April 12, 2021

> HELLO, EVERYONE.

WELCOME TO 'AMANPOUR & COMPANY.'

HERE'S WHAT'S COMING UP.

> THREE, TWO, ONE.

LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, TAKE YOUR SEATS.

HAVE YOUR FIRST DRINK.

A TOAST TO OPENING UP.

I TALK TO FORMER BRITISH PRIME MINISTER ABOUT LIFTING LOCKDOWNS, COMBATTING VACCINE INEQUALITY AND MORE PRESSING ISSUES.

> THEN --

WE'RE GOING TO CHICAGO TO PROTEST THE VIETNAM WAR.

SASHA BARON COHEN TRANSFORMED FROM BORAT TO ABBY HOFFMAN.

THEY DISCUSS THEIR RIVETING HISTORICAL COURT DRAMA, THE TRIAL OF THE CHICAGO SEVEN.

> PLUS --

I'M DEEPLY CONCERNED ABOUT THE OPPORTUNITIES IN RURAL AMERICAN.

U.S. AGRICULTURE SECRETARY TOM VILSACK TELLS US HOW GROWING UP AN ORPHAN INSPIRED HIM TO HELP AMERICA'S FORGOTTEN FAMILIES.

♪♪♪

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ADDITIONAL SUPPORT PROVIDED BY THESE FUNDERS AND BY CONTRIBUTIONS TO YOUR PBS STATION FROM VIEWERS LIKE YOU.

THANK YOU.

> I'M CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR IN LONDON.

PRIME MINISTER BORIS JOHNSON LED A SPECIAL SESSION IN THE HOUSE OF COMMONS TODAY PAYING TRIBUTE TO PRINCE PHILIP, QUEEN ELIZABETH'S HUSBAND OF MORE THAN 70 YEARS WHO, AS WE KNOW, DIED ON FRIDAY.

THOUGH I SUSPECT HE MIGHT BE EMBARRASSED OR EVEN FAINTLY EXASPERATED TO RECEIVE THESE TRIBUTES.

HE MADE THIS COUNTRY A BETTER PLACE.

AND FOR THAT, HE WILL BE REMEMBERED WITH GRATITUDE AND WITH FONDNESS FOR GENERATIONS TO COME.

NOW, A FUNERAL WILL BE HELD ON SATURDAY.

A LOW-KEY AFFAIR BY ROYAL STANDARDS, IN PART DUE TO COVID RESTRICTIONS.

WHILE MANY RULES ARE STILL IN PLACE, ENGLAND'S VACCINE ROLLOUT HAS BEEN A SUCCESS AND LOCKDOWNS ARE STARTING TO LIFT.

ALL SHOPS CAN REOPEN TODAY SUCH AS HAIR DRESSERS AND GYMS AND OUTDOOR PINTS AT PUBS ARE NOW ALLOWED.

ENGLAND AND THE UNITED STATES ARE MOVING QUICKLY TOWARD VACCINE-BACKED HERD IMMUNITY, BUT SO MANY OTHER COUNTRIES ARE NOWHERE NEAR ACHIEVING THAT GOAL.

AS BRITAIN PREPARES TO HOST THE G7 MEETING OF THE WORLD'S MOST ADVANCED ECONOMIES IN JUNE, THE FORMER PRIME MINISTER GORDON BROWN SAYS GLOBAL MASS VACCINATION MUST BE THE HIGHEST PRIORITY.

HE SAYS IT MAKES FINANCIAL SENSE AND IT IS A MORAL IMPERATIVE.

HE'S GOING TO JOIN US IN A MOMENT.

BUT FIRST, MINNESOTA ONCE AGAIN ERUPTS IN PROTEST AFTER POLICE FATALLY SHOT ANOTHER BLACK MAN AT A TRAFFIC STOP.

ACCORDING TO THE POLICE CHIEF, THE OFFICER WAS ATTEMPTING TO DRAW HER TASER, BUT ACCIDENTALLY PULLED HER GUN AND FIRED IT.

THE COMMUNITY IS SHAKEN.

THE 20-YEAR-OLD DAUNTE WRIGHT WAS NOT NOT FAR FROM WHERE FORMER POLICEMAN DEREK CHAUVIN IS ON TRIAL NOW FOR THE KILLING OF GEORGE FLOYD.

HIS DEATH REALLY PROPELLED THE BLACK LIVES MATTER MOVEMENT, WHICH IS DEFINING THIS CURRENT ERA, JUST AS THE '60s AND '70s WERE DEFINED BY A DIFFERENT WAVE OF PROTEST, ANTI-WAR ACTIVISM.

THE OSCAR NOMINATED FILM 'THE TRIAL OF THE CHICAGO 7' TACKLES THIS TOPIC, TELLING THE STORY OF A GROUP OF VIETNAM WAR PROTESTERS CHARGED WITH CONSPIRACY FOR ALLEGEDLY INCITING RIOTS AT THE 1968 DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL CONVENTION IN CHICAGO.

IT'S A RIVETING HISTORICAL COURTROOM DRAMA WITH A WHOLE HOST OF ACCLAIMED ACTORS INCLUDING SASHA BARON COHEN.

TAKE A LOOK AT THIS CLIP FROM THE TRAILER.

THEY WERE CHANTING THAT THE WHOLE WORLD IS WATCHING.

IF WE LEAVE HERE WITHOUT SAYING ANYTHING ABOUT WHY WE CAME IN THE FIRST PLACE, IT WILL BE HEARTBREAKING.

WHY DID YOU COME TO THE CONVENTION?

TO END THE WAR.

WE'RE GIVING THEM EXACTLY WHAT THEY WANT, A STAGE AND AN AUDIENCE.

DO YOU REALLY THINK THERE'S GOING TO BE A BIG AUDIENCE?

♪♪♪

WE MAY HAVE TO HURT SOMEBODY'S FEELINGS.

SASHA BARON COHEN AND AARON SORKIN TALK ABOUT HOW IT RESONATES TODAY TO FIND JUSTICE AND OF COURSE TO FIGHT THE INSURGENCY ON CAPITOL HILL BACK IN JANUARY.

WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF THE REALITY IN WHICH WE LIVE MIRRORING TO SOME EXTENT YOUR FILM IN THAT ERA?

YOU KNOW, I'M NOT SURE IF WE BOOMERANGED BACK TO 1968 LIKE WE WERE STRETCHING A RUBBER BAND, OR IT'S ALWAYS BEEN THERE AND SOMEHOW DONALD TRUMP UNCOVERED IT.

THIS ALL STARTED IN 2006, ALMOST 15 YEARS AGO NOW, WHEN STEVEN SPIELBERG ASKED ME TO COME TO HIS HOUSE ON A SATURDAY MORNING.

JUST TO BE CLEAR, THAT'S NOT COMMON.

I DON'T HANG OUT WITH STEVEN SPIELBERG ON SATURDAY MORNINGS.

HE TOLD ME HE WANTED TO MAKE A MOVIE ABOUT THE CHICAGO SEVEN.

I SAID THAT SOUNDS GREAT, COUNT ME IN.

CHICAGO SEVEN WILL MAKE A GREAT MOVIE.

I LEFT HIS HOUSE AND CALLED MY FATHER AND ASKED HIM WHO THE CHICAGO SEVEN WERE.

SO I WAS JUST SAYING YES TO WORKING WITH STEVEN SPIELBERG THEN.

I DID A LOT OF RESEARCH.

THERE ARE A DOZEN OR SO GOOD BOOKS, SOME OF THEM WRITTEN BY THE DEFENDANTS.

THERE'S A TRIAL TRANSCRIPT.

BUT I ALWAYS WANTED THE FILM TO BE ABOUT TODAY AND NOT 1968.

I JUST NEVER IMAGINED HOW MUCH ABOUT TODAY IT WOULD END UP BEING.

ALSO WANT TO MENTION JANUARY 6th ATTACK ON THE CAPITOL.

IT WAS ACTUALLY DONALD TRUMP, RUDY GIULIANI AND A FEW OTHERS WHO STOOD AT A MICROPHONE AND DID EXACTLY WHAT THE CHICAGO SEVEN WERE ON TRIAL DOING INCITING A RIOT.

IT REALLY IS EXTRAORDINARY.

OF COURSE, IN A MOMENT WE'LL ALSO TALK ABOUT BORAT, BECAUSE THAT ALSO HAS THE RUDY GIULIANI EPISODE IN IT.

I'M EXCITED TO TALK ABOUT BORAT.

[ LAUGHTER ]

YOU WILL SOON.

SASHA, YOU ALSO KIND OF HAVE A LONG HISTORY WITH ABBY HOFFMAN.

YOU PLAY ABBY HOFFMAN IN THE FILM.

HE'S THE HEAD OF THE YIPPES, THE YOUTH INTERNATIONAL MOVEMENT.

YOU STUDIED HIM WHILE YOU WERE STILL AT COLLEGE.

IN 1992 I DID MY UNDER GRADUATE THESIS ABOUT JEWS IN THE BLACK CIVIL RIGHTS MOVEMENT IN THE 1960s.

AND ABBY FEATURES PROMINENTLY.

HE WAS ONE OF THE MANY STUDENT WHO IS WENT DOWN TO THE SOUTH AND RISKED THEIR LIVES TO FIGHT AGAINST SYSTEMIC RACISM.

WHAT I WAS LOOKING INTO IS WHY WERE JEWS 30 TIMES MORE LIKELY THAN AMERICA WHITES TO BE INVOLVED IN THE CIVIL RIGHTS MOVEMENT.

THEN THAT GROUP WENT ON AND FORMED THE BASIS OF THE ANTI-VIETNAM WAR MOVEMENT.

SO MANY OF THE CHICAGO SEVEN HAD ACTUALLY BEEN DOWN SOUTH IN THE FREEDOM RIDES.

AND ABBY WAS SOMEBODY I FOUND FASCINATING EVEN BACK THEN BECAUSE HE WAS USING HUMOR TO UNDERMINE THE ESTABLISHMENT AND MOCK UNJUST POWER.

SO HE WAS INSPIRATIONAL EVEN BACK THEN.

WE'VE GOT SEVERAL CLIPS FROM THE MOVIE AND I WANT TO PLAY THIS ONE, WHICH WE GO BETWEEN THE REAL ABBY HOFFMAN AND THEN A CLIP FROM THE MOVIE.

I'M GOING TO PLAY IT.

I THINK WE'RE BEING TRIED WITH CARRYING A STATE OF MIND ACROSS THE STATE BORDER.

IT'S A VERY UNUSUAL LAW.

WE'RE THE FIRST ONES TO BE TRIED UNDER IT.

DO YOU KNOW WHY YOU'RE ON TRIAL HERE?

WE CARRIED CERTAIN IDEAS ACROSS STATE LINES, NOT MACHINE GUNS OR DRUGS OR LITTLE GIRLS.

IDEAS.

WHEN WE CROSSED FROM NEW YORK TO NEW JERSEY TO PENNSYLVANIA TO OHIO TO ILLINOIS, WE HAD CERTAIN IDEAS.

AND FOR THAT, WE WERE GASSED, BEATEN, ARRESTED AND PUT ON TRIAL.

HOW DIFFICULT WAS IT FOR YOU TO EMULATE AND TRANSLATE AND INTERPRET HIM?

YOU CHOSE BRITISH ACTORS TO PLAY THESE ICONIC AMERICANS.

IT WAS A REAL CHALLENGE.

I HAVE TO BE HONEST.

FIRSTLY, THE ACCENT IS DIFFICULT EVEN FOR MOST AMERICANS TO PLAY A KIND OF BOSTON ACCENT.

IT'S THE TRICKIEST ONE.

HE ALSO WAS VERY INFLUENCED BY THE COMEDIAN LENNY BRUCE.

DURING THE TRIAL HE'D GO ON TOUR TO RAISE MONEY BY DOING STANDUP, BUT IT WAS POLITICAL STANDUP.

HE WAS HILARIOUS.

I MEAN, WHAT I DID WAS I TRIED TO DO AS MUCH RESEARCH AS I COULD.

HE WAS VERY, VERY AWARE OF THE POWER OF PRESS.

YOU KNOW, HE WOULD HAVE BEEN ON THIS SHOW TRYING TO SPREAD HIS CAUSE AND AARON BRILLIANTLY SHOWS IN THE SCRIPT HE WANTS TO DEMONSTRATE WHERE THE CAMERAS ARE.

HE REALIZED THAT THE WHOLE TRIAL WAS NOT TO PREVENT THEM FROM BEING IMPRISONED.

HE KNEW THEY WERE GOING TO JAIL.

HE KNEW IT WAS TO CONVINCE PEOPLE AT HOME AND MAKE IT ENTERTAINING ENOUGH THAT PEOPLE AT HOME WOULD TURN AGAINST THIS UNJUST WAR.

JUST DID A HUGE AMOUNT OF RESEARCH.

THE IDEA WAS NOT TO EMULATE HIM, BUT TO SOMEHOW KIND OF INHABIT HIM.

THEN I HAD THIS INCREDIBLE SCRIPT TO PLAY WITH.

LET ME PLAY THIS LITTLE CLIP OF EDDIE REDMAYNE PLAYING TOM HAYDEN.

TOM HAYDEN WAS LESS ABOUT REVOLUTION AND MORE ABOUT PROGRESSIVE CHANGE AND ABBIE HOFFMAN WAS MORE ABOUT REVOLUTIONARY CHANGE.

MY PROBLEM IS THAT FOR THE NEXT 50 YEARS WHEN PEOPLE THINK OF PROGRESSIVE POLITICS, THEY'RE GOING TO THINK OF YOU.

THEY'RE GOING TO THINK OF YOU AND YOUR IDIOT FOLLOWERS PASSING OUT DAISIES TO FOLLOWERS AND TRYING TO LEVITATE THE PENTAGON.

THEY'RE NOT GOING TO THINK OF EQUALITY OR JUSTICE OR EDUCATION OR POVERTY OR PROGRESS.

THEY'RE GOING TO THINK OF A BUNCH OF STONED, LOST, DISRESPECTFUL, FOUL-MOUTHED, LAWLESS LOSERS.

SO WE'LL LOSE ELECTIONS.

WELL, THE POLITICAL TENSION BETWEEN ABBIE AND TOM, WHICH IS REALLY MY FAVORITE PART OF THE FILM, BECAUSE IT'S THE PERSONAL PART OF THE FILM.

IT'S THE STORY OF THESE TWO GUYS WHO THEY'RE ON THE SAME SIDE, THEY PLAINLY CAN'T STAND EACH OTHER AND THEY EACH THINK THE OTHER IS DOING HARM TO THE CAUSE.

AND TO ME, IT'S VERY MUCH A REFLECTION OF WHAT YOU SEE IN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY TODAY OF THE TENSION BETWEEN THE LEFT AND THE FURTHER LEFT, PEOPLE WHO THINK CHANGE NEEDS TO BE INCREMENTAL AND PEOPLE WHO ARE TIRED OF INCREMENTAL CHANGE AND WANT SOME KIND OF REVOLUTION.

SASHA, MUCH HAS BEEN WRITTEN ABOUT YOU, BUT I THINK IT'S INTERESTING THAT NOT ONLY DO PEOPLE CONSIDER YOU OBVIOUSLY A BRILLIANT SATIRIST, COMEDIAN, BUT ALSO A POLITICAL AND SOCIAL ACTIVIST.

I'VE HEARD YOU TALK ABOUT NOT JUST THIS FILM, BUT ALSO BORAT IN WHICH YOU HAD AN AGENDA, YOU HAD A POLITICAL AGENDA, CERTAINLY REGARDING DONALD TRUMP AND THE FOUR YEARS OF THAT ADMINISTRATION.

I DON'T PERCEIVE MYSELF AS HAVING A ROLE.

I JUST FELT COMPELLED TO DO SOMETHING.

SO I WAS PARTICULARLY WORRIED AND ANGERED BY TRUMP'S PRESIDENCY.

I WAS TERRIFIED ABOUT WHAT WOULD HAPPEN TO AMERICA IF TRUMP WON AGAIN.

AND SO I DID THREE THINGS.

ONE, I ENSURED THAT I COULD MAKE CHICAGO SEVEN AND I STOPPED BORAT TO DO IT.

TWO, I DECIDED TO MAKE BORAT TO INCENTIVIZE AND URGE ANY FANS OF MINE TO GO OUT AND VOTE.

IT ENDED WITH A SIMPLE MESSAGE WHICH WAS NOW VOTE.

THAT'S WHY BORAT WAS DESIGNED TO INFILTRATE THE TRUMP REGIME.

AND THE THIRD THING I DID WAS, I CAME OUT AS MYSELF AND SPOKE ABOUT THE DANGER OF SOCIAL MEDIA.

AND THE REASON I DID THAT WAS, I BELIEVED DEEPLY THAT IF SOCIAL MEDIA DIDN'T CHANGE PRIOR TO THE ELECTION, THAT ITS INHERENT BIAS TOWARD MISINFORMATION AND LIES AND CONSPIRACIES WOULD HELP TRUMP TO WIN.

SO I DIDN'T WANT TO BE A BYSTANDER.

ABBIE HOFFMAN AND I FELT THOSE WERE THE THREE THINGS I COULD DO.

YOU SAID BORAT WAS TO PROTECT THE AMERICAN DEMOCRACY FROM DONALD TRUMP.

YOU TOOK SOME PRETTY EXTRAORDINARY -- YOU WENT TO SOME PRETTY EXTRAORDINARY LENGTHS AND TOOK SOME PRETTY EXTRAORDINARY RISKS.

OBVIOUSLY THE END WHERE THE YOUNG ACTRESS WAS PORTRAYED AS YOUR DAUGHTER AND SHE WENT IN TO INTERVIEW RUDY GIULIANI.

I MEAN, OF COURSE, EVERYBODY KNOWS ABOUT THAT SCENE.

IT'S VARIETY.

VIRAL.

NOW HOW SCARY WAS IT FOR YOU AND FOR HER, AND WHAT KIND OF SECURITY MEASURES WOULD YOU TAKE?

WE WERE TOLD HE CAME WITH POLICE PROTECTION.

AND HE CAME WITH A COP.

WE ALSO KNEW THAT THE COP WOULD CHECK THE ROOM FOR ANYONE WHO WAS THERE.

SO WE BUILT A HIDEAWAY THAT I STAYED INSIDE OF FOR ABOUT AN HOUR AND A HALF.

IT WAS A LITTLE BIT WIDER THAN ME AND ABOUT 6'5' HIGH.

I HID IN THERE WHILE THE GUY WAS CASING THE ROOM.

THEN WHEN WE LEFT -- WELL, THE INTERVIEW ENDED AND THEN THE POLICEMAN TOLD US TO STAY IN THE ROOM, MYSELF AND MARIA, AND THAT WE WEREN'T ALLOWED TO LEAVE THE ROOM.

I WAS PLAYING BORAT, OBVIOUSLY.

BORAT DOESN'T KNOW WHAT A CHAIR IS.

WHAT IS THIS MACHINE WITH FOUR LEGS?

AND SUDDENLY THE COP WAS SAYING STAY IN THE ROOM UNTIL THE REST OF THE POLICE ARRIVE.

I WAS LIKE, YOU HAVE NO RIGHT!

THIS IS MY PROPERTY.

YOU MUST LEAVE MY PROPERTY.

SUDDENLY BORAT WAS AN EXPERT.

THIS IS FALSE IMPRISONMENT!

I WARN YOU!

AND WE BASICALLY RAN OUT OF THE HOTEL TO A GET-AWAY VEHICLE.

GIULIANI THEN ACCUSED US OF A FEDERAL CRIME AND THEREFORE GOT THE ROOM SEARCHED, WHICH IS HUGELY IMPROPER, BECAUSE IT'S ESSENTIALLY, YOU KNOW, OUR PROPERTY BECAUSE WE PAID FOR THE ROOM.

AND I WAS ADVISED, MYSELF AND MARIA WERE ADVISED TO LEAVE THE STATE IN A RUSH, BECAUSE WE HAD HIRED A COP TO PROTECT US.

HE HAD IMMEDIATELY TOLD GIULIANI'S COP WHERE I WAS STAYING, THE AIRBNB I WAS STAYIN AND THE CREW HOTEL.

THEN I WAS ADVISED BY A LAWYER TO LEAVE THE STATE IMMEDIATELY.

I WAS FRANTICALLY CALLING FRIENDS.

HI, HOW ARE YOU, HAVEN'T SEEN YOU, COULD I STAY?

SURE.

WHEN?

HOW ABOUT IN 20 MINUTES?

ONE OF THEM SAID YES AND I DROVE OUT TO CONNECTICUT AND STAYED AT HIS HOUSE, HAD A LOVELY TIME FOR A COUPLE OF DAYS.

THE POLICE IMPOUNDED THE EQUIPMENT.

I MEAN, OBVIOUSLY MARIA -- I MEAN YOU'RE NOT AMERICAN EITHER, BUT SHE'S DEFINITELY NOT AMERICAN AND VERY YOUNG ACTRESS.

WERE YOU CONCERNED ABOUT HER SAFETY?

I MEAN, DID YOU SORT OF GAME

YES.

I ASSURED HER AS A PRODUCER THAT I WOULD LOOK AFTER HER.

SO WE HAD A SECURITY TEAM AND WE WENT THROUGH THE ESCAPE ROUTE AND EVERYTHING.

YOU KNOW, OBVIOUSLY IF I HAD NOT INTERVENED, THE INTERVIEW MIGHT HAVE ENDED UP IN A RATHER SORDID PLACE, AND I GUARANTEED HER I WOULD NOT LET THAT HAPPEN.

THE REST OF THE MOVIE I TRY TO ENSURE THAT SHE WAS NOT THERE FOR SOME OF THE MORE DANGEROUS SCENES.

OR SHE WAS NOT THERE IN A POSITION WHERE SHE COULD GET HURT.

AARON, YOU'VE BEEN SORT OF GIGGLING AS THIS STORY IS BEING RECOUNTED.

BUT I WANT TO ASK YOU AS AN AMERICAN DIRECTOR, WRITER, ARTIST, I MEAN, SASHA BARON COHEN STANDS OUT FOR REALLY PUSHING THE LIMITS AND REALLY I THINK IT'S VERY COURAGEOUS.

MANY PEOPLE MIGHT HAVE THEIR OWN VIEWS ABOUT IT.

BUT YOU KNOW THE ALI G PERSONA, ALL THE PEOPLE WHO HAD TO QUIT THEIR JOBS OR BE TURFED OUT BECAUSE OF HOW THEY REVEALED THEMSELVES.

THERE'S NO DOUBT THAT SASHA IS DOING THAT.

BY THE WAY I THINK IT'S MORE THAN A LITTLE COURAGEOUS.

PEOPLE DON'T REALIZE THAT SASHA REGULARLY PUTS HIMSELF IN DANGER AND WOULD NEVER, BY THE WAY, PUT ANYONE ELSE IN DANGER.

BUT WHEN HE WALKS INTO C-PAC OR THE GIULIANI SCENE, HE'S PUTTING HIMSELF IN EITHER LEGAL OR PHYSICAL DANGER.

SASHA, DO YOU THINK YOU WILL DO ANOTHER -- IS THERE A TIME WHEN YOU THINK, WELL, I'VE DONE THAT OR I CAN'T DO THAT ANYMORE?

I PLAN TO NOT DO IT AGAIN.

I THINK BORAT WAS A NEAR IMPOSSIBLE MOVIE TO MAKE, BECAUSE FOR THE PURE FACT THAT AT ITS BASIS IF WORD HAD GOT OUT THAT I WAS MAKING BORAT, IT WOULD HAVE BEEN IMPOSSIBLE TO MAKE, BECAUSE WE'RE RELYING ON REAL PEOPLE NOT KNOWING WHO I AM.

BORAT!

IT'S NOT ME.

I THINK ALSO THE MOVIE ENDED UP BEING A LOT MORE DANGEROUS THAN I EXPECTED AND I THINK, QUITE FRANKLY, YOU CAN PREPARE, BUT YOU RELY ON A LOT OF LUCK.

THERE WAS A GUN RIGHTS RALLY THAT I WAS AT WHERE I WAS CHASED OFF STAGE.

SOMEBODY REACHED FOR HIS PISTOL AND I WAS LUCKY ENOUGH THAT A BODY GUARD GRABBED HIS ARM AND STOPPED THE GUY DOING WHATEVER HE WAS INTENDING TO DO.

I THINK IT'S TOO DANGEROUS TO DO ANYMORE.

AGAIN, I BROUGHT THE GRAY SUIT OUT OF THE WARDROBE FOR THE PURPOSE OF CONVINCING, TRY TO CONVINCE A FEW FANS TO VOTE AGAINST TRUMP.

SO THAT PURPOSE IS NOT THERE ANYMORE.

NO, I DON'T WANT TO TAKE THE RISK ANYMORE.

RIGHT.

IF I COULD JUST JUMP IN, I PROMISE YOU I DO NOT OWN STOCK IN SASHA BARON COHEN, BUT SASHA WAS MAKING BORAT BEFORE AND AFTER CHICAGO SEVEN.

HE STOPPED MAKING BORAT TO DO CHICAGO SEVEN, PROMISING THE PRODUCERS THAT WE'LL STILL BE ABLE TO MAKE IT IF WE JUST TAKE THESE EIGHT WEEKS AND STOP.

THE PRODUCERS WERE SAYING, NO, YOU'LL NEVER BE ABLE TO MAKE IT.

HE SWORE THAT THEY COULD.

WE WRAPPED AND COVID ALMOST IMMEDIATELY BEGAN.

NO ONE ANTICIPATED HE WAS GOING TO RUN INTO THAT.

BUT AS DIFFICULT AS IT MUST HAVE BEEN TO MAKE BORAT THE FIRST TIME, IMAGINE THE SKILL IT TAKES TO MAKE IT THE SECOND TIME WHEN EVERYONE KNOWS WHO BORAT IS AND CAN SEE HIM COMING.

IT IS REMARKABLE.

JUST FINAL WORD, AARON, TO YOUR FILM.

WHAT DO YOU HOPE THE LEGACY OF THE TRIAL OF THE CHICAGO SEVEN WILL BE?

WHY DID YOU WANT TO DO IT?

BEFORE ANYTHING ELSE, I JUST WANTED IT TO BE A MOVIE THAT PEOPLE LIKED WATCHING, A COURTROOM DRAMA THAT PEOPLE LIKED WATCHING.

MORE THAN THAT, I HOPE IT'S A VALENTINE TO PROTEST.

ONE OF THE THINGS THAT IT TOOK SO MANY YEARS TO MAKE THE MOVIE, BUT THE THING THAT FINALLY GOT IT MADE -- I HATE GIVING CREDIT TO DONALD TRUMP FOR ANYTHING, BUT HE'S WHAT GREEN LIT THE MOVIE.

BECAUSE AT HIS RALLIES THERE'D BE PROTESTERS AND HE'D START GETTING NOSTALGIC ABOUT THE OLD DAYS WHEN WE CARRIED THAT GUY OUT OF HERE ON A STRETCHER AND I'D LIKE TO PUNCH HIM IN THE FACE, BEAT THE CRAP OUT OF HIM, I'LL PAY YOUR LEGAL BILLS.

EVERYBODY THOUGHT THAT ATHLETES KNEELING DURING THE NATIONAL ANTHEM MADE THEM UN-AMERICAN, UNPATRIOTIC.

SO THE CHICAGO SEVEN, YOU KNOW, THEY WERE CALLED UNPATRIOTIC, UN-AMERICAN, ANTI-AMERICAN, OVERLY EDUCATED PANSIES.

THEY WERE ANYTHING BUT WEAK.

THEY RISKED THEIR LIVES.

THEY RISKED TEN YEARS IN FEDERAL PRISON.

IT'S WIDELY ACCEPTED TODAY THAT THEY HASTENED THE END OF A WAR.

STACK THAT UP AGAINST CONGRESSMAN AND SENATORS WHO AREN'T WILLING TO RISK ANYTHING FOR ANYONE AND DECIDE WHO THE PATRIOTS ARE.

IT IS REMARKABLE.

I WOULD SAY VERY SERIOUSLY THAT THE FOUR YEARS OF THE TRUMP PRESIDENCY REALLY DID REVIVE PROTEST, I THINK, IN AN AMAZING WAY ON EVERY SINGLE LEVEL.

AARON SORKIN, SASHA BARON COHEN, THANK YOU VERY MUCH INDEED FOR JOINING US.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

THANK YOU.

BOTH THOSE FILMS HAVE BEEN REWARDED WITH SO MANY NOMINATIONS AND PRIZES DURING THIS AWARDS SEASON.

OF COURSE, OSCARS ARE UP NEXT.

NOW, JUST TO NOTE, RUDY GIULIANI SAYS THE BORAT VIDEO, OF COURSE, IS A COMPLETE FABRICATION AND HE CLAIMS HE WAS NEVER INAPPROPRIATE.

TODAY IS ALSO THE 32nd ANNIVERSARY OF THE DEATH OF ABBIE HOFFMAN, THE CHARACTER SASHA WAS PLAYING.

HE HAD SUFFERED FROM BIPOLAR DISORDER AND HE DIED BY SUEDE IN -- SUICIDE IN 1989.

> NOW WE TALK ABOUT COVID AND OUR NEED TO A GLOBAL RESPONSE FOR THIS WITH FORMER BRITISH PRIME MINISTER GORDON BROWN.

YOU HAVE WRITTEN OP-EDS, COLUMNS ABOUT WHAT YOU THINK NEEDS TO BE DONE AND WHAT SHOULD BE THE HIGHEST PRIORITY.

YOU'VE TALKED ABOUT COUNTRIES PERHAPS HAVING TO PUT $30 BILLION A YEAR INTO THIS EFFORT FOR THE FORESEEABLE FUTURE.

WHAT HAS TO HAPPEN, DO YOU THINK?

WELL, THAT'S A SMALL PRICE TO PAY, BECAUSE NOBODY IS SAFE ANYWHERE UNTIL EVERYBODY IS SAFE EVERYWHERE.

YOU KNOW, WE'VE GOT 70% OF ADULTS VACCINATED IN THE UNITED KINGDOM, BUT ONLY 1% OF ADULTS IN SUB-SAHARAN AFRICA.

AS LONG AS THE REST OF THE WORLD IS NOT VACCINATED, WHETHER IT'S 2022 OR 2023 BEFORE THEY ARE, THEN THE DISEASE WILL CONTINUE TO SPREAD.

IT WILL MUTATE.

THERE WILL BE NEW VARIANTS.

AND OF COURSE IT THREATENS BOTH LIVES AND LIVELIHOODS IN EVERY COUNTRY OF THE WORLD.

IT'S NOT A CHOICE BETWEEN VACCINATED AT HOME AND VACCINATING ROUND THE WORLD.

WE'VE GOT TO DO BOTH.

NOW THE PRICE, 30 BILLION A YEAR, VERY SMALL PRICE TO PAY.

IT'S FAR LESS THAN WHAT HAS BEEN LOST IN OUTPUT.

IT'S FAR SMALLER THAN WHAT WE HAD TO DO IN 2009 WHEN WE HAD A TRILLION STIMULUS AT THE G20.

PRESIDENT BIDEN'S GOT A 2 TRILLION STIMULUS IN AMERICA.

30 BILLION COULD BE PAID BY AMERICA ITSELF, BUT I'M SUGGESTING THAT WE BURDEN SHARE RIGHT ROUND THE WORLD AND OF COURSE THE RICHEST COUNTRIES, THE G7, SHOULD PAY THE LION'S SHARE, ABOUT 60% OF THE COST THAT NEEDS TO BE MET.

HOW WOULD YOU MAKE THIS HAPPEN IF YOU WERE PRIME MINISTER?

YOU MENTIONED THE FINANCIAL CRISIS.

YOU WERE PRIME MINISTER THEN.

YOU HOSTED G7s AND OTHER MEETINGS.

THIS COVID CRISIS HAS BEEN MARKED BY ITS COMPLETE LACK OF GLOBAL COORDINATION.

IT'S EACH COUNTRY, EACH STATE FOR THEMSELVES.

WHAT WOULD YOU SAY TO YOUR FELLOW LEADERS IN JUNE AT THE G7 TO MAKE THIS HAPPEN?

YEAH.

LAST YEAR WE WASTED THE CHANCE TO COOPERATE.

WE DIDN'T COOPERATE ON EXCHANGING INFORMATION, ON GETTING THE VACCINE OUT.

OF COURSE, WE DIDN'T COOPERATE ON EQUIPMENT AND VENTILATORS.

THIS YEAR WE HAVE A REAL CHANCE.

PRESIDENT BIDEN HAS SAID HE WANTS TO CONTRIBUTE.

THE EUROPEANS, I THINK, REALIZE THEY'VE GOT TO BE PART OF A COLLECTIVE EFFORT.

THEN CHINA, RUSSIA, THE OTHER COUNTRIES SHOULD COME IN.

I THINK THE STARTING POINT IS THE G7 MEETING JUNE 13th, UNITED KINGDOM, BORIS JOHNSON CHAIRING.

IF HE CAN DO WHAT WE TRIED TO DO IN 2009 AND BRING TOGETHER THE MAJOR COUNTRIES AND INSTEAD OF SAYING WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A WIT ROUND TO RAISE MONEY, WHICH IS WHAT HAS HAPPENED IN THE PAST AND THE LAST FEW MONTHS, WHAT YOU SEE IS A FAIR SYSTEM OF BURDEN SHARING.

IT'S BASED ON WHAT YOU CONTRIBUTE TO THE UNITED NATIONS PEACE KEEPING.

IT'S SIMILAR TO WHAT WAS DONE WHEN WE ERADICATED SMALLPOX IN THE '60s, WHEN THERE WAS A LEVY ON WORLD HEALTH ORGANIZATION MEMBERS.

BRING PEOPLE TOGETHER, AMERICA PAY ROUGHLY 25%, EUROPE ROUGHLY 25%, G7 60%, G20 85-90%, SCANDINAVIA AND SOME OTHER COUNTRIES PREPARED TO CONTRIBUTE.

THEN YOU CAN SAY TO THE POORER COUNTRIES WE CAN GET ON WITH THIS VACCINATION PROGRAM.

WE SOLVED THE PROBLEM OF DISCOVERY WITH BRILLIANT SCIENCE.

WE'LL SOLVE THE PROBLEM OF LOGISTICS.

WE'VE GOT TO SOLVE THE PROBLEM OF FINANCE.

YOU SAID BRITAIN HAS DONE A GREAT JOB WITH THE VACCINE ROLLOUT.

OF COURSE, THERE'S ALL THESE COMPLAINTS ABOUT VACCINE NATIONALISM AND SOME COUNTRIES ARE STOPPING EXPORTS.

IT'S JUST A BIT OF A MESS IN TERMS OF THE BIG PICTURE.

THAT'S A LACK OF COORDINATION AS WELL.

WELL, EXACTLY.

I JUST WANT TO ASK YOU TO ADDRESS THIS, BECAUSE THE KENYAN FOREIGN MINISTRY ACCUSED THE U.K. OF, QUOTE, VACCINE APARTHEID.

THAT IS REALLY STRONG.

HE SAID, VACCINE PRODUCING COUNTRIES AROUND THE WORLD HAVE BEGUN PRACTIING A FORM OF VACCINE NATIONALISM, POSSESSIVENESS AND DISCRIMINATION COUPLED WITH A VACCINE HOARDING ATTITUDE THAT CAN ONLY BE DESCRIBED AS A FORM OF VACCINE APARTHEID.

THE SECRETARY OF THE WHO WHO BELIEVES IN WHAT YOU'RE SAYING.

THERE REMAINS A SHOCKING IMBALANCE IN THE GLOBAL DISTRIBUTION FOR VACCINES.

MORE THAN 700 MILLION VACCINE DOSES HAVE BEEN ADMINISTERED GLOBALLY, BUT OVER 87% HAVE GONE TO HIGH INCOME OR UPPER AND MIDDLE INCOME COUNTRIES, WHILE LOW INCOME COUNTRIES HAVE RECEIVED JUST 0.2%. ON AVERAGE IN HIGH INCOME COUNTRIES, ALMOST 1 IN 4 PEOPLE HAS RECEIVED THE VACCINE.

IN LOW INCOME COUNTRIES, IT'S 1 IN MORE THAN 500.

SO I WANT TO ASK YOU, BECAUSE WE HAVE SEEN AFRICA, WHICH DOES NOT SEEM TO HAVE EXPLODED IN A CATASTROPHE THAT PEOPLE HAD PREDICTED GIVEN ITS MUCH LESS ROBUST PUBLIC HEALTH SYSTEM.

WE DON'T REALLY KNOW THE FULL EXTENT OF WHAT'S HAPPENING IN RUSSIA.

IT'S CLAIMED THAT THE CASES AND DEATHS ARE MUCH HIGHER THAN ARE BEING REPORTED.

BUT WE DO KNOW WHAT'S HAPPENING IN INDIA.

IT'S KIND OF A MELTDOWN RIGHT NOW.

THEY'RE QUITE GOOD COPING AT THE BEGINNING HAS MORPHED INTO A DISASTER.

EXPERTS ARE SAYING, I'M SURE YOU AGREE, THAT WHAT HAPPENS IN INDIA IS GOING TO SORT OF DOMINATE THE GLOBAL COVID RESPONSE AND THE REALITY.

SO, AGAIN, WHAT DO WE NEED TO BE LOOKING FOR IN THAT PART OF THE WORLD AS WELL OR TO HELP THAT PART OF THE WORLD?

YES.

YOU'RE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT.

WHAT'S MISSING IS COORDINATION OF THE PRODUCTION OF THE VACCINE.

WE SOLVED THE PROBLEM, AS I SAID, OF DISCOVERY, BRILLIANT SCIENCE.

NOW WE'VE GOT TO RAMP UP PRODUCTION IN EVERY PART OF THE WORLD.

NOW, THAT COULD MEAN TRANSFERRING TECHNOLOGY, LICENSING AGREEMENTS.

THAT IS SOMETHING THAT HAS BEEN DISCUSSED IN THE WORLD HEALTH ORGANIZATION.

BUT ONE WAY OR ANOTHER, WE'VE GOT TO RAMP UP THE SUPPLY.

I THINK THAT COULD BE DONE VERY QUICKLY, BECAUSE THERE ARE SO MANY VACCINES NOW AND AT THE SAME TIME POTENTIAL PRODUCERS ARE AVAILABLE.

THAT'S A LOGISTICS PROBLEM.

THEN YOU'VE GOT TO GET TO THE FINANCE.

WHAT AFRICA IS COMPLAINING ABOUT IS THEY'RE NOT GOING TO GET A SUPPLY OF VACCINE FOR A LONG TIME.

I THINK 70,000 PEOPLE ONLY HAVE BEEN FULLY VACCINATED IN SUB-SAHARAN AFRICA.

THAT COMPARES WITH 30 MILLION IN BRITAIN ALREADY.

SO THERE'S A JUSTIFIABLE COMPLAINT THAT THEY ARE GOING TO BE TREATED AS SECOND CLASS CITIZENS AND THAT CANNOT BE JUSTIFIED.

IT'S NOT THEIR FAULT THAT THE VIRUS IS THERE.

IT'S NOT THEIR FAULT THAT THEY ARE NOT INITIALLY PRODUCERS OF THE VACCINE, BUT WE'VE GOT TO GET THE VACCINE TO THEM AS QUICKLY AS POSSIBLE.

I TELL YOU FROM MY EXPERIENCE OF WORLD MEETINGS, THIS IS A DELIVERABLE AT THE JUNE THE 13th G7.

IT NEEDS THE COUNTRY TO GET ROUND THE TABLE TO SAY WE'VE GOT TO HAVE A BURDEN SHARING AGREEMENT.

THEN I CAN SUGGEST A NUMBER OF FINANCING MECHANISMS SO YOU CAN FRONT LOAD THE VACCINES SO THEY GET TO PEOPLE QUICKLY AND YOU PAY OVER A PERIOD OF TIME.

IT ALL CAN BE DONE IF THE GOVERNMENTS COULD GET THEIR ACT TOGETHER AND WORK TOGETHER.

YOU'RE THERE IN SCOTLAND, THIS BEAUTIFUL BACKGROUND.

I DON'T JUST BRING IT UP AS A LANDSCAPE ISSUE, BUT VERY SOON THERE'S GOING TO BE ANOTHER ELECTION IN MAY FOR THE LOCAL ELECTIONS.

IT'S CONSIDERED THAT NICHOLAS STURGEON, THE SNP WILL WIN VERY HANDILY AGAIN.

THEN THEY WANT TO, YOU KNOW, WITH UNDUE DELAY PUT THE REFERENDUM FOR INDEPENDENCE BACK ON THE TABLE.

WE'RE ALSO SEEING IN NORTHERN IRELAND THE FIRST PROTESTS IN MANY, MANY YEARS PARTLY ABOUT COVID LOCKDOWN, BUT PARTLY ABOUT BREXIT AND THE RULES THEY BELIEVE ARE THREATENING THEIR WAY OF LIFE.

AS A FORMER PRIME MINISTER WHO WAS THERE AT THE GOOD FRIDAY AGREEMENT, WHO PERSUADED, I THINK, SCOTLAND NOT TO GO FOR INDEPENDENCE LAST TIME AROUND, ARE YOU CONCERNED THAT THE UNION COULD BE FRAGMENTING NOW?

I THINK WE'VE GOT A BRITISH PROBLEM.

YOU MIGHT DEFINE IT AS A SCOTTISH PROBLEM AND THEN A NORTHERN IRELAND PROBLEM AND THEN WE MIGHT LOOK AS WHETHER THERE'S A WELSH PROBLEM AND AN ENGLISH REGIONAL PROBLEM.

I THINK THERE IS A BRITISH PROM THAT PEOPLE FEEL THAT THE GOVERNMENT AT THE CENTER IS OUT OF TOUCH, NOT LISTENING, NOT CONSULTING.

AND THAT'S A FEELING IN SCOTLAND, IT'S ALSO A FEELING IN NORTHERN IRELAND AND WALES.

IF YOU GO TO MANCHESTER, LIVERPOOL, NEW CASTLE, GO NORTH IN ENGLAND, IT'S ALSO A FEELING THERE.

THERE ARE VERY SPECIFIC THINGS IN SCOTLAND WHICH YOU CAN TALK ABOUT, VERY SPECIFIC THINGS IN NORTHERN IRELAND ABOUT THE BORDER BETWEEN NORTHERN IRELAND AND GREAT BRITAIN, BUT THERE IS A GENERAL SENSE THAT THIS MULTINATIONAL STATE HAS GOT TO REFORM AND CANNOT BE AS CENTRALIZED, CANNOT BE THE UNITARY STATE WHERE THE MAN IN WHITE HALL IS SAID TO KNOW BEST.

IT'S GOING TO CHANGE.

THAT'S WHERE THE PRESSURE IS GOING TO COME AFTER THESE MAY ELECTIONS.

IT'S GOING TO BE REALLY INTERESTING, BECAUSE SOME PEOPLE DURING THE HEAT OF BREXIT SAID WE'D RATHER SEE THE UNION COLLAPSE THAN NOT HAVE OUR BREXIT AND OUR DIVORCE FROM EUROPE AND THE EU.

SO IT'S GOING TO BE VERY INTERESTING TO SEE HOW THIS PLAYS OUT.

CAN I ASK YOU ON A WIDER BACKGROUND, YOU'VE NOTICED PROBABLY THIS HEIGHTENED TENSION BETWEEN NOT JUST THE UNITED STATES AND EUROPE AND IRAN OVER THE NUCLEAR AGREEMENT, BUT ISRAEL -- AND IT'S BEEN REPORTED IN THE ISRAELI PRESS AND THE U.S. PRESS THAT THERE SEEMS TO BE A COVERT SHIPPING WAR BETWEEN THE TWO COUNTRIES, ISRAEL AND IRAN.

NOW IT APPEARS THAT ISRAEL MAY HAVE HAD SOMETHING TO DO WITH A MALFUNCTION OR AN EXPLOSION AT THE LA TANS NUCLEAR STATION IN IRAN.

WHEN YOU LOOK AT ALL THAT, HOW WORRIED ARE YOU ABOUT YET ANOTHER WAR, ACCIDENTALLY OR NOT, IN THE MIDDLE EAST?

I THINK PRESIDENT BIDEN IS DOING THE RIGHT THING.

I THINK IF NEGOTIATIONS CAN START, I THINK THEY'LL GET A SETTLEMENT.

I THINK THERE'S TOO MUCH AT STAKE FOR BOTH AMERICA AND IRAN FOR THIS TO CONTINUE FOREVER, AND I DO THINK THAT WHAT WE ARE DEBATING IS HOW WE GET THIS AGREEMENT.

SO IRAN HAS GOT TO STOP ENRICHING URANIUM AND GOT TO GET BACK TO WHERE IT WAS AS FAR AS IS POSSIBLE.

AMERICA HAS GOT TO INSIST THAT THE SANCTIONS REMAIN UNTIL IRAN MAKES THESE STEPS.

AND, OF COURSE, THERE IS ISSUES ABOUT IRAN'S SUPPORT FOR REGIONAL TERRORISM, ITS OWN HUMAN RIGHTS RECORD ITSELF AND ALL THESE THINGS ARE GOING TO BE PART OF HOW THE SANCTIONS ARE WITHDRAWN SO THAT IRAN COMES BACK INTO THE AGREEMENT THAT WE HAD IN 2015.

NOW, IT MAY BE THAT PRESIDENT BIDEN WILL INSIST THAT IRAN TAKE STEPS TO DEAL WITH REGIONAL TERRORISM AS PART OF THAT, BUT IT WILL BE ROUGHLY SIMILAR TO THE DEAL OF 2015.

I DO THINK THAT PRESIDENT BIDEN, BY KEEPING HIS NERVE, BY BEING CALM AND COOL ABOUT THIS, ANTHONY BLINKEN OF COURSE DID THE ORIGINAL DEAL WITH PRESIDENT OBAMA.

I THINK THEY'VE GOT THE RIGHT NEGOTIATORS IN PLACE TO GET A DEAL.

I WOULD SAY WE'RE DEALING WITH THE SKIRMISHES THAT ARE GOING TO HAPPEN AND ARE BOUND TO HAPPEN BEFORE WE EVENTUALLY GET A NEW DEAL.

LET ME ASK YOU AS PRIME MINISTER, YOU HAD MANY AUDIENCES WITH THE QUEEN, OBVIOUSLY.

PRINCE PHILIP HAS DIED.

HE WAS HER HUSBAND FOR NEARLY 74 YEARS AND PARTNER IN CRIME, IF I COULD PUT IT THAT WAY.

HE WAS, SHE SAID, MY STRENGTH AND MY STAY.

WHAT WAS TO YOU WAS THE IMPRESSION YOU HAD OF HIM, OF THEM TOGETHER AND WHAT THEY BROUGHT TO THIS COUNTRY?

WELL, IF YOU MET THE QUEEN IN RECENT YEARS, AS I DID, AND YOU ASKED HER ABOUT THE WELFARE OF PRINCE PHILIP, YOU CAN SEE HER FACE LIGHT UP, SUCH WAS THE STRENGTH OF THE BOND BETWEEN THE TWO, SUCH WAS THE STRENGTH OF THAT RELATIONSHIP.

YOU CAN SEE WHEN PEOPLE ASKED ABOUT PRINCE PHILIP, SHE WAS VERY HAPPY INDEED THAT PEOPLE FELT THAT FOR HIM AS WELL AS FOR HER.

I THINK HE WILL GO DOWN AS SOMEONE WHO WAS A GREAT PUBLIC SERVANT.

BECAUSE I GREW UP WITH A PEACE CORPS THAT JOHN KENNEDY CREATED IN THE 1960s, BUT PRINCE PHILIP HAD CREATED IN 1955 THE DUKE OF EDINBURGH'S DEFENSE SCHEME.

THERE ARE MILLIONS OF YOUNG PEOPLE WHO HAVE BENEFITTED FROM THE PUBLIC SERVICE AND THE COMMUNITY WORK THAT WAS ENCOURAGED BY THE DUKE'S SCHEME.

I THINK HE'S MADE A HUGE CONTRIBUTION TO TWO OR THREE GENERATIONS OF YOUNG PEOPLE GROWING UP WITH THIS IDEA THAT THEY SHOULD BE COMMITTED TO PUBLIC SERVICE AND COMMUNITY ACTION.

AND THE PEACE CORPS IN THE STATES WAS SO IMPORTANT.

I THINK THE DUKE OF EDEN BOROUGH'S AWARDS SCHEME HAS BEEN REALLY IMPORTANT TO BRITAIN.

LET ME ASK YOU ABOUT THE CRISIS THAT'S HAPPENING HERE ABOUT LOBBYING AND THE REVOLVING DOOR.

DAVID CAMERON HAS ADMITTED TO ACTING WITHIN THE RULES BUT PERHAPS MAKING POOR JUDGMENT BY BEING SO CLOSE TO THIS BUSINESSMAN.

WHAT DO YOU THINK NEEDS TO HAPPEN TO PROTECT THE INTEGRITY OF GOVERNMENT AND GOVERNMENT DEALINGS WHILE AN OFFICE HOLDER IS IN PUBLIC OFFICE?

I DON'T KNOW ALL THE DETAILS OF DAVID CAMERON'S EVENTS, BUT I DO KNOW THERE SHOULD BE PRINCIPLES GOVERNING GOVERNMENT.

FORMER MINISTERS SHOULD NOT BE LOBBYING FOR COMMERCIAL CONTRACTS.

AND IF YOU HAVE TO PUT A TIME LIMIT, PUT A TIME LIMIT ON IT, BUT I DON'T THINK IT'S RIGHT IN THE FIRST PLACE.

THIRDLY, MINISTERS THEMSELVES, PEOPLE IN GOVERNMENT, SHOULD NOT BE ENTERTAINING THAT SORT OF LOBBYING FROM PEOPLE, WHETHER FORMER COLLEAGUES OR NOT.

GORDON BROWN, THANK YOU SO MUCH INDEED FOR JOINING US.

> WE TURN NOW TO THE LONGEST-SERVING CABINET MEMBER IN THE OBAMA ADMINISTRATION, TOM VILSACK, HAVING SERVED EIGHT YEARS AS AGRICULTURE SECRETARY UNDER THE FORMER PRESIDENT, VILSACK HAS RETURNED TO THE SAME POSITION FOR THE NEW BIDEN ADMINISTRATION.

HERE HE IS SPEAKING WITH OUR WALTER ISAACSON ABOUT THE ASSISTANCE HE HAS PROVIDED TO FARMERS THROUGHOUT THE PANDEMIC AS WELL AS HIS PLANS FOR REFORM.

THANK YOU.

SECRETARY TOM VILSACK, WELCOME TO THE SHOW.

GREAT TO BE WITH YOU.

YOUR AGRICULTURE DEPARTMENT BUDGET, 70% OF IT GOES TO NUTRITION ASSISTANCE, THINGS LIKE S.N.A.P. AND WHAT WE CALLED FOOD STAMPS.

TELL ME HOW DURING THE PANDEMIC WHAT YOU'RE DOING NOW.

OBVIOUSLY, THE PIVOT FROM FOOD SERVICE TO FOOD ASSISTANCE WASN'T AS SMOOTH AS ANY OF US WOULD HAVE LIKED, BUT THE REALITY IS THERE WERE A LOT OF PEOPLE IN NEED.

FIRST AND FOREMOST WE SAW AN INCREASE IN THE NEED FOR SNAP.

WE SAW AN INCREASE FOR THE AMOUNT OF SNAP.

A 15% INCREASE MEANS ABOUT $104 MORE COMING TO THE FAMILY BUDGET FOR THE NEXT SEVERAL MONTHS.

IT NOT ONLY HELPS THAT FAMILY BUY MORE FOOD, BUT IT ALSO KEEPS PEOPLE EMPLOYED.

THAT SNAP INCREASE SUPPORTS TENS OF THOUSANDS OF JOBS IF YOU THINK ABOUT IT.

EVERY FARMER BENEFITS FROM THAT AS WELL.

ROUGHLY 14 TO 15 CENTS OF EVERY FOOD DOLLAR SPENT AT THE GROCERY STORE ENDS UP IN A FARMER'S POCKET.

IT SUPPORTS THE ECONOMY DURING VERY DIFFICULT TIMES.

WE COMPLEMENTED SNAP WITH AN ADDITIONAL PROGRAM CALLED THE PANDEMIC EBT, RECOGNIZING MANY MOMS AND DADS SEND THEIR CHILDREN OFF TO SCHOOL.

THEY MAY GET SCHOOL BREAK FAST AND LUNCH, BUT WHEN SCHOOLS ARE SHUT DOWN THAT LUNCH AND BREAKFAST THEN BECOMES AGAIN THE FAMILY'S RESPONSIBILITY.

SO WE'RE PROVIDING ADDITIONAL SUPPORT FOR FAMILIES WHO FIND THEMSELVES WITH CHILDREN AT HOME BECAUSE SCHOOLS ARE SHUT DOWN WITH OUR EBT PROGRAM.

A LOT OF WAYS IN WHICH WE'RE TRYING TO HELP FAMILIES GET THROUGH THIS VERY DIFFICULT TIME.

THE NUTRITION SAFETY NET AFFECTS YOUNG CHILDREN OFTEN AND THE ELDERLY.

ARE YOU DOING THINGS NOW FOR LIKE HOMELESS YOUNGER PEOPLE OR PEOPLE WHO MAY HAVE BEEN AFFECTED BY THIS PANDEMIC THAT YOU DON'T NATURALLY SERVE?

THERE'S BEEN AN EXPANDED EFFORT IN TWO PHASES IN RESPONSE TO THAT QUESTION.

FIRST, ADDITIONAL RESOURCES FOR THOSE YOUTHS LIVING IN SHELTERS, AS YOU SAY, HOMELESS FOLKS WHO MAY BE TEENAGERS OR IN THEIR EARLY 20s FINDING THEMSELVES WITHOUT A JOB, WITHOUT A HOME.

WE'RE PROVIDING ADDITIONAL FOOD ASSISTANCE.

WE'RE ALSO LOOKING AT WAYS IN WHICH WE CAN MAKE THE AVAILABILITY OF FOOD ASSISTANCE MORE CONVENIENT BY PROVIDING 12.5 MILLION FAMILIES IN THE UNITED STATES ARE BENEFITTING FROM ONLINE PURCHASES AS OPPOSED TO HAVING TO GO TO THE GROCERY STORE.

I THINK WE'RE GOING TO LEARN FROM THIS PANDEMIC A NUMBER OF STRATEGIES TO MAKE BENEFITS MORE MEANINGFUL AND ALSO TO MODERNIZE THE SYSTEM SO PEOPLE CAN UTILIZE THEIR BENEFITS IN THE MOST CONVENIENT WAY POSSIBLE.

YOU HAVE HAD AN INTERESTING CHILDHOOD.

AS A BIOGRAPHER I'M ALWAYS LOOKING FOR CLUES OF WHAT DRIVES PEOPLE.

IT WAS A CHALLENGE.

YOU WERE AN ORPHAN.

A FAMILY THAT HAD ADDICTION PROBLEMS.

TELL ME ABOUT THAT AND HOW THAT HELPED SHAPE YOUR APPROACH.

WELL, I THINK MY MOM PROBABLY WAS THE GREATEST INFLUENCE IN MY LIFE PRIOR TO MEETING MY WIFE CHRISTY.

SHE BATTLED WITH ALCOHOL AND PRESCRIPTION DRUG ADDICTION.

SHE OVERCAME THAT ADDICTION.

ATTEMPTED SUICIDE A COUPLE OF TIMES, WAS VIOLENT AT TIMES, NOT AN EASY PERIOD OF TIME.

MY PARENTS SEPARATED FOR A WHILE.

I LIVED WITH MY DAD.

IT WAS A HARD TIME.

BUT MY MOM BASICALLY TAUGHT ME NEVER TO GIVE UP ON SOMETHING I TRULY BELIEVED IN.

SHE DIDN'T GIVE UP ON HERSELF AND WITH A LOT OF FAITH AND A LOT OF WORK BASICALLY GAINED HER SOBRIETY AND IN DOING SO I THINK TAUGHT MYSELF AND MY SISTER AN INCREDIBLY IMPORTANT VALUABLE LIFE LESSON, NEVER TO GIVE UP, NEVER TO GIVE UP ON THINGS THAT YOU CARE DEEPLY ABOUT.

THAT STOOD ME IN GOOD STEAD WHEN I RAN FOR GOVERNOR AND I WAS 20 POINTS BEHIND WITH A COUPLE OF WEEKS TO GO.

I DIDN'T GIVE UP AND AS A RESULT I ENDED UP WINNING AND HAD NOT ONLY A GREAT EXPERIENCE BEING GOVERNOR BUT NOW BEING SECRETARY OF AGRICULTURE TWICE.

SECRETARY OF AGRICULTURE DURING PRESIDENT OBAMA'S TENURE.

YOU ALSO TOOK ON THE OPIOID CRISIS.

WHY DID YOU DO THAT?

AND HOW FOCUSED WERE YOU ON THE RURAL AREAS, WHICH IS YOUR SPECIALTY?

I DID IT IN LARGE PART BECAUSE OF MY MOM AND RECOGNIZING THE CHALLENGE THAT OVERCOMING ADDICTION IS.

I DID IT BECAUSE I'M DEEPLY CONCERNED ABOUT THE OPPORTUNITIES IN RURAL AMERICA.

AS I THINK BILL CLINTON ONCE SAID, IF YOUR TOMORROW IS NOT BRIGHTER THAN YOUR TODAY, YOU CAN KIND OF UNDERSTAND WHY PEOPLE TURN TO DRUGS AND WHY THEY CAN BECOME POTENTIALLY ADDICTED.

CERTAINLY OPIOIDS ARE A VERY SERIOUS PROBLEM IN RURAL AREAS FOR MULTIPLE REASONS.

ONE, BECAUSE THE ECONOMY WASN'T AS STRONG, SO THE TOMORROWS WEREN'T GOING TO BE AS BRIGHT AS TODAY.

TWO, BECAUSE THERE WERE A LACK OF RESOURCES AVAILABLE TO PEOPLE THAT WANTED TO GET HELP.

AND THREE, IF YOU LIVE IN A SMALL TOWN, THE STIGMA OF ADDICTION CAN SOMETIMES MAKE IT DIFFICULT FOR YOU TO HAVE SUCCESS IN THE FUTURE.

IT WAS IMPORTANT, I THINK, FOR THE OBAMA ADMINISTRATION TO BEGIN THE PROCESS OF EDUCATING PEOPLE THIS IS A DISEASE, IT'S NOT A CHARACTER FLAW.

THAT'S ANOTHER LESSON I LEARNED FROM MY MOM.

IT'S NOT A CHARACTER FLAW.

IT'S NOT LIKE, WELL, IF YOU JUST TOUGH IT OUT, YOU CAN FIGURE THIS OUT.

THE AMERICAN FARM FAMILIES HAVE BEEN STRUGGLING.

SUICIDE RATES, OPIOIDS.

HOW DO YOU DEAL ESPECIALLY AS A DEMOCRAT WITH RURAL AMERICANS WHO THINK THE SYSTEM HAS LEFT THEM BEHIND AND TEND TO TAKE IT OUT ON THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY?

HOW ARE YOU RECONNECTING WITH FARM FAMILIES AND RURAL FAMILIES IN AMERICA?

FIRST AND FOREMOST, IT'S ABOUT RESPECT AND ACKNOWLEDGING WHAT PEOPLE IN RURAL AMERICA DO FOR THE REST OF US.

IF YOU THINK ABOUT THIS, THESE FOLKS PROVIDE MOST OF THE FOOD THAT WE RELY ON, A GOOD DEAL OF THE WATER THAT WE DRINK IS DIRECTLY CONNECTED TO THE WORK THAT THEY DO ON THE LAND.

THEY ARE THE PRODUCERS OF MOST OF THE RENEWABLE ENERGY THAT WE ARE CURRENTLY CONSUMING AND WANT TO CONSUME MORE OF.

THEY ARE THE HOLDERS AND PROTECTORS OF MOST OF THE ICONIC LANDSCAPES IN THIS COUNTRY AND THEY ARE PEOPLE THAT SEND THEIR SONS AND DAUGHTERS INTO THE MILITARY IN DISPROPORTIONATE NUMBERS.

THERE'S A VALUES SYSTEM IN RURAL AMERICA THAT I THINK IS IMPORTANT TO THE COUNTRY.

IT'S A VALUES SYSTEM THAT STRONGLY BELIEVES IN COMMUNITY AND RESPONSIBILITY IN GIVING SOMETHING BACK.

YOUNG PEOPLE LEARN THAT YOU CAN'T KEEP TAKING FROM THE LAND.

YOU HAVE TO REPLENISH IT.

NUMBER TWO, ALSO APPRECIATE THE EMOTIONAL STRESS THAT FOLKS WHO LIVE IN RURAL COMMUNITIES HAVE SEEN AS THEY'VE WATCHED THEIR COMMUNITIES SHRINK OVER TIME, AS THEY'VE WATCHED THEIR CHILDREN AND GRANDCHILDREN LEAVE FOR BETTER OPPORTUNITIES SOMEPLACE ELSE.

IT'S EMOTIONAL STRAIN.

SO I THINK IT'S INCUMBENT ON THE DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE AND THE SECRETARY OF AGRICULTURE TO DO EVERYTHING HE OR SHE CAN DO TO CREATE ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITY, TO REBUILD, TO REVITALIZE, TO TRANSFORM THOSE RURAL COMMUNITIES AND TO LET PEOPLE KNOW THAT'S WHAT YOU ARE FOCUSED ON EVERY SINGLE DAY.

I THINK THERE'S AN ENORMOUS OPPORTUNITY ESPECIALLY WITH CLIMATE.

I THINK CLIMATE, AS DIFFICULT, AS CHALLENGING AS IT'S GOING TO BE TO HAVE A CHANGING CLIMATE AND ALL THE CONSEQUENCES OF THAT, I THINK IT ALSO OPENS UP THE OPPORTUNITY TO SIMPLY REDEFINE AND TRANSFORM THE ENTIRE AMERICAN ECONOMY, PARTICULARLY IN RURAL PLACES.

YET THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY HAS BEEN SLAMMED IN RURAL AMERICA.

THAT'S BEEN THE GREAT NEW DIVIDE IN OUR COUNTRY BETWEEN RURAL AND URBAN.

WHAT'S THE PROBLEM THAT THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY HAS?

ARE THEY NOT SHOWING THAT RESPECT YOU JUST TALKED ABOUT?

YOU CAN'T BEAT SOMETHING WITH NOTHING.

FOR FAR TOO LONG THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY HAS FAILED TO PROVIDE AN ALTERNATIVE NARRATIVE TO FOLK WHO IS LIVE IN RURAL COMMUNITIES.

THE NARRATIVE THAT REPUBLICANS PROVIDE IS A SIMPLE ONE.

LESS GOVERNMENT, LESS TAXES.

IF YOU'RE JUST HANGING ON, IF YOU'RE JUST FIGURING OUT HOW TO MAKE THE PAYROLL OR JUST FIGURING OUT HOW TO MAKE ENDS MEET FROM WEEK TO WEEK, HANGING ON SOUNDS PRETTY GOOD AND LESS GOVERNMENT INTERFERENCE AND TAXES SOUNDS REALLY GOOD.

IF THERE'S A COMPETING NARRATIVE ABOUT AN ECONOMY THAT CREATES NEW REVENUE STREAMS FOR FARMERS, IF YOU CAN SAY TO FOLKS THERE'S MANUFACTURING COMING BACK TO RURAL COMMUNITIES, TRANSFORMING AGRICULTURE WASTE INTO A VARIETY OF NEW BIO-BASED PRODUCTS MOVING US AWAY FROM A FOSSIL FUEL ENVIRONMENT, NOW YOU'VE GOT A COMPETING NARRATIVE AND YOU HAVE A WAY IN WHICH YOU CAN ESSENTIALLY MAKE THE CASE YOUR LIFE CAN BE BETTER IF YOU ARE EMBRACING THE POLICIES THAT WE ARE ADVOCATING.

AND I THINK WE'RE NOW BEGINNING TO LEARN ABOUT THAT.

SO FIRST OF ALL, YOU HAVE TO HAVE SOMETHING.

SECONDLY, YOU'VE GOT TO BE PRESENT AND GO OUT AND SPEAK TO PEOPLE AND SOMETIMES LISTEN TO THE HARSH REALITY THAT YOU SOMETIMES GET WHEN YOU DO LISTEN TO FOLKS IN RURAL COMMUNITIES, HOW UPSET THEY MAY BE.

FINALLY, IT IS ABOUT THE RESPECT.

WHEN YOU GO AND LISTEN, THAT YOU RESPECT THE CONTRIBUTION FOLKS HAVE MADE AND YOU DON'T SEE THEM AS SOMETHING LESS.

YOU SERVED FOR A FULL EIGHT YEARS IN THE OBAMA ADMINISTRATION AS SECRETARY OZ AGRICULTURE, WHICH IS SOMEWHAT UNUSUAL TO MAKE IT THAT LONG.

AND THEN WHEN PRESIDENT BIDEN CAME IN, THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO WANTED TO BE AGRICULTURE SECRETARY AND YET THEY BRING YOU BACK FOR ANOTHER TERM.

WHY WERE THEY PUSHING TO HAVE YOU COME BACK AND WHAT DID YOU FEEL YOU STILL HAD TO DO YOU DIDN'T DO THE LAST TIME AROUND THAT MADE YOU FINALLY SAY YES?

I THINK DURING THE COURSE OF THE CAMPAIGN I CONVINCED THEN VICE PRESIDENT BIDEN THAT THERE WAS ENORMOUS OPPORTUNITY ON THE CLIMATE SIDE IN RURAL PLACES.

I THINK BECAUSE OF THAT YOU SAW THE PASSION WITH WHICH I DELIVERED THAT MESSAGE.

HE WANTED TO GIVE ME THE OPPORTUNITY TO MAKE GOOD ON WHAT I WAS SUGGESTING COULD HAPPEN.

AND I THINK IN TERMS OF THINGS THAT I WANTED TO DO OR THINGS THAT WERE LEFT UNDONE, THE REALITY IS THIS JOB IS NEVER DONE.

THERE ARE ALWAYS THINGS THAT NEED TO BE DONE OR NEED TO BE DONE BETTER OR DEEPER.

ONE OF THE THINGS WE NEEDED TO DO WAS TO CONTINUE THE WORK THAT WE STARTED IN THE OBAMA ADMINISTRATION OF DEALING WITH THE DISCRIMINATION, THE HISTORY OF DISCRIMINATION OF THE DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE FOR SOCIALLY DISADVANTAGED PRODUCERS.

AND THERE WAS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR US TO DIG DEEPER, FOR US TO ROOT OUT SYSTEMIC BARRIERS THAT EXIST IN THE DEPARTMENT TO PROVIDE A MORE EQUITABLE AND FAIR DEPARTMENT AND SORT OF CHANGE THE REPUTATION OF THE DEPARTMENT AMONG MINORITY PRODUCERS.

THAT WAS A BIG CHALLENGE AND A BIG OPPORTUNITY.

SO YOU'RE FOCUSING, AMONG OTHER THINGS, ON RACIAL EQUITY AS PART OF YOUR TENURE NOW.

EXPLAIN HOW THAT'S GOING TO WORK AND ESPECIALLY THE LOAN FORGIVENESS PROGRAM THAT WAS JUST PASSED.

IN THE OBAMA ADMINISTRATION THE FOCUS WAS ON TRYING TO COMPENSATE PEOPLE.

WHAT WE DIDN'T DO AND WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE IS BASICALLY TO TAKE A LOOK AT THE SYSTEMIC BARRIERS THAT EXIST IN THE PROGRAMS TODAY AND TO ADDRESS THE CUMULATIVE AFFECT OF THE DISCRIMINATION THAT OCCURRED.

WHEN YOU'RE DISCRIMINATED AGAINST, IT MEANT THAT YOU DIDN'T GET A LOAN OR YOU GOT A LOAN LATE OR YOU WEREN'T ABLE TO PUT YOUR CROP IN THE GROUND EXACTLY THE SAME TIME YOUR NEIGHBOR PUT THEIR CROP IN THE GROUND.

YOUR PRODUCTIVITY WAS LESS.

YOU DIDN'T HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO BUY THAT NEW PIECE OF EQUIPMENT OR EXPAND YOUR FARMING OPERATION WHEN LAND BECAME AVAILABLE.

OVER TIME YOUR OPERATION REMAINED STATIC.

YOUR NEIGHBOR'S OPERATION CONTINUED TO GROW.

NOW YOU'VE GOT USDA PROGRAMS THAT ESSENTIALLY PROVIDE HELP AND ASSISTANCE BASED ON PRODUCTION, BASED ON SIZE.

IF YOU'RE SMALL AND YOU DON'T HAVE AS MUCH PRODUCTION, YOU DON'T GET AS MUCH HELP.

IN THE RECENT COVID PAYMENTS TO FARMERS, ROUGHLY 25% OF THE FARMERS RECEIVING THOSE PAYMENTS SELF-IDENTIFIED AS WHITE, AFRICAN-AMERICAN, NATIVE AMERICAN, ET CETERA.

THAT SELF-IDENTIFIED POPULATION, BLACK FARMERS RECEIVED 20 MILLION DOLLAR OF ASSISTANCE AND HELP.

WHITE FARMERS RECEIVED BETWEEN 5 AND $6 BILLION IN HELP.

SO YOU ESSENTIALLY HAVE A GAP BETWEEN SOCIALLY DISADVANTAGED PRODUCERS AND THOSE WHO AREN'T SOCIALLY DISADVANTAGED.

THOSE WHO COULDN'T TAKE FULL ADVANTAGE OF THE PROGRAMS IN USDA AND THOSE WHO DO TAKE FULL ADVANTAGE OF THE PROGRAMS.

THE QUESTION IS, HOW DO YOU ADDRESS THAT GAP TO KEEP PEOPLE ON THE LAND AND ENCOURAGE NEW FARMERS.

WHAT WE'VE BEEN ABLE TO DO WITH THE DEBT RELIEF PROGRAM IS TAKE A FIRST STEP TOWARDS ALLOWING FOLKS TO STAY ON THE LAND AND NOW THE NEXT STEP AS PART OF THE AMERICAN RESCUE PLAN IS TO BEGIN CREATING WAYS IN WHICH LAND ACCESS, MARKET ACCESS AND TECHNICAL ASSISTANCE CAN BE PROVIDED SO THAT THE GAP FOR SOCIALLY DISADVANTAGED PRODUCERS CAN BE REDUCED.

IS IT HARD TO EXPLAIN THAT TO A WHITE FARMER WHO NEEDS DEBT RELIEF THAT THE DEBT RELIEF IS GOING ONLY TO THE SOCIALLY DISADVANTAGED FARMER AND THAT YOU'RE GIVING DEBT RELIEF TO BLACK FARMERS WHO MAY BE NEIGHBORS OF WHITE FARMERS WHO ARE STRUGGLING.

IT MAY BE DIFFICULT, BUT I THINK WHEN YOU EXPLAIN AND UNDERSTAND IN THE COVID RELIEF PACKAGE FOR EXAMPLE, BLACKERS -- BLACK FARMERS RECEIVED $5 MILLION.

TO THE EXTENT THAT THEY MAY FEEL THAT THIS ISN'T FAIR, NOW THEY MIGHT BE ABLE TO UNDERSTAND HOW THAT AFRICAN-AMERICAN FARMER MAY HAVE FELT FOR 20 OR 30 YEARS.

I THINK AT THE END OF THE DAY ALL OF US WHITE, BLACK, WHATEVER, HONESTLY WANT MORE PEOPLE ON THE LAND.

WE WANT PEOPLE TO FARM.

WE WANT DIVERSITY WITHIN AGRICULTURE, BOTH IN TERMS OF WHO'S FARMING BUT IN TERMS OF THE SIZE OF OPERATIONS AND THE METHOD OF OPERATION.

DIVERSITY IS AN INCREDIBLY IMPORTANT ASPECT OF A THAT HE WILL THINK AGRICULTURE ECONOMY.

TO WHAT EXTENT IS CLIMATE CHANGE AFFECTED BY THE AGRICULTURE SECTOR, AND WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO BE DOING ABOUT THAT?

U.S. AGRICULTURE IS ROUGHLY 9% OF OUR OVERALL U.S.

EMISSIONS.

GLOBALLY IT'S BETWEEN 14-15%. IN A SENSE U.S. AGRICULTURE IS DOING BETTER THAN INTERNATIONAL AGRICULTURE GENERALLY.

THERE ARE MANY THINGS WE CAN DO AND WILL BE DOING.

WE'LL BE SUPPORTING CLIMATE SMART AGRICULTURE PRACTICES, NO TILL, ROTATIONAL GRAZING WITH OUR CONVENTIONAL CONSERVATION PROGRAMS AND RENEWING AND UPPING OUR INVESTMENT IN THOSE CLIMATE SMART AGRICULTURAL PRACTICES.

TWO, WE'RE GOING TO OBVIOUSLY FOCUS ON METHANE AND METHANE REDUCTION.

THERE ARE FEED ADDITIVES WHICH CAN REDUCE METHANE.

THAT'S IMPORTANT BECAUSE WE WANT TO MAINTAIN THE ABILITY TO PRODUCE ANIMAL PROTEIN IF WE'RE GOING TO FEED A HUNGRY WORLD AND EVER INCREASING WORLD POPULATION, ANIMAL PROTEIN HAS TO BE PART OF THE EQUATION, BUT TO DO THAT WE HAVE TO DO IT IN A SUSTAINABLY EFFECTIVE WAY.

WE ALSO NEED TO CONVERT AGRICULTURAL WASTE.

IT WILL CREATE MANUFACTURING JOBS IN RURAL PLACES.

IT WILL ALSO PROVIDE AN OPPORTUNITY FOR US TO IMPROVE WATER QUALITY BECAUSE WE WON'T BE OVERAPPLYING THAT MANURE ON LAND THAT DOESN'T NEED IT.

WE ARE ABLE TO PRODUCE A SERIES OF BIOBASED AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS.

OVER A PERIOD OF TIME WE WILL GET TO PRESIDENT BIDEN'S GOAL OF A NET ZERO EMISSION U.S.

AGRICULTURE.

I THINK WE'LL SEE EARLY WINS IN THIS EFFORT IN TERMS OF HIS ADMINISTRATION AS WE LOOK AT WAYS IN WHICH WE CAN ENCOURAGE MORE CARBON SEQUESTRATION.

SECRETARY TOM VILSACK, THANK YOU SO VERY MUCH FOR JOINING US.

THANK YOU.

A VITAL EXISTENTIAL IMPORTANCE.

FINALLY WE MARK TWO NOTABLE SPORTS.

IN THE U.K. RACHEL BLACKMOORE BECAME THE FIRST EVER FEMALE JOCKEY TO WIN THE GRAND NATIONAL.

SHE WAS EXHILARATED AFTER HER HORSE SECURED THEIR PLACE IN HISTORY.

I DON'T FEEL MALE OR FEMALE RIGHT NOW.

I DON'T FEEL HUMAN.

THIS IS JUST UNBELIEVABLE.

YOU MIGHT REMEMBER THAT THE GRAND NATIONAL WAS ROMANTICISED.

IT'S THRILLING TO THINK THAT THERE ARE A LOT OF YOUNGSTERS IN JAPAN WATCHING TODAY HOPEFULLY IN FIVE OR TEN YEARS.

WE LOOK FORWARD TO THAT.

AND THAT IS IT FOR OUR PROGRAM TONIGHT.

REMEMBER, YOU CAN FOLLOW AND THE SHOW ON TWITTER.

THANK YOU FOR WATCHING 'AMANPOUR & COMPANY' ON PBS AND JOIN US AGAIN TOMORROW NIGHT.

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