Billy Porter: “I Fought for Years to Be Masculine Enough”

AMANPOUR: Incredible performances. And Broadway also brought my next guest career center stage. Billy Porter made his name as Lola in “Kinky Boots.” He then went on to become the first openly gay black man to win an Emmy as the lead actor for “Pose.” And is a key figure in the movement Degender Fashion. Porter’s new biography titled, “Unprotected,” is a powerful reflection on race, sexuality, art and healing. And here he is talking to Michel Martin about fame and grappling with the structures around masculinity.

(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)

MICHEL MARTIN, CONTRIBUTOR: Thanks, Christiane. Billy Porter, thank you so much for joining us.

BILLY PORTER, AUTHOR, “UNPROTECTED,” AWARD-WINNING ACTOR AND SINGER: Thanks for having me.

MARTIN: You have become a fashion icon as well as, you know, a multi- talented performer. You are a director. And now, you’ve written this book, which I have to say, is raw and kind of searing in its candor about some of the most tender moments of your life, really, from the first words, you are putting your story out there. Your identity as an out gay black man has been so central to your story from the very beginning. But how did you first know that you were different in a way that bothered people for whatever reason?

PORTER: Well, it was like, I was five. You know, but I was in a house full of women and very religious people, and you’re born gay. We’re born this way. And I was a sissy. I was what traditionally is called a sissy and everybody was concerned that that was because I was hanging out with too many women and that all they needed to do was fix me. Fix that. A femenisy (ph). You’re not masculine enough. The masculine conversation at five. It was already happening without me. It was happening about me and around me, without me having any say, you know.

MARTIN: But one of the things that fascinates me about you, on the one hand, you are not shy about naming the people and the places and the things that have hurt you. But you also talk about the gifts that these people and places and things gave you. Even your stepfather who you are very clear molested you from a very early age.

PORTER: Yes.

MARTIN: It’s remarkable to me that you can be so clear about the ways in which he harmed you and yet, be so generous in describing the gifts that he gave you. How do you sit with that?

PORTER: Well, it’s like — it’s holding space, you know, that man is my sister’s father. My sister is the closest human being, she’s my best friend. We have to process that. We have to hold space for all of that. We have to talk about it. You know, we can’t be silent about it. That’s the problem. The silence is the killer. We have to talk about it so that we can move through it so that we can heal from it so there can be forgiveness and we can heal and move on. Move on to be better people.

MARTIN: This is not of the same order of magnitude at all. But recently, there was this, as I mentioned at the beginning, you have become like a fashion icon, a trailblazer for wearing, not just the fabulousness, but of exploring kind gender norms and —

PORTER: Be gendering of fashion.

MARTIN: And there is recently this kind of — I don’t know what you want to call it, sort of a dust-up over your critique of the fact “Vogue” put Harry Styles on the cover wearing a dress. So, tell me, what’s the larger critique that you’re making here?

PORTER: Well, the larger critique that I’m making is this. There are systems of oppression and erasure in our culture and around the world that have permeated and poisoned everything, right? When people of color contribute and are leaders of something, I personally am a leader, not the only one, let’s be clear and I never said that. I’m not the only leader of this revolution, but I am one of them. The part of the story that people don’t know is that earlier in 2019, I sat on a stage with Anna Wintour in front of the Conde Nast staff for their yearly summit or whatever, I don’t know what it’s called, one on one. We had a wonderful conversation. At the end of the conversation, she asked, how can we do better? It was the first time in my life that I was speechless. And I didn’t answer her in the way that I should have because I was too scared. What I should have said to her was, put me on the cover. Put me on the cover. And let’s have this conversation. That’s what I should have said. Or put somebody else who’s a leader on the cover and use your power as “Vogue” to elevate these voices and this conversation. I didn’t say that. Five months later, Harry Styles is on the cover of “Vogue.” first man in a dress. The reason why I apologize to Harry Styles was because the gaslighting and the distraction of his name takes us away from the real conversation. It’s not about him. It’s about the systems of oppression that make it the choice, that make him the choice to have that conversation, to put him in a position. When “Vogue” is doing that, they’re putting him in a position of leadership for this movement. He’s not a leader in this movement. That’s all I’m saying.

MARTIN: Why do you think this matters so much? Particularly, if I may, the fashion piece, the sort of degendering fashion, the kind of — the statements you make through your appearances, through — I mean, apart from just the fabulousness?

PORTER: Yes, I just think it’s — I think it is — it challenges the masculinity conversation. And the masculinity conversation is the only conversation in our world. To be masculine is to be the best. To be better. You know, we have gotten over women wearing pants. There was a time when women wearing pants was a problem. We got over that quick. Because a business suit is strong. A business suit is considered powerful. Pants are considered powerful. Dresses, femininity, is not. So, basically, what you’re saying and what we’re saying consciously and unconsciously is to be masculine is better than being feminine. Being feminine is less than being masculine. And I don’t care anymore. Right? I lived my whole life never being masculine enough. I fought for years to be masculine enough, to be perceived as masculine enough so that I could eat and I never was, so I stopped trying. And when I was trying to be masculine, I was broke and unemployed. Bankrupt and unemployed. When I leaned into my truth and my authenticity, look at what’s happened.

MARTIN: When you receive the Emmy, I just want to point out, you won the 2019 Primetime Emmy Award for Outstanding Lead Actor in a drama series. That’s for your portrayal of Pray Tell in “Pose.” You’re the first openly gay black man to be nominated and winning any lead acting category. How do you understand that moment? What that — how did you receive that?

PORTER: I am humbled. You know, it’s thrilling. And for me, as a black queer out man, the awards matter. They open up a different kind of door for me. You know, that would never have been opened before. The good news is that I was the first, I broke the glass ceiling. The complicated news is, there’s still a glass ceiling about that. You know, there’s still a glass ceiling. It’s still a conversation for a man to show up in a dress. There’s still a conversation. It still stops everything cold when a boy is wearing a dress in public. Like, OK. You know.

MARTIN: I was thinking more about the boy you were growing up in the Pittsburgh area though, who — I mean, you were bullied from the word go. I mean, you —

PORTER: Yes.

MARTIN: I have to say, as a parent myself, I mean, those passages were so hard because it speaks to the title of your book, “Unprotected.” You were so unprotected. Talk more about like the arts though as a refuge for you. Tell me about how you figured that out.

PORTER: It is the most profound part of the journey. You know, sixth grade, I was introduced to theatre. Rise and Shine Musical Theatre, Rise and Shine Middle School. And I was just changed. I was forever changed. I was bit by the bug. There was a group of people who understood me, who respected me. I have found my tribe, and I have found a group of people whose minds weren’t expansive, which allowed for me to expand my mind outside of the religious bubble that was the only thing that I knew and the only thing that everybody around me knew. It was magical to find the refuge inside of all of that trauma that I was going through.

MARTIN: But how then did you face the constant rejection? I mean, you faced that so often as an actor, as an artist. I mean, how did you —

PORTER: This is probably going to sound egoic, and I don’t like to sound that way but it’s just the truth. I’m talented. I know I’m talented. And I have worked at every part of it, never once have I leaned back on those talented laurels. I went to school. I studied every single bit of it. There was a part of me that always knew that the rejection that I was receiving did not have anything to do with me or my talent.

MARTIN: Why do you think you knew that?

PORTER: Because I’m a black man in America. You got to be 10 times better than your — you know, it’s like — and it’s true. I sat and watched all my white counterparts become stars and work all the time. If they weren’t stars, they were working all the time and I was unemployed and bankrupt, for years. I stayed in it. I stayed in it. You’ve got to stay in it. You know, I stayed in it and my number got called.

MARTIN: And what about “Pose”? Like what has that meant to you? It’s my understanding that Pray tell was actually written for you.

PORTER: Yes. Yes, it was.

MARTIN: And what has that meant to you?

PORTER: It’s was — it’s everything. 1995, I went and I saw Tony Kushner’s “Angels in America.” On Broadway. First time I had ever seen a gay character played by the brilliant Jeffrey Wright who wasn’t the butt of the joke, who wasn’t, you know, reviled, who was the moral and spiritual compass of the story. First time I saw it, changed the trajectory of my life. I took myself out of what — of the trajectory that it was and started down the road less traveled. That was 1994. I went through a lot of stuff in between 1994 and 2010. 2010, I come back after not having worked for 10 years to the revival of “Angels of America” off Broadway playing believe. When I looked at — when I went to that play, I said, that is the kind of art that I want to do and nobody knows. By 2010, they knew. By 2013, it was “Kinky Boots.” And then by 2016, it was “Pose.” And that is the culmination and the affirmation of me choosing myself, of me choosing service. If service is your intention, everything else will work itself out. I ask myself, what does service look like for me in an industry and a world that’s inherently looked narcissistic? Hit me like a ton of bricks. It’s your queerness. Queerness, when nobody else was being queer. Queerness when me leaning into my queerness meant I was unemployed and bankrupt. But I leaned into it anyway. And all of these years later, here I sit in the middle of my service, in the middle of my calling, in the middle of my ministry, right in the center of it.

MARTIN: Earlier this year, you disclosed you’ve been living with HIV for 14 years. Would you mind sharing about your decision to talk about it?

PORTER: Yes. You know, well, let me share my decision to not talk about it first.

MARTIN: OK.

PORTER: You know, 2007 was one of the worst years of my life. You know, February, I was diagnosed with hereditary type 2 diabetes. March, I was signing bankruptcy papers. And by June, I was HIV positive. Every statistic, I became the statistic that everybody said I would be. It almost took me out. That almost took me out of here. And the only way I could deal with it in the moment was to not talk about it and stay busy. I also didn’t want to talk about it because I didn’t want my mother to have to go through yet another — you know, she was vilified by her religious community because I was gay. And I wouldn’t conform to what they thought that I should conform to and she took a lot of stuff for that. And I didn’t want her to have to live through the I told you so that would come with me revealing that diagnosis. So, I sat in the shame and I sat in the silence and I was dying a slow death for 14 years. When I booked Pray Tell on “Pose,” I knew there was a healing coming. I knew that whatever this character was, was going to stand in proxy for a journey toward my own healing. I knew it was going to. Because art has always been that for me. So, I allowed myself to lean into that.

MARTIN: And in fact, Pray Tell does — there is a story line in “Pose” where Pray Tell is living through his illness and in despair at some point.

PORTER: Yes. Yes.

MARTIN: And so, the community lets him know how much they love and need him. And so, has the community done that for you, Billy Porter?

PORTER: Yes, yes. And, you know, Pray Tell dies. And I remember going in on the day that I was shooting that scene and I said, today is the death of Pray Tell, but the rebirth of Billy.

MARTIN: Well, thank you so much, Billy Porter, for talking with us.

PORTER: Thank you. It was a delight.