIS STORY.

HOW YOU BOTH WERE DIAGNOSED, WHAT IT MEANT TO YOUR FRIENDSHIP.

>> YOU KNOW, I HAVE TO SAY BEFORE I START THAT JOURNEY, I HAVE TO SAY THAT I THINK THE LAST FEW YEARS OF OUR RIVALRY IS WHEN WE REALLY, REALLY GOT TIGHT.

BECAUSE WE WERE THE ONLY ONES LEFT IN THE LOCKER ROOM EVERY SUNDAY DURING THE FINALS.

AND WE WOULD LOOK AT EACH OTHER AND WE FINALLY FIGURED OUT, YOU KNOW, WE'RE NOT ONLY COMPETITORS.

WE'RE PEOPLE.

AND MARTINA HAD FEELINGS AND MARTINA HAD A PRIVATE LIFE AND MARTINA HAD EMOTIONS AND SO DID I.

WE WERE VERY VULNERABLE WITH EACH OTHER THE LAST SUNDAY THAT'S WE PLAYED IN THE FINALS.

I THINK THAT'S WHAT STARTED THE BALL ROLLING.

AND THEN IRONICALLY, MARTINA GOT CANCER FIRST BUT I CAN ONLY TELL YOU MY JOURNEY WAS HAVING OVARIAN CANCER.

MAY SISTER JEANIE DIED FROM IT AND I FOUND OUT THAT I HAD THE GENE.

I WENT IN FOR PREVENTIVE SURGERY TO BASICALLY GET A HYSTERECTOMY AND THEY FOUND OUT THAT I DID HAVE OVARIAN CANCER AND I WASN'T FEELING ANYTHING.

THAT'S WHY THIS CANCER IS SO INSIDIOUS AND SNEAKY.

YOU DON'T FEEL ANYTHING.

I WAS STAGE ONE.

I WAS LUCKY.

I WENT IN.

I HAD THE HYSTERECTOMY.

THEY HAD TO GO IN AND SEE IF IT HAD SPREAD AND IT HADN'T SPREAD.

I HAD MY CHEMOTHERAPY.

UNBEKNOWNST TO ME, TWO YEARS LATER IT RETURNED INTO MY PELVIC AREA.

I HAD TO GO THROUGH THE WHOLE THING AGAIN.

THE SURGERY AND CHEMO.

AND MEANWHILE, MARTINA WAS FIGHTING HER OWN BATTLE WITH BREAST CANCER TWICE AND THROAT CANCER.

SHE WAS GOING THROUGH RADIATION AND CHEMO.

I WAS GOING THROUGH KEEP OEFLT WE WERE STAYING IN TOUCH AND THINKING ABOUT HOW IRONIC OUR LIFE HAS BEEN.

THINGS ARE HAPPENING TO US, THE SAME THINGS ARE HAPPENING TO US SIMULTANEOUSLY.

AND THAT IS REALLY HOW WE GOT SO CLOSE.

>> IT REALLY IS AN EXTRAORDINARY STORY.

AND MARTINA, YOU ALSO TALK ABOUT TELLING CHRIS, HOW CHRIS CALLED YOU AND TOLD YOU.

WHAT DID YOUR FRIENDSHIP MAY NOT IN TERMS OF, YOU KNOW, THE SUPPORT THAT YOU NEEDED TO GET THROUGH THIS?

>> YOU KNOW, CHRIS WAS ONE OF THOSE PEOPLE, TWO OR THREE PEOPLE THAT I KNEW, AND I'VE SAID THIS FOR DECADES.

SHE'S ONE OF THE THREE PEOPLE THAT I KNEW I COULD CALL AT 3:00 IN THE MORNING AND SAY WHERE ARE YOU?

I'M ON MY WAY.

AND I WAS THE SAME FOR HER.

SO WE HAD THIS CONNECTION FOR A LONG TIME.

THIS CANCER REALLY, IN A LOUSY WAY, BROUGHT US EVEN CLOSER TOGETHER.

WE HAD SO MUCH EMPATHY FOR EACH OTHER FOR SUCH A LONG TIME.

NOW WE WERE FIGHTING FOR EACH OTHER INSTEAD OF AGAINST EACH OTHER.

SO THAT SUPPORT WAS I THINK THAT MUCH MORE MEANINGFUL AND STRONG.

MY CANCER IN 2010 WAS NOTHING COMPARED TO WHAT CHRIS WENT THROUGH TWO YEARS AGO AND THEN MINE LAST YEAR AND THEN CHRIS RETURNED THIS YEAR.

SHE KIND OF BOOK-ENDED ME.

AND WE HAD THAT INNER RADAR OF WHEN TO CALL OR WHEN TO TEXT AND SAY HOW ARE YOU DOING?

WHAT CAN I DO?

IT WAS QUITE EXTRAORDINARY.

IT WAS ALMOST LIKE TWINS, YOU KNOW?

AT MY LOWEST, WHEN I FELT THE WORST, THERE WAS CHRIS CALLING OR TEXTING AND JUST PICKED ME UP AND I TRIED TO DO THE SAME FOR HER.

>> YOU'VE BOTH BEEN PUBLIC ABOUT IT WHICH IS GREAT FOR OTHER PEOPLE WHO ARE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO GET THROUGH THESE KINDS OF HUGE TRIALS.

YOU ALSO BOTH ARE STILL WORKING.

YOU'RE IN YOUR LATE 60s AND YOU'RE STILL WORKING A LOT.

THE TV WORK THAT YOU BOTH DO AROUND ALL THE MAJORS IS A LOT.

IT'S A LOT OF WORK.

WHAT DOES WORK TO YOU MEAN TODAY, CHRIS?

>> I WANT TO KEEP BUSY.

I WANT TO -- AFTER THAT SECOND BOUT OF CANCER, I THINK I REALIZED, I'D BETTER START LIVING THE LIFE, THE BEST LIFE THAT I COULD EVER LIVE.

AND AT THAT POINT I'VE BEEN SO PRIVILEGED TO BE IN A SPORT LIKE TENNIS WHERE I GAINED SO MUCH THAT I JUST WANT TO GIVE NOW.

AND I WANT TO, I HAD MY TENNIS ACADEMY.

I WORK FOR ESPN.

I HAVE, I WORK FOR THE USTA FOUNDATION, THE CHARITABLE SIDE OF IT.

AND I'M STILL A MOM.

AND I THINK, I JUST WANT TO KEEP BUSY AND KEEP MY MIND GOING.

WE LIVE BY THE WAY, DAY THE DAY.

MARTINA AND I ARE GETTING CAT SCANS EVERY THREE MONTHS.

THATS THE TELLTALE SIGN.

WE ARE TRYING TO DO THE BEST WE CAN.

I DON'T WANT TO BE ONE OF THOSE WOMEN WHO HAS THEIR NAILS DONE AND HAIR DONE AND JUST WALKS AROUND THE BLOCK.

I WANT TO BE VITAL AND I WANT TO BE USEFUL AND I WANT TO TELL WOMEN.

I WANT TO BE AN ADVOCATE TO GO OUT AND GET GENETIC TESTING AND TAKE CARE OF YOUR BODY AND KNOW YOUR FAMILY HISTORY.

I THINK WE BOTH WANT TO GET THOSE MESSAGES OUT.

>> ON THE PERSONAL SIDE, MARTINA, BOTH OF YOU HAVE GREAT PERSONAL NEWS BECAUSE YOU HAVE, WITH YOUR WIFE, ADOPTED, I BELIEVE, MARTINA, TWO YOUNG BOYS.

CHRISSY, YOU'VE JUST BECOME A GRANDMOTHER FOR THE FIRST TIME.

MARTINA, WHAT DOES THAT MEAN TO YOU?

WHY NOW?

>> I'M JUST TRYING TO FOLLOW IN CHRIS'S FOOTSTEPS.

OUR LIVES ARE STILL PARALLEL BUT NOW SHE'S A GRANDMA AND A MOM.

I NEED TO GET MY ROOTS DONE.

I HAVEN'T HAD A CHANCE TO DO THAT IN THE LAST FEW WEEKS.

FOR ME, WORKING AND DOING THE COMMENTARY MEANS, AS CHRIS SAID, STAYING CURRENT.

I LIKE TO SHARE MY LOVE FOR THIS SPORT AND TRY TO GIVE PEOPLE SOMETHING THAT THEY CAN LEARN WATCHING ME COMMENT.

IT IS NICE TO BE CONNECTED TO THE SPORT.

MY CHECK-UPS ARE ONLY EVERY SIX MONTHS.

AND I'LL BE DOING MY THROAT CANCER CHECK-UP.

YOU'RE ALWAYS HOLDING YOUR BREATH.

YOU GET THE ALL-CLEAR AND YOU BREATHE CLEARLY FOR A WHILE AND APPRECIATE EVERY SINGLE DAY THAT YOU HAVE.

>> FANTASTIC TO TALK TO YOU BOTH.

MARTINA NAVRATILOVA, CHRIS EVERT, THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

>> THANK YOU.

>> TWO REMARKABLE WOMEN.

THE SOVIET INVASION THAT MARTINA WAS TALKING ABOUT WHICH CAUSED HER TO DEFECT TO AMERICA HAPPENED EXACTLY THIS TIME 56 YEARS AGO IN 1968.

>>> AND FINALLY, WHEN SARAJEVO MET SALLY, MEG RYAN MADE A RED CARPET APPEARANCE AT THE FILM FESTIVAL.

SHE WAS GIVEN THE HONORARY HEART OF SARAJEVO AND SHE PRESENTED A SKRAENG.

HER ROM COM "YOU'VE GOT MAIL."

RYAN PAID TRIBUTE TO THE COURAGE OF THE BOSNIAN PEOPLE DURING THE SIEGE.

>> SO HAPPY TO BE ABLE TO BE HERE AND THANK YOU FACE TO FACE FOR YOUR EXAMPLE DURING THE SIEGE.

THOSE STORIES ABOUT HOW THIS COMMUNITY CAME TOGETHER, HOW YOU DODGED BULLETS AND RISKED YOUR LIVES TO GO SEE FILMS, TO MAKE MUSIC, TO DANCE TO MUSIC, TO SING, TO BE TOGETHER.

YOU PROVED THAT ART AND CULTURE ARE THE RESISTANCE.

>> RESISTANCE INDEED.

AS I WITNESSED REPORTING THE WAR, AND WE ALL SEE THE SAME THING HAPPENING AGAIN TODAY IN UKRAINE.

AND THAT IS IT FOR OUR PROGRAM TONIGHT.

IF YOU WANT TO FIND OUT WHAT IS COMING UP EVERY NIGHT, TO GO OUR WEBSITE.

THANK YOU FOR WATCHING.

GOODBYE FROM LONDON.