Artist Ai Weiwei on His New Graphic Memoir “Zodiac”

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, HOST: Now, when art meets activism. Exiled Chinese dissident and renowned artist Ai Weiwei is known for challenging authoritarian politics through his work, and was even detained in China for 81 days on charge of state subversion back in 2011. But has not deterred his fight for intellectual freedom. A noble pursuit passed down to him by his late father, a celebrated poet. Now, Ai Weiwei is exploring that relationship and his own life story in a new graphic memoir, “Zodiac.” He tells Hari Sreenivasan how those memories connect to stories of Chinese astrological signs.

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HARI SREENIVASAN, CORRESPONDENT: Christiane, thanks. Ai Weiwei, thank you so much for being here. Your latest book, “Zodiac,” is a graphic memoir. And I’m wondering, it’s not just a comic book. We’re talking about part art history, part expression of your life. Why a graphic novel?

AI WEIWEI, ARTIST AND AUTHOR: When I grew up in communist society, probably the only chance to have some images in your hand is a — we call it a little people’s book. It’s about the size of your palm and you read page by page. It’s all about the revolutionary stories, which is very touching. And I still kind of memorize all the images. So, I think the graphic novel, it comes very handy because — you know, because of the images. And the less language. That’s also important. I give people a lot of space for imagination.

SREENIVASAN: So, if there’s a young person that picks up this book today, similar to what the graphic novels of your generation might have had, is there a purpose? Is there a point? Is there something you want a young person that might be reading this to take away?

WEIWEI: I think the book — actually, I didn’t do — read so much graphic novels in the West. But this book, I think, I have a lot of mixed information about personal experience about the father and the son, and also about the mystical images about Zodiacs, which can relate to human character and also even relate to political situation. Like this year is going to be a year of the dragon in China. And the year of dragon supposed to be something very unpredictable, can be quite a big change or can be very — you know, very dangerous or harsh. So, you know — but, you know, why you have 1.4 billion people believe in those things and not it’s made it a little bit accountable.

SREENIVASAN: Yes, for those of our audience members who don’t know, your father and your family was basically exiled because he was a poet. And as you point out in the book, he wasn’t really writing horrible things about the state or challenging the Chinese government, but you were still, at one point, living underground in the Gobi Desert, is that right, for five years as a kid?

WEIWEI: That’s true. He exiled for 20 years. I was born the year he was exiled. So, we leave the underground. You know, dug out in Gobi Desert for five years. And that he’s claim (ph) public comments. So, he still today being considered as the most popular poise, very patriotic. You know, they later, they give him, you know, honor back to them. But still the kind of extreme situation one authority do not like your voice, or do not like your — even just the attitude, then you’re dead. You’re not possible. But we see this sense also happens in the — in U.S. or in the West. Certain sense is unspeakable. Certain sense you cannot talk about. Even you believe the facts, the truth still — that will endanger your life. And that is scary. You know, we have one life. And why we have to be kidnapped by certain kind of beliefs, which we know is wrong. We know — you know, the facts and — the facts is obvious. We can easily think this, we cannot allow it to happen to our family or to our kids or to our neighborhood or to the people we know, but we cannot speak out what is about, how do we look at ourself?

SREENIVASAN: What do you think that early experience of living with the consequences of how your father was treated? Do you think there’s a connection between that and how you’re living today? And I wonder if that also transmits down to your son.

WEIWEI: I think my situation, even my father would not exactly agree, but I think my life is an extension of his life. It’s about pays the price to speak out the truth, inner truth, or to stay on the — you know, on the factual side. And that means you have to pay for that. That means you know, the so-called freedom is never come for free. It’s really, you. Someone would have to pay for your freedom. And I hope I did this, and it can change the situation a little bit better for my son. I don’t want him to repeat my experience or his grandfather’s experience.

SREENIVASAN: So, what is the world that you wish your son can grow up in? I mean, do you think that he can grow up in China as the son of Ai Weiwei and the grandson of your father, practice art, be free in his expression?

WEIWEI: My son’s first English sentence is, no more, I wouldn’t be. I was very proud of the first sentence. And I — for that moment, I understand that he’s very — it will be a very good son. And that he will live a normal life, as he said, you know, he wants to be a normal life. He doesn’t really agree with stuff that I’m doing. And I think the independency is the true power, power for every individual. But that’s real (ph). If you talk to someone, you can see the ideas or judgment, very often, it’s not a really independent judgment.

SREENIVASAN: You know, you didn’t talk about your father much earlier in your career, and you mentioned him a lot more in this book. And I’m wondering, has something changed? Is it age? Nostalgia? How come you’re being a little bit more open about it now?

WEIWEI: Thank you for asking that. I always avoid to associate myself with him, because we all know he’s the enemy of the state. Even I don’t agree with that, but still, I don’t want to know what he’s really struggled for. You know, life — it’s just — it’s so much burden. And but — I was arrest sitting in this — in front of our interrogators, and I realized eight years apart, we come back to a full circle. So, we still have to recognize as a human being, it doesn’t matter how advanced a technology or how much comfort that we have, still, we are in a very questionable or crucial condition. And that they have to defend those very essential rights, you know, individual rights, human rights, and freedom of speech.

SREENIVASAN: You had recently put out a tweet about the situation in Israel and Gaza. And I want to read a little bit of it. It said, the sense of guilt around the persecution of the Jewish people has been, at times, transferred to offset the Arab world. Financially, culturally, and in terms of media influence, the Jewish community has had a significant presence in the United States. The annual $3 billion aid package to Israel has, for decades, been touted as one of the most valuable investments the United States has ever made. This partnership is often described as one of shared destiny. Now, you have since deleted that tweet, but it had a ripple effect on art shows that you were about to have in major European cities, in London, in Paris. And I wonder, what did you think of that effect? I mean, the galleries that signed up to host your work, they know who you are. They know that you are politically challenging the status quo in almost every case.

WEIWEI: Well, it’s not about me. You know, it’s about today, we cannot allow any idea or voice, which is different from someone who would like those to be. So, that even not as a factual, that is truth. They cannot accept the gray area. They would ask you yes or no. They cannot say — otherwise, it’s not possible. So, it may come to stage, which is really about not allowed freedom of thinking and the freedom of expression. So, that is a very troublesome time because they lost the foundation of — to have a civilized society to really have patience, even to have compassion for someone being different and to think differently or to have a different voice. So, I think this is very a troublesome time.

SREENIVASAN: Do you see this as something that’s happening the world over? I mean, yes, there’s your opinion on this specific conflict. But are you concerned that there is a chilling effect on freedom of expression, not just in China, but in the West as well?

WEIWEI: I used — we used to think it’s in authoritarian states, China or North Korea, or probably Cuba, you know. But now, we see what happens in the West can be even more surprising. It can be something we can never imagine. Universities has — can be questioned by government and that can be dismissed. This is absolutely a very bad sign for so-called the liberal world or free world, and not only shows the weakness of our beliefs and that we don’t have this kind of — you know, how we look at ourselves if we cannot allow any argument. And that is very troublesome.

SREENIVASAN: You know, you were in the United States in the ’90s as a young man and you were going to school. And I’ve read that you were so fascinated by the Iran-Contra hearings that you were actually watching the government kind of publicly display this sort of house cleaning and being transparent and open. And I wonder now, a few decades later, what do you think of sort of the American state of our ability to be open? Because we see challenges here in how our democracy is moving forward. Do you?

WEIWEI: I see — when I first time hear Iran-Contra hearing, I was pretty surprised. And — but I still think the society still holds justice and open, you know, transparency very high. But today, not only the media, but also the just so-called judicial system and all become a partisans (ph) and that they all are — they — what they did is really beyond surprising, really. And, you know, I’m only making China and the Russian laughing about the West. You cannot — yes, everybody would laughing. You know, China, people want to talk about the U.S. is no longer to see as a land for the brave and the liberals, but rather a bigger corruption on both sides. So, that is — it’s such a backwards. And the question is, what we’re trying to establish as a modern society for years and will collapse at the one second.

SREENIVASAN: You know, you write in the book that there — any artist who isn’t an activist is a dead artist. And I wonder, in the climate that you’re describing, if there is this kind of increased scrutiny on expression and freedom. How should an artist proceed when their work or their views might be in greater danger?

WEIWEI: Well, artists basically is a human being who is not very practically functioning. And that’s why their voice are very important, because they don’t have to say something which against their intuition or their sensitivity. But today’s artists are very corrupted, because of education, because of the market, because of the, you know, capitalism, and made everything measured by price. So, there’s a very few artists willing to openly just give out their opinions or to express it successfully to — you know, to communicate with artistic way. You know, to give a unique position. And so, that’s the condition.

SREENIVASAN: What’s your relationship to China now? Is there still a longing for, I don’t know, a sense of home or, you know, you’re not living there anymore?

WEIWEI: I’m not living there anymore. I don’t have this kind of nostalgia feeling about China because I always been seen as someone who is anti- revolution. So, I’ve always been pushed away when I was in China, even before I understand what exactly they mean. But still, I’m a Chinese. I speak Chinese. I hold a Chinese passport. I never changed my nationality. That means I’m a bit of a stubborn person. I used to say, I’m not — I don’t want to leave. They should leave. But now I left. And I wish them well. And I still pay attention to what’s happening there. And, you know, I just wish them well. So —

SREENIVASAN: You have made art, whether it’s life vests to talk about the migrants that are coming on shore in Lesbos or a snake made of backpacks to think about the children who were killed in the earthquake in China. How do you conceptualize a work to try to distill a big idea into something graspable?

WEIWEI: As artists, you need certain materials and form to carry out your expression or even argument. You know, I visited 20 nations and 40 different camps, interviewed hundreds of, you know, refugees. It’s just preparing myself to know better. Then if I give a simple conclusion, I think all those effort is trying to give integrity to human conditions, you know, trying to recognize they are the same, you know, even they look different.

SREENIVASAN: Yes.

WEIWEI: So, I recognize that they should be kind to each other or to — at least to be — have a compassion. And you know, otherwise, we are still living in a very barbarian society as there’s no hope.

SREENIVASAN: Ai Weiwei, thank you so much for your time.

WEIWEI: Thank you.