Barbara Boxer and Van Jones Discuss the 2020 Race

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR: So, let me ask each of you to weigh in on your take on what the Supreme Court has said about gerrymandering. Should we go to — ladies first, Senator Boxer?

FMR. SEN. BARBARA BOXER (D-CA): Sure. I think the court missed an important opportunity to make sure that our elections are fair. And in full disclosure, I want you to know that I have evolved on this issue, because when I grew up in democratic politics, I had a very sharp view of redistricting and it was, look, if Democrats are in power in the state legislature, let them draw the lines however they want and vice versa. If you lose to the Republicans, that’s their responsibility, and every 10 years, these lines are drawn. Now, I have changed. And I say words that I hate to say because politicians hate to say them, “I was wrong.” And we have now a commission in California, a nonpartisan commission drawing the lines. It’s so fair and it is so much better for the communities because if you believe in one person one vote, then these lines have to be drawn fairly.

AMANPOUR: So, Van, to you, then, because this is obviously a whole now new generation of Democrats who are competing to be president. What real world impact will the gerrymandering decision have, particularly in this upcoming race?

VAN JONES, FORMER SPECIAL ADVISER TO BARACK OBAMA, CNN HOST: Well, listen, for the presidential race, it won’t affect it because we do the presidential race by, you know, the total state. But inside these states, the way that politicians can now draw these lines is mind-boggling. They have data on each and every individual household. So, you can literally take a community, say, a vote 60 percent for the Democrats. But you can draw the lines so the seats are appropriated 60 percent for the Republicans. It’s unbelievable. And there’s no longer kind of guess work and hunch work. You can bring in big data to do this down to the household level. And so, for the Supreme Court to step back and act like, “Hey, this is no big deal. We don’t — you know, don’t ask us to get involved,” means this extreme gerrymandering will continue. And I will just say, part of the reason that the discourse in the country has gotten so polarized is because people — because politicians are now picking their voters instead of the voters picking the politicians. And so, Republicans are just picking, you know, a very safe place for them to be. They spread out democratic power so the Democrats don’t have as much representation as our numbers would give us, and it’s bad. It’s really bad.

AMANPOUR: And just quickly and briefly on this issue before we turn to the —

BOXER: Can I jump in?

AMANPOUR: Yes.

BOXER: I was just going to jump in to say this. I was listening to Ben Cardin, senator from Maryland, he says that there is some legislation there that would outlaw this type of gerrymandering and put in place this type of commissions. So, all is not last. But Van is right, if this continues, it is very unfair to the people.