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RUTGER BREGMAN, AUTHOR, “HUMANKIND”: This is such an exciting moment in history. I mean, historians have always known that crises are always opportunities for real shifts, right? And, you know, my new book is about this shift that’s been happening in the past 15 to 20 years in science. So, many scientists, from very diverse disciplines, from, you know, psychologist, sociologists, anthropologists, have been moving from a quite cynical view of human nature, to a much more hopeful view of who we are, as a species. And so, in this book, I wanted to connect the dots and show that something bigger is going on. And I guess that’s exactly what we need right now. A little more hopeful view of who we are and what we can do together if we collaborate.
CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR: So, OK. Today, for many people, you know, who support that party, it’s hopeful. But it comes amidst, you know, this terrible pandemic. The United States has the highest death toll. It’s not wrangled, yet. It’s still surging. We have this horrendous situation of the killing of unarmed black men mostly, black women as well, by white police. We have a reckoning for racial justice. And so, some people might not think it’s that hopeful. But you discuss the Overton window, which is the idea of a zeitgeist within a period of time. And I think you think, right now, is a particularly important time for that more progressive politics and attitudes in public life.
BREGMAN: Yes. Yes. Well, you know, if you would have told me, 10 years ago, by now, in 2020, you know, a 16-year-old Swedish girl kickstarted the biggest climate justice movement the world has ever seen. You know, we have seen the biggest protests in the history of the United States. Obviously, the killing of George Floyd. We have seen a newspaper like the “Financial Times,” not exactly a left-wing newspaper but even they are saying we need to reverse the policy direction of the last 40 years and think about things like higher taxes on the rich, a universal basic income to eradicate poverty, a green new deal, a much more activist role of the government. I mean, I just heard you talking about, you know, the role of Joe Biden and how sort of more progressive young people look at that. I mean, I just heard you talking about, you know, the role of Joe Biden and how sort of more progressive young people look at that. It’s — I mean, I’m thinking two things there. In the first place, this is the most progressive generation we’ve ever seen. If you look at millennials and people from Generation Z. You know, most highly educated, most ethnically diverse and very open to progressive issues. And then, Joe Biden is being pulled in their direction, right? If you look at his platform, you might think, well, be a little bit disappointed, for example, when you think about, you know, how much he is willing to invest to combat climate change. But he is actually more radical on climate change than Bernie Sanders was in 2016. So, that is sort of the shift that is happening in politics, and it’s happening very quickly. But you only see that, if you zoom out a little bit.
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A core criticism of Harris during the race for the Democratic nomination concerned her career as a prosecutor in California. Having earned a reputation for being tough on crime, she now says that she is determined to combat systemic racial injustice. Activist DeRay Mckesson has spent years drawing attention to institutionalized racism, and he joins the show to discuss Harris’ place on the ticket.
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