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> HELLO, EVERYONE AND WELCOME TO 'AMANPOUR AND COMPANY'.
PEOPLE NEED TO BE CONSCIOUS OF THE RULES OF CLASSIFIED INFORMATION.
THOSE RULES ARE THERE FOR A REASON.
THE GROWING CONTROVERSY AROUND CLASSIFIED DOCUMENTS.
HOW DO THESE CASES DIFFER?
DOES THE RULE GO TOO FAR AND WHAT ARE THE IMPLICATIONS?
LEON PANETTA JOINS US.
> AS UKRAINE PREPARES FOR THE NEXT PHASE OF THE WAR, THE WEST CONTINUES TO PUNISH RUSSIA BUT ARE SANCTIONS WORKING?
> PLUS.
TRYING TO FIGURE OUT THE BUSINESS WHEN THE PROSPECTS AREN'T AS GOOD.
IS THE TECH INDUSTRY IN TROUBLE?
DECODING THE HEADLINES AND FINALLY.
THESE TAPES, THIS SHOW, THE DEVIL'S CONFESSION WILL STAND AGAINST HOLOCAUST DENIERS THAT ARE STILL EXISTING TO THIS DAY.
ON HOLOCAUST MEMORIAL DAY, WE LOOK BACK ABOUT THE DOCUMENTARY 'THE DEVIL'S CONFESSION' EXPOSING THE CRIMES OF CHIEF ARCTIC OF HITLER'S FINAL SOLUTION.
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> WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM, EVERYONE.
EX PRESIDENTS AND VICE PRESIDENTS WILL BE TOLD TO CHECK PERSONAL RECORDS FOR CLASSIFIED DOCUMENTS.
OF COURSE, THIS COMES AFTER SOME WERE FOUND AT THE INDIANA HOME OF FORMER VICE PRESIDENT MIKE PENCE.
IT IS THE LATEST GROWING CONTROVERSY.
THEY ARE MEANT TO GO TO THE NATIONAL ARCHIVES ONCE LEAVING OFFICE.
PENCE AND BIDEN MOVED QUICKLY TO TURNOVER THE MATERIALS FOUND AT THEIR HOMES AT THE FBI IN STARK CONTRAST TO DONALD TRUMP, A REMINDER THAT HE'S FACING A CRIMINAL INVESTIGATION.
THE FORMER PRESIDENT REFUSED TO HAND OVER DOCUMENTS LEADING TO A SEARCH OF HIS MAR-A-LAGO HOME.
THIS CONTROVERSY LED TO MANY QUESTIONS, WHAT CONSTITUTES A CLASSIFIED DOCUMENT, WHAT'S THE PROCESS ONCE A PRESIDENT LEAVES OFFICE AND IS THE SYSTEM WORKING?
JOINING ME IS FORMER CIA DIRECTOR AND SECRETARY UNDER PRESIDENT OBAMA AND CHIEF OF STAFF FOR PRESIDENT CLINTON.
MR. SECRETARY, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.
SO WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF BALLOONING PROBLEM BEING FOUND AT FORMER PRESIDENT'S AND VICE PRESIDENT'S HOME?
IT RAISES CONCERNS.
SOMEONE LIKE MYSELF AS DIRECTOR OF THE CIA WHO HAD TO DEPLOY AGENTS INTO HARM'S WAY IN ORDER TO GATHER VERY SENSITIVE INTELLIGENCE ON OUR CLASSIFICATION CASE TO PROTECH NATIONAL SECURITY AND TO HAVE THESE DOCUMENTS BEING MISHANDLED RAISES CONCERNS ABOUT WHETHER ANY OF THIS RESULTED IN JEOPARDIZING NATIONAL SECURITY.
SOME OF THESE DOCUMENTS FROM THE PRESIDENT'S CASE, PRESIDENT BIDEN GO BACK TO HIS DAYS AS A SENATOR.
SO WHEN YOU RAISE THE QUESTION AND CONCERN ABOUT WHAT THIS MEANS FOR AGENTS ON THE GROUND, WHAT DOES THIS ALSO MEAN AND ARE YOU CONCERNED AT ALL ABOUT FUTURE RECRUITMENT IN THE AGENCY AND FOR ANY OF THOSE WHO ARE PUTTING THEIR LIVES ON THE LINE NOW READING THESE HEADLINES WHETHER OR NOT THAT'S GOING TO MAKE THEM THINK TWICE ABOUT JOINING THE CIA AND OTHER INTEL AGENCIES.
I DON'T THINK THERE IS ANY QUESTION IT HAS AN IMPACT.
IF YOU'RE OUT THERE PUTTING YOUR LIFE ON THE LINE IN ORDER TO GATHER SENSITIVE INFORMATION AND WINDING UP SEEING THAT INFORMATION NOT HANDLED AS IT SHOULD BE AS CLASSIFIED MATERIAL, THAT'S DISCOURAGING.
AND IT IS GOING TO IMPACT.
AND FRANKLY, WHAT I SENSE RIGHT NOW IS THAT WHAT WE'RE DEALING WITH MAY BE THE TIP OF THE ICEBERG IN THE SENSE THAT ALTHOUGH THIS INVOLVES PRESIDENTS AND VICE PRESIDENTS AND THEIR MISHANDLING OF CLASSIFIED INFORMATION, THERE ARE LITERALLY HUNDREDS AND THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE THAT HAVE ACCESS TO CLASSIFIED INFORMATION AND ONE HAS TO WONDER JUST EXACTLY WHAT KIND OF STANDARDS ARE BEING IMPLEMENTED TO PROTECT THE MATERIAL.
WHAT STANDARDS WERE YOU AWARE OF?
YOU SERVED AS A CONGRESSMAN AND CHIEF OF STAFF AND SERVED AS A CABINET SECRETARY, AS WELL.
WHAT WERE THE STANDARDS TO YOUR KNOWLEDGE?
WE HAVE TO UNDERSTAND IN SOMEWAYS THIS IS A MAZE OR PATCH WORK OF EXECUTIVE ORDERS, OF REGULATIONS OF ONE KIND OR ANOTHER AND LAW.
SOME RELATED TO ESPIONAGE INVOLVED HERE THAT DEAL WITH HOW TO CLASSIFY INFORMATION, HOW CLASSIFIED INFORMATION SHOULD BE HANDLED AND HOW IT IS PROTECTED.
IN MY EXPERIENCE, OBVIOUSLY, IT WAS IMPORTANT THAT CLASSIFIED INFORMATION BE HANDLED CAREFULLY, THAT IT WILL LOGGED IN WHEN THAT INFORMATION CAME IN AND THAT THERE BE AN INDIVIDUAL IN THE OFFICE RESPONSIBLE FOR SECURING THOSE DOCUMENTS AT THE END OF THE DAY AND MAKING SURE THEY'RE PROTECTED.
THAT'S THE STANDARD THAT WE USED TO FOLLOW.
I'M AFRAID THAT IT'S A LITTLE MORE HIT AND MISS WITH REGARDS TO SOME OTHER AREAS.
IT ALSO SOUNDS LIKE THERE ARE TWO DIFFERENT STANDARDS.
A STANDARD FOR THE EXECUTIVE BRANCH AND THE STANDARD -- WE HEAR AND TALK TO CONGRESSMEN AND WOMEN AND THEY ARE BAFFLED JUST AS BAFFLED AS YOU ARE AND I AM TO READ ABOUT THE CONSTANT SAYING MORE AND MORE DOCUMENTS ARE FOUND BECAUSE WE HEAR THE SAME STORY, THEY GO INTO A SKIFF AND HAVE TO LEAVE DEVICES OUTSIDE NOT ALLOWED TO LEAVE WITH ANY DOCUMENTS.
CLEARLY, THE SAME DOESN'T APPLY FOR THE PRESIDENT AND VICE PRESIDENT.
EXPLAIN THE DIFFERENCE.
WELL, THAT'S WHAT CONCERNS ME.
HAVING BEEN CHIEF OF STAFF TO THE PRESIDENT, I THOUGHT IT WAS EXTREMELY IMPORTANT THAT WE PROTECT CLASSIFIED INFORMATION GOING TO THE PRESIDENT AND REQUIRE THAT THAT CLASSIFIED INFORMATION BE GATHERED AT THE END OF THE DAY AND SECURED.
THAT WAS A REQUIREMENT.
OBVIOUSLY, THAT KIND OF OVERSIGHT AND CARE WAS NOT THERE WITH REGARDS TO TRUMP AND OBVIOUSLY, WITH REGARDS TO BIDEN AND PENCE, IT WAS NOT AS TIGHT AS IT SHOULD BE.
AND I THINK PART OF IT IS THAT BECAUSE THEY'RE PRESIDENTS TO THE UNITED STATES AND HAD THE ABILITY ON THEIR OWN TO DECLASSIFY INFORMATION, I THINK A CERTAIN CARELESSNESS ARISES AND THERE IS -- IF THE STAFF IS SOMEHOW INTIMIDATED BY SAYING TO THE PRESIDENT WHERE IS YOUR CLASSIFIED MATERIAL SO I CAN SECURE IT, IT GETS HAPPEN HAZARD IN THE WAY IT'S PROTECTED.
WE KEEP HEARING BUT NOT EXECUTING CLASSIFIED DOCUMENTS ARE FOUND IS WE MAY BE IN A SITUATION WHERE THERE ARE TOO MANY CLASSIFIED DOCUMENTS, WE'RE OVER CLASSIFYING DOCUMENTS.
ESTIMATES ARE THERE ARE 50 MILLION EACH YEAR AND AN OFFICIAL SAID 5 TO 10% WARRANT CLASSIFICATION.
DO YOU THINK OVER CLASSIFICATION IS A VALID ARGUMENT HERE AND PERHAPS TRYING TO EXPLAIN WHY SO MANY OF THESE DOCUMENTS ARE FOUND WHERE THEY ARE.
THERE WAS TOO MUCH MATERIAL BEING CLASSIFIED AND THE ABILITY TO PROTECT CLASSIFIED DOCUMENTS.
IT'S IMPORTANT TO LOOK WHAT IS BEING CLASSIFIED.
I THINK TOO MUCH IS BEING CLASSIFIED.
IT ISN'T JUST OBVIOUSLY MATERIAL THAT RELATES TO NATIONAL SECURITY.
THERE ARE OTHER AREAS THAT INVOLVE SENSITIVE MATERIAL THAT CAN BE CLASSIFIED AND LITERALLY AS A RESULT OF THAT, THERE ARE THOUSANDS OF DOCUMENTS THAT ARE CLASSIFIED.
I THINK THAT NEEDS TO BE TIGHTENED UP.
I ALSO THINK THAT THE PROCESS OF PROTECTING THOSE DOCUMENTS NEEDS TO BE SIMPLIFIED SO THAT EVERYBODY UNDERSTANDS WHAT STEPS HAVE TO BE TAKEN TO PROTECT IT AND LASTLY, WE HAVE TO ENFORCE THOSE RULES.
I THINK ALL OF THAT NEEDS ATTENTION IN ORDER TO DEAL WITH THIS -- WITH WHAT I THINK IS A FAILING RIGHT NOW THAT RELATES TO OUR NATIONAL SECURITY.
A SYSTEMIC FAILING IF THERE IS ANY POSITIVE HERE,IST THAT IT SEEMS TO BE APPLYING TO BOTH PARTIES WHICH IN TURN PERHAPS WILL LEAD TO SOME SERIOUS REFORMS AND NOT JUST POLITICALLY HAVING ANOTHER ISSUE THAT BOTH SIDES BLAME EACH OTHER FOR.
I BRING THAT UP BECAUSE WE HAVE BOTH CO-CHAIRS OF THE SENATE INTEL COMMITTEE, SENATOR WARNER AND RUBIO CALLING FOR MORE INFORMATION AS TO WHAT WAS IN THESE CLASSIFIED IN PRESIDENT TRUMP'S HOME AND BIDEN.
TWO VERY DIFFERENT CASES BUT UNDER INVESTIGATION OF A SPECIAL COUNSEL.
THESE SENATORS SAY THAT IS NOT A GOOD ENOUGH EXCUSE AND THAT THEY AT LEAST DESERVE ACCESS TO SOME MORE DETAILED INFORMATION.
DO YOU THINK THEY'RE RIGHT?
I AGREE.
THEY HAVE A RESPONSIBILITY WITH THE INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE TO DO OVERSIGHT TO ENSURE THAT WE ARE TAKING PROPER STEPS WITH REGARDS TO PROTECTING OUR INTELLIGENCE.
SO THEY SHOULD HAVE THE INFORMATION AS TO WHAT WAS THE LEVEL OF CLASSIFICATION INVOLVED HERE AND WHO WAS EXPOSED TO THAT INFORMATION THAT COULD HAVE POSSIBLY JEOPARDIZED OUR NATIONAL SECURITY?
THOSE ARE IMPORTANT QUESTIONS.
AND IF THEY'RE NOT ANSWERED WITHIN ADMINISTRATION THEY CERTAINLY HAVE TO BE ANSWERED BY THE OVERSIGHT INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEES ON CAPITOL HILL.
LET ME TURN TO ANOTHER PRESSING ISSUE AND THAT IS OBVIOUSLY RUSSIA'S WAR IN UKRAINE AND THE ANNOUNCEMENT THIS WEEK THE UNITED STATES AFTER FIRST SUGGESTING THAT THEY WILL NOT BE SENDING ABRARMS TANKS ACKNOWLEDGING 31 GOING TO A BACK AND FORTH BETWEEN GERMANY AND OUR EUROPEAN ALLIES AS TO WHO WOULD SEND TANKS FIRST AND IT APPEARS AN AGREEMENT HAS BEEN MADE WITH THE GERMANS THEY WOULD SEND DOZENS OF THEIR LEOPARD TANKS IN IF CHANGE FOR THE UNITED STATES AGREEING TO SEND OURS.
WHAT IS YOUR RESPONSE TO THAT?
I KNOW YOU HAD BEEN A BIT CRITICAL AS TO HOW LONG IT HAS TAKEN TO FINALLY COME TO THIS RESOLUTION.
THE PROCESS TAKES TOO LONG.
THIS WAS FOUR MONTHS IN THE PROCESS, IF NOT LONGER TO TRY TO COME TO THE DECISION AND FRANKLY, THE PROCESS NEEDS TO BE SPED UP TO PROVIDE THE NECESSARY WEAPONS AND EQUIPMENT AND AMMUNITION UKRAINIANS NEED.
WE'RE AT A CRITICAL TIME RIGHT NOW IN THIS WAR AND IT'S A TIME WHEN BOTH SIDES ARE DIGGING IN, REINFORCING PREPARING FOR A SPRING OFFENSIVE.
IT'S VERY IMPORTANT THE UKRAINIANS NOT LOSE MOMENTUM.
I THINK THEY'RE WINNING.
I THINK THE RUSSIANS ARE LOSING.
BUT IN ORDER FOR THEM TO CONTINUE TO HAVE THAT MOMENTUM, WE HAVE TO PROVIDE THEM WITH THE EQUIPMENT, SUCH AS THESE TANKS TO MAKE SURE THEY CAN DEFEAT ANY RUSSIAN OFFENSIVE AND THEY CAN GO ON THE OFFENSIVE TO BE ABLE TO PUSH THE RUSSIANS BACK TOWARDS THE AREAS THAT THEY CONTROLLED PRIOR TO THE INVASION.
OF COURSE, THESE THANKS ARE NOT THE SILVER BULLET TO HELPING UKRAINE WIN THIS WAR, A MORE SUPPORT IS NEEDED AND WHILE UKRAINIANS HAVE CONSISTENTLY BEEN GRATEFUL, THEY CONSTANTLY AND UNDERSTANDABLY ASK FOR MORE.
WE KNOW PRESIDENT ZELENSKYY AND THOSE AROUND HIM HAVE BEEN PUSHING FOR FIGHTER JETS NOW SINCE THE START OF THE WAR.
THE U.S. HAS BEEN RELUCTANT.
THERE HAD ALWAYS BEEN THIS SORT OF RED LINE AS TO WHAT CLASSIFIES AS A DEFENSE OR OFFENSIVE WEAPON.
AT THIS POINT IN THE WAR DO YOU THINK THE UNITED STATES AND ALLIES SHOULD BE SENDING FIGHTER JETS?
I THINK THAT THE UNITED STATES AND ALLIES SHOULD HAVE WHAT IS PROVIDED TO THE UKRAINIANS AND FROM MY POINT OF VIEW, EVERYTHING SHOULD BE ON THE TABLE.
EVERYTHING SHOULD BE ON THE TABLE FOR THEM TO CONSIDER.
BUT THEY OUGHT TO HAVE A FASTER PROCESS TO MAKE THESE DECISIONS RATHER THAN DRAGGING THIS OUT.
IT IS VERY IMPORTANT THAT THE UKRAINIANS HAVE WHAT THEY NEED IN ORDER TO DEFEND THEIR COUNTRY.
THIS IS NOT ABOUT THE UKRAINIANS ATTACKING RUSSIA.
THIS IS ABOUT THE UKRAINIANS DEFENDING THEIR OWN COUNTRY AND FOR THAT REASON, I THINK THE UNITED STATES AND ALLIES, IF WE ARE TO BE SUCCESSFUL AND MARK MY WORDS THIS IS A PIVOTAL WAR THAT WILL DETERMINE THE FUTURE OF DEMOCRACY NOT JUST IN UKRAINE BUT DEMOCRACIES IN GENERAL, IT IS ESSENTIAL THAT THE UNITED STATES AND OUR ALLIES DEVELOP A PROCESS THAT MOVES MORE QUICKLY TO HELP THE UKRAIUKRAINIANS.
BECAUSE VLADIMIR PUTIN FOR ALL OF THE LOSSES THEY HAVE TAKEN SEEMS TO BELIEVE TIME IS ON HIS SIDE AND WE'RE APPROACHING THE ONE-YEAR MARK OF HIS ILLEGAL INVASION INTO UKRAINE.
THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THE TIME.
ALWAYS GREAT TO HAVE YOU ON AND JURY INSIGHT AND EXPERTISE, AS WELL.
APPRECIATE IT.
GOOD TO BE WITH YOU.
> UKRAINE IS ASKING THE WEST FOR MORE WEAPONS AFTER THE LATEST BARRAGE OF RUSSIAN MISSILE STRIKES.
MOSCOW FIRED 70 MISSILES AT ENERGY FACILITIES KILLING AT LEAST 11 PEOPLE.
THE ATTACKS CAME HOURS AFTER WESTERN ALLIES AGREED TO SEND TANKS TO UKRAINE AND THE WEST CONTINUES TO PUNISH RUSSIA FOR THE WAR IN OTHER WAYS.
SINCE THE INVASION BEGAN, SANCTIONS HAVE BEEN PILED ON RUSSIA TO CURTAIL ACCESS TO FOREIGN GOODS AND TECHNOLOGY AND HOPED THEY WILL DENT THE ABILITY TO SUSTAIN THE WAR BUT RESEARCH BY WASHINGTON THINK TANK SAYS RUSSIA HAS BEEN SUCCESSFULLY CIRCUMVENTING THOSE.
DIMITRI JOINS ME FROM HERE IN WASHINGTON.
GREAT TO HAVE YOU ON.
SO LET'S TALK ABOUT SPECIFICS HERE.
AT THE START OF THE WAR, WE SAW SANCTION LEVELS AGAINST RUSSIA WE HAVEN'T SEEN IN DECADES IF EVER.
RUSSIA SEEMS TO REALLY HAVE BEEN OVERNIGHT DECOUPLED FROM THE GLOBAL ECONOMY AND YET, WHILE ESTIMATES CALLED FOR AN IMPACT THE FIRST YEAR INTO THE WAR OF A DECLINE OF 10% IN THEIR GDP, WE'RE SEEING IT AT ABOUT, WHAT, 2.5, 3% CLEARLY IT IS HAVING AN IMPACT BUT NOT THE IMPACT THE WEST INITIALLY SOUGHT OUT FOR AND MY QUESTION IS DIRECTED TOWARDS YOUR RESEARCH.
WHAT IS IT THAT RUSSIANS ARE ABLE TO DO TO CIRCUMVENT SOME OF THESE HARSH SANCTIONS?
THANKS FOR HAVING ME, BIANNA.
THE WEST HAS DONE THREE THINGS TOWARDS RUSSIA AFTER THE ILLEGAL INVASION OF UKRAINE.
ONE, FROZE ASSETS HELD BY CENTRAL BANK OVER $300 BILLION.
IT WAS HELD GLOBALLY, THAT CERTAINLY HAD AN IMPACT ON THEIR ABILITY TO USE THAT CASH AND CERTAIN ORGANIZATIONS CONNEPGTED TO THE MILITARY AND FINANCIAL SECTOR AND MORE IMPORTANTLY, EXPORTING CONTROLS PROHIBITING AMERICAN COMPANIES AND WESTERN COMPANIES RELYING ON SUPPLY CHAIN TO SELL THE PRODUCTS TO RUSSIA, MICRO CHIPS.
SEMI CONDUCTORS IN THE MILITARY TO BUILD TANKS AND JETS AND MISSILES.
THEY'RE DESTROYING UKRAINIAN CITIES RIGHT NOW.
WHAT WE'VE SEEN, WE'VE DONE A COMPREHENSIVE ANALYSIS OF THE TRADE FLOWS GOING INTO RUSSIA SINCE THE WAR BEGAN AND ALSO GOING BACK BEFORE THE WAR AND WE FOUND A COUPLE INTEREST THINGS BEFORE THE WAR BEGAN IN LATE 2021 THERE IS ACTUALLY SIGNIFICANT INCREASE OF IMPORTS GOING INTO RUSSIA INCLUDING SEMI CONDUCTORS UP 20% ABOVE THE TYPICAL BASELINE WHAT TRADE LOOKS LIKE WITH RUSSIA ON A REGULAR YEAR IN A REGULAR YEAR AND WHAT WE SAW IS THAT THAT PROBABLY CONTRIBUTED TO SIGNIFICANT INVENTORIES IN RUSSIA THAT ENABLE THEM TO TAP INTO THE INVENTORIES WHEN THE IMPORTS DROPPED IN THE INNIESHL MONTHS OF THE WAR BUT EVEN AFTER THAT, THE IMPORTS HAVE REBOUNDED AND PARTICULARLY LED BY CHINA BUT ALSO FORMER SOVIET REPUBLICS LIKE BELARUS KAZAKHSTAN, ARMENIA AND TURKEY SUPPLYING WITH GOODS THAT ARE CRITICAL.
SO FOR EXAMPLE, SMART PHONES AND MICRO CHIPS COMING FROM THE WEST INSTEAD OF GOING TO RUSSIA NOW GOING THROUGH THOSE STATES AND THEN BEING RESOLD TO RUSSIA.
IF I CAN GET YOU TO GO BACK TO WHAT YOU SAID BECAUSE I FIND IT VERY INTERESTING NOW LOOKING BACK THAT IN 2021 BEFORE THE WAR, WE SAW A DRASTIC INCREASE IN IMPORTS TO RUSSIA.
PIECING EVERYTHING TOGETHER NOW, DOES THIS SUGGEST TO YOU THIS WAS PLANNED AND IN ANTICIPATION OF PUTIN AND THOSE ASSOCIATES AROUND HIP AND DO YOU THINK THEY DID THIS IN ANTICIPATION OF THE WAR NOW?
IT'S A REALLY GREAT QUESTION, BIANNA.
IT'S HARD TO TELL AS YOU SAID THERE IS A LOT OF SECRECY AROUND THIS WAR PLANNING AND INCLUDING THE MILITARY.
MANY OF THE SOLDIERS THAT WERE GOING TO INVADE UKRAINE DIDN'T KNOW THE WAR WAS COMING.
I FIND THE HARD TO BELIEVE THAT A LOT OF THE TRADE PEOPLE IN THE ECONOMISTS HAD ADVANCED KNOWLEDGE SO IT'S HARD TO SAY WHETHER THAT WAS PLANNED, WHETHER THEY WERE GIVING ORDERS WITHOUT BEING TOLD WHY THAT WAS TO TAKE PLACE.
A LOT OF THESE ORDERS CAME FROM THE PRIVATE SECTOR SO MAYBE NOT DIRECTED CENTRALLY.
WHATEVER THE CAUSE, IT COULD BE COVID RELATED AND DEMAND LIKE WE SAW IN THE UNITED STATES SKYROCKETING.
SIMILAR THINGS IN RUSSIA.
WHATEVER THE REASON, IT CERTAINLY HELPED THEM TO ALLEVIATE SOME OF THE INITIAL PAIN OF THESE EXPORT CONTROLS.
WE SHOULD NOTE WHILE GOODS WERE STILL ABLE TO FIND THEIR WAY INTO RUSSIA, THE QUALITY AND THE TYPES OF GOODS HAVE DECLINED WHETHER IT'S CAR PARTS, OR ELECTRONICS.
THAT'S RIGHT.
THEY'RE PAYING MORE AND SMUGGLING AND CHANCE SHIPPING THEM YOU'RE PAYING COST TO MIDDLEMAN SO AS MUCH AS 10, 20% MORE THAN THEY TYPICALLY WOULD.
THEY MAY NOT GET THEM IN THE VOLUMES THEY NEED SO IN VEHICLE PARTS AS YOU SAID, THEY'RE STILL HAVING ISSUES GETTING THE NECESSARY PARTS THEY HAD TO SHUT DOWN A LOT OF CAR PRODUCTIONS AND CIVILIAN SECTOR BUT THE INITIAL HOPES WE WOULD BE ABLE TO IMPACT THE ABILITY TO PRODUCE MISSILES AND AMMUNITION FOR ARTILLERY SYSTEMS AND ARMOR, I THINK THOSE HOPES WERE PROBABLY HIS GUIDED.
IS THAT ONE OF THE REASONS PERHAPS IT'S JUST BEING COLD HEARTED WHY WE'RE SEEING SO MANY DUMB BOMBS AS THEY'RE CALLED LEVELLED AGAINST UKRAINE AND TARGETING NOT JUST INFRASTRUCTURE BUT CIVILIAN AREAS, AS WELL OR SHOULD WE NOT EQUATE THE TWO?
I WOULD NOT MAKE THAT DISTINCTION.
THE RUCKSS ARE LOBBYING A TERROR CAMPAIGN SO THEY'RE NOT NECESSARILY LOOKING FOR SPECIFIC TARGETS AS LONG AS THEY CAN KILL CIVILIANS AND AS LONG AS THEY CAN GET UKRAINIANS TO MOVE THEIR CRITICAL AIR DEFENSE SYSTEMS AWAY FROM THE FRONT LINES TOWARDS THE CITIES TO DEFEND THOSE CITIES AGAINST THOSE MISSILE ATTACKS AND ENABLE TO FLY OVER IS A WIN FOR THE BACK.
THAT IS PLAYED OUT OVER THE PAST NEARLY 11 MONTHS NOW AND YEAR COMING UPON THEIR INVASION.
BEFORE WE GET TO THE WAR ITSELF BECAUSE I HAVE QUESTIONS AN THAT WE KNOW THAT IT IS U.S. POLICY ON THESE EXPORT CONTROLS BUT CHINA AS WELL AND EARLY IN THE WAR, ALL EYES HAD BEEN ON CHINA AS TO WHETHER CHINA WOULD BE A BACK FILL FOR RUSSIA AND FOR THE MOST PART, IT HADN'T BEEN SO I'M JUST CURIOUS HOW CHINA AND HONG KONG WHERE SEMI CONDUCTOR PARTS WERE COMING FROM WITH STAND SECONDARY SANCTIONS.
THERE ARE NOT SECONDARY SANCTIONS.
WHAT CHINA SEEMS TO HAVE DONE IS DRAWN A DISTINCTION BETWEEN MILITARY USE EQUIPMENT, SO TANKS, AMMUNITION, AND SO FORTH.
THAT IS DECIDED NOT TO PROVIDE TO RUSSIA EVEN THOUGH THAT IS REQUESTED AS WE KNOW BUT TECHNOLOGY LIKE SEMI CONDUCTORS THAT CAN GO INTO CIVILIAN AND MILITARY PURPOSES, THAT CONTINUES TO FLOW.
NOT JUST CONTINUES BUT HAS SPIKED OVER THE LAST YEAR.
SO THE CHINESE ARE TRYING TO WALK THE LINE WHERE THEY'RE SUPPORTING THEIR ALLIES OR FRIEND IN RUSSIA BUT NOT SUPPORTING THEM SO AVERTLY THAT CHINESE WEAPONS ARE USED ON THE BATTLE FIELD.
YOU OFFER REMEDIES OR SUGGESTIONS TO FIX THE GLARING LOOPHOLES.
IT'S IMPORTANT TO LAYOUT.
THIS WAR IS NOT GOING TO END ANY TIME SOON.
THE SOONER RUSSIA'S ECONOMY OR KREMLIN CAN FACE PRESSURE, SPECIFICALLY BECAUSE OF THESE SANCTIONS, PROBABLY THE BETTER IN TERMS OF SEEING AN END TO THE WAR.
WHAT OUR REPORT SHOWS BIANNA, WE KNOW SANCTIONS AND EXPORT CONTROLS ARE THE CRITICAL PILLAR OF NATIONAL SECURITY FOR THE UNITED STATES IN CONFRONTING THE CHALLENGE OF RUSSIA AND IRAN, NORTH KOREA AND RECENTLY CHINA AND UNLESS WE BEEF UP ENFORCEMENT, IT DOESN'T MATTER THAT WE PUT A COMPANY ON A SANCTIONS LIST OR PUT A GOOD ON THE EXPORT CONTROL RISK.
IT WON'T DO GOOD.
BEEF UP ENFORCEMENT AND GIVE THE AGENCY BIS, BURRO OF INDUSTRIAL SECURITY MORE RESOURCES AND WE NEED A TASK FORCE LED BY THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT TO INVESTIGATE THESE VIOLATIONS, THAT WILL PROSECUTE THEM SO THAT PEOPLE BOTH HERE IN THE UNITED STATES AND ELSEWHERE AROUND THE WORLD.
THEY'RE HELPING RUSSIA AND OTHERS TO EVADE CONTROLS.
LET ME TURN TO THE WAR NOW AND YOU HEARD MY CONVERSATION WITH SECRETARY PANETTA THERE.
WE HAVE NEWS THIS WEEK, WELCOME NEWS FOR UKRAINIANS TANKS ARE ON THEIR WAY, REALISTICALLY, I DON'T KNOW ABRAMS WILL ARRIVE THERE WITHIN THE NEXT FEW MONTHS OR BY THE END OF THE YEAR.
THAT HAVING BEEN SAID, THIS IS COMING AS EVERYONE IS AWAITING A POTENTIAL SPRING DEFENSIVE.
TELL ME WHAT YOU'RE MOST LOOKING TO WATCH IN THE WEEKS AND MONTHS AHEAD AS THIS NEW OFFENSIVE IS STARTING TO BEGIN AND LAYOUT.
IT VERY LIKELY BOTH SIDES ARE PREPARING FOR OFFENSIVE.
BOTH SIDES TRAINED MEN.
A NUMBER OF THEM HAVE BEEN IN TRAINING FOR TWO OR THREE MONTHS.
THAT'S FAIRLY SIGNIFICANT, THE WAGNER GROUP MOBILIZED UP TO 40,000 PRISONERS THAT THEY HAVE THROWN AT THE FRONT LINES.
THEY HAVE QUITE A FEW MEN AND HOPING TO REGAIN TERRITORY THEY LOST TO THE UKRAINIAN COUNTER OFFENSIVE NEAR KHARKIV LAST YEAR AND THE UKRAINIANS OF COURSE, ARE HOPING FOR THEIR OWN COUNTER OFFENSIVE TO TAKE BACKS OCCUPIED TERRITORY THEY LOST SINCE THE BEGINNING OF THE WAR.
IT WILL BE INTERESTING TO SEE WHERE THEY GO.
THEY WILL FCUS ON THE SOUTH.
THE RUSSIANS HAVE BEEN BUILDING FORT FA CASE AND IF THEY GET TO THE CITIES, THEY WILL BE ABLE WITH THE HIGH MARKS SYSTEMS, THE LONG RANGE ARTILLERY SYSTEMS TO CONTROL THE SO-CALLED LAND BRIDGE TO CRCRIMEA, THE HIGHWAY AND CUT OFF SUPPLIES TO CRIMEA.
THE BRIDGE, THE OTHER WAY THE RUSSIANS ARE SUPPLYING IS DAMAGED.
IF YOU CAN CUT OFF THE TWO LOGISTICS SUPPLIES, YOU ISOLATE IT.
THAT'S WHAT THE UKRAINIANS HAVE BEEN HOPING FOR.
I WAS STRUCK BY SOMETHING YOUR FRIEND AND COLLEAGUE MIKE HOFFMAN SAID EARLIER ON ONE OF HIS PODCAST.
HE WAS TRYING TO MAKE SENSE OF THE CONTINUED SET BACKS AND INADEQUATE RESPONSES I THINK TO SAY THE LEAST FROM THE RUSSIAN MILITARY AND INCOMPETENCE AND CONSTANT CHANGE IN LEADERSHIP WE'VE SEEN AND THE END FIGHTING AS TO WHO IS ON TOP AND WHO IS IN FAVOR WITH THE KREMLIN AND WHAT HAVE YOU AND AT THE END OF THE DAY, HE SAID LISTEN, IT COMES DOWN TO LOYALTY AND AS EVERYONE FOCUSES HOW TO GET THIS WAR TO END AND HOW TO GET PUTIN TO THE NEGOTIATING TABLE, IN HIS VIEW, PUTIN IS MOST VULNERABLE WHEN THIS WAR ENDS.
SO I INTERPRET THAT THERE IS NO INTEREST.
WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF THAT AND IS THIS SOMETHING YOU CAN SEE GO ON FOR YEARS PERHAPS?
I COMPLETELY AGREE WITH MIKE.
THE CRITICAL MOMENT IN THIS WAR SINCE THE INVASION WAS THAT AT THE END OF THE SEPTEMBER WHEN PUTIN ANNOUNCED ANNEXATION OF THE FOUR REGIONS THAT HE DIDN'T EVEN FULLY CONTROL OF UKRAINE, THAT WAS A SIGNAL, NOT NECESSARILY EVEN TO UKRAINE OR TO THE WORLD BUT DOMESTICALLY TO THE PEOPLE THAT MAY BE THINKING ABOUT REPLACING HIM AND RUSSIAN POPULATION, HE'S BURNED HIS BOATS.
THERE IS NO EXIT PATH FOR HIM.
HE WILL CONTINUE THIS BECAUSE HE'S BASICALLY CHANGED THE RUSSIAN CONSTITUTION AND CONQUERED THESE LANDS AND HISTORICALLY WE KNOW YOU DO NOT WANT TO BE A RUSSIAN LEADER THAT GIVES UP LANDS, QUOTE UNQUOTE RUSSIAN LANDS, THEY ARE TRULY UKRAINIAN BUT THAT'S NOT POLITICALLY VIABLE.
HE'S DONE THAT TO SURE UP HIS BASE AND MAKE IT MORE DIFFICULT TO BE REPLACED AND HAVE PEACE TALKS WITH UKRAINE.
LET ME FINALLY END WITH YOU IN UKRAINIAN LEADERSHIP AS WELL AND THIS COMING AT A PIVOTAL TIME HERE IN THE UNITED STATES.
OBVIOUSLY, THERE HAVE BEEN SOME QUESTIONABLE STATEMENTS MADE BY KEVIN McCARTHY AND NOW THIS NEW HOUSE REPUBLICAN LED CONGRESS THAT SAID LISTEN, THE DAYS OF THE BLANK CHECK ARE OVER AND IT'S COMING AS JUST THIS WEEK WE SAW A SPADE OF RESIGNATION AND FIRINGS IN THE UKRAINIAN GOVERNMENT DEALING WITH CORRUPTION WHICH HAS A LONG HISTORY OF CORRUPTION IN THAT COUNTRY.
WHAT WILL YOU BE WATCHING MOST CAREFULLY IN TERMS OF LEADERSHIP AND PERHAPS ZELENSKYY'S MOVEMENT OVER THE NEXT YEAR?
I THINK ZELENSKYY AND UKRAINIANS IN AGAIN REAL NEED TO MAKE SURE THEY APPRECIATE THAT WHEN THEY'RE CONSTANTLY LOBBYING DEMANDS AT AMERICA, AT THE WEST, THAT THEY NEED TO PAIR THAT UP WITH GRATITUDE THAT WE HAVE PROVIDED TENS OF BILLIONS OF DOLLARS OF MILITARY AID TO UKRAINE AND FINANCIAL AID AND THAT IS SIGNIFICANT SACRIFICES THAT AMERICAN PUBLIC AND TAXPAYERS HAVE MADE AND EUROPEAN FRIENDS HAVE MADE, AS WELL.
I THINK THAT MORE GRATITUDE WOULD CERTAINLY HELP TO EASE SOME OF THOSE CONCERNS.
BUT THE REALITY IS THE UKRAINIANS NEED A LOT MORE HELP AS YOU TALK TO SECRETARY PANETTA AND NEED JETS BECAUSE TANKS ARE GREAT BECAUSE IF YOU DON'T HAVE AIR SUPPORT, YOU WON'T BE ABLE TO MAKE AS MUCH PROGRESS AND WHEN THE UKRAINIANS ARE RUNNING OUT OF JETS THEY PROBABLY DON'T HAVE A LOT OF AIR WORTHY COMING IN THE COMING YEARS SO THEY NEED TO REPLACE THEM WITH WESTERN JETS.
THAT WILL COME SOONER OR LATER.
THEY'VE BEEN CALLING FOR THE JETS SINCE THE START OF THE WAR ITSELF.
THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.
APPRECIATE IT.
GREAT TO SEE YOU.
> TO THE TECH INDUSTRY MAKING HEADLINES, NOT ALWAYS FOR GREAT REASONS.
FACEBOOK, META, TWITTER, GOOGLE AND NETFLIX.
WHAT IS HAPPENING IN WHY DOES IT MATTER?
TO TAKE US THROUGH IT IS ONE OF THE BAT BEAT'S TOP REPORTER.
SHE JOINS HARRY.
LET'S START THIS CONVERSATION THIS WEEK, META, FORMERLY SAID KNOWN AS FACEBOOK AND PLATFORMS AND SAY THEY HAVE PUT IN CERTAIN GUARD RAILS TO PREVENLTS WHAT HAPPENED ON JANUARY 6th AGAIN AND THERE WILL BE CONSEQUENCES IF HE CONTINUES TO DO WHAT HE'S DONE SO OFTEN ON SOCIAL MEDIA WITH THEM.
YEAH.
DO YOU THINK IT WILL WORK?
NO, NO.
BECAUSE THIS TIME HE'S GOING TO BE BETTER.
I DON'T KNOW, THE PAST TWO YEARS THAT HE'S BEEN OFF, HE'S BEEN PRETTY I WOULD SAY RACIST, HE LIES THROUGH SOCIAL.
HE'S BEEN SINCE THAT TIME.
AND HE'S DOING THE SAME THINGS HE GOT KICKED OFF BEFORE.
I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY THEY THINK HE'S GOING TO DO THE THINGS HE'LL DO NOW BECAUSE HE HASN'T LEARNED HIS LESSON.
THE COMPANIES WANT TO THREAD THIS NEEDLE WHERE THEY DON'T WANT TO GET JAMMED UP BY CONSERVATIVE SKPLS AT THE SAME TIME, THEY WANT TO DISH THIS ALL OFF INTO THE OVERSIGHT.
SAY WE HAD TO MAKE A LOT OF DECISION, IT'S BEEN TWO YEARS, HERE IS OUR DECISION.
I GOT THAT.
ONE OUT PROBLEMS IS WE MADE A DECISION AFTER YEARS OF HIM ABUSING THE PLATFORM AND DIDN'T DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT.
IT'S LIKE RAISING A CHILD AND FEEDING ENDLESS SUGAR AND CUTTING OFF THE SUGAR AND GIVING SUGAR AGAIN BECAUSE HE CAN HANDLE IT BETTER.
THE WHOLE THING IS CHAOTIC.
THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS THE OVERSIGHT BOARD POINTED OUT AND APPARENTLY NOW THEY HAVE RULES IN PLACE THAT THEY DID HAVE BEFORE BUT DIDN'T ENFORCE THEM.
THE WHOLE THING, THEY WILL SPEND THEIR WHOLE TIME WHACK A MOLE AND PROBABLY HAVE TO KICK HIM OFF AT SOME POINT.
THAT HAPPENED WITH ELON MUSK ON TWITTER.
THEY HAD A WHITE SUPREMACIST BACK ON AND KICKED HIM OFF RIGHT AWAY.
SAME THING WITH KANYE.
THESE PEOPLE DON'T CHANGE AND LOVE GAMING THE SYSTEMS AND IT'S NOT THEIR FAULT AT THIS POINT.
IT'S THEIR PLATFORMS.
HAVE RULES OR DON'T HAVE RULES.
HAS THE LANDSCAPE CHANGED SIGNIFICANTLY ENOUGH?
SET ASIDE KIND OF THE --
RIGHT, THE SAFETY.
YEAH, I MEAN, I THINK, I DON'T REALLY WANT -- NICK IS A VERY SMART GUY BUT HE'S THE ONE THAT SHOULD DETERMINE OUR PUBLIC SAFETY AND WHO IS SAFE AND NOT SAFE?
I GUESS HE CAN ON HIS PLATFORM.
I WISH THEY WOULD SAY HE DECIDED TO DO IT.
WE'LL DO WHATEVER WE WANT.
I PREFER FOR THEM TO SAY THAT.
NOW, A PUBLIC -- A PRIVATE COMPANY, A PROFIT MAKING COMPANY IS DECIDING FOR THE REST OF SOCIETY WHAT SHOULD HAPPEN.
THAT'S WHERE WE ARE AT THIS MOMENT THESE SOCIAL MEDIA PLATFORMS HAVE SUCH POWER.
LET'S JUST SAY FACEBOOK HAS A LOTLESS POWER FROM TWO YEARS AGO, WHICH IS I THINK PROBABLY A GOOD THING.
THERE IS MORE COMPETITION AND AUDIENCES HAVE GONE ELSEWHERE.
MAYBE THAT WILL HELP IT.
ANOTHER TOPIC MAKING HEADLINE IN THE TECH WORLD AND I DON'T KNOW IF THE PROBLEM IS MAKING HEAD LIVES OR THE UNDERLYING LAYOFFS, YOU'RE HEARING ABOUT SPOTIFY CUTTING ABOUT 6% OF THE WORK FORCE AND GOOGLE 12,000 AND AMAZON 18,000, THE ECONOMY HAS HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF JOBS OR MILLIONS OF JOBS AND THIS IS A VERY SMALL DROP IN THE BUCKET BUT IT SEEMS TO HAVE AN OUT SIZED AMOUNT OF ATTENTION THAT IT GETS WHEN THESE COMPANIES DO.
WHY DO YOU THINK THAT IS?
PEOPLE ARE OBSESSED WITH TECHNOLOGY PEOPLE.
THEY HIRED ENORMOUSLY DURING THE PANDEMIC BECAUSE THE STOCKS WENT UP SO MUCH AND THEY OVER HIRED AND THEIR COST, THEY HAD TO BRING COST INTO LINE.
AS SIMPLE AS THAT.
I FEEL SORRY FOR ANYONE BUT FEEL MORE SORRY FOR NEGATIVE WORKER THEY HAVE A LOT OF JOBS AVAILABLE TO THEM AND THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE DOING.
THEY HIRED 40,000 PEOPLE EITHER FACEBOOK OR MICROSOFT AND LAYING OFF TEN.
A NET GAIN OF 30,000 IS STILL A LOT AND SO THEY'RE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT THEIR BUSINESSES WHEN THE PROSPECTS AREN'T AS GOOD AND THAT'S WHAT HAPPENED.
THEY HAD A HUGE BOOM AND THIS IS VERY TYPICAL.
THEY'RE CUTTING BACK.
THEY'RE CUTTING BACK MORE THAN THEY USUALLY DO.
THEY USUALLY KEEP THE PEOPLE IN PLACE FOR THE NEXT BOOM BUT IN THIS CASE, WALL STREET BECAUSE OF THE DECLINES IN STOCK ARE SAYING DO SOMETHING ABOUT COSTS ESPECIALLY.
THAT'S WHAT IS HAPPENING.
PEOPLE ARE INVESTING IN BUSINESSES AND CUTTING.
MICROSOFT CUT HARDWARE STUFF.
THEY HAVE NEVER BEEN GOOD AT HARDWARE.
THAT'S A NATURAL PLACE TO DO IT.
THEY DON'T HAVE ANYWHERE TO GO IN THE COMPANY.
THEY CAN GO ELSEWHERE.
THESE ARE NOT NEARLY AS BAD AS THE LAST TWO.
LOTS OF COMPANIES ARE FORMED IF PEOPLE GET LAID OFF, THEY DO STARTUPS.
IT'S A TROPE FOR SILL VON VALLEY BUT TRUE.
SPEAKING OF MICROSOFT, THEY DECIDED TO PUT A MUCH BIGGER INVESTMENT FOR ANYBODY IN OUR AUDIENCE THAT DOESN'T KNOW WHAT CHAT GPT IS.
IT'S A LARGE LANGUAGE MODEL TRAINED TO ANSWER QUESTIONS IN A VERY NATURAL HUMAN SOUNDING WAY.
WHY IS THIS SIGNIFICANT?
I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S AS SIGNIFICANT AS THE PRESS MAKES IT TO BE.
IT'S A STUNT.
OH, LOOK, IT CAN TALK LIKE A PERSON SORT OF THING.
I'M GOING TO WAIT TO SEE WHERE THE ACTUAL BUSINESSES ARE.
THERE IS GOING TO BE A LOT OF INVESTMENT AND GOOGLE AND FACEBOOK AND META AND AMAZON AND APPLE ALL HAVE VERY SIGNIFICANT A.I. BUSINESSES.
NOT DOING IT THIS WAY.
THIS IS A MORE LOUD GPT WANTS TO GET MARKET SHARE AT THE MOMENT WHEN PEOPLE ARE PAYING ATTENTION TO IT.
MICROSOFT IS FAR BEHIND IN SEARCH AND TO GET IN HERE, TAKING THE LEAD, THEY HAVE SOME OF THE MOST INVESTMENTS IN A.I.
WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF IT.
HOW DOES IT CHANGE SEARCH AND THE WAY WE BEHAVE NOW?
THAT WILL BE INTERESTING.
RIGHT NOW, THERE WILL PROBABLY BE A BOOM AROUND IT AND FEEL LIKE CRYPTO LIKE EVERYONE WILL HAVE A CHAT BOT OR WHATEVER.
LET SEE WHERE THE BUSINESSES ARE RATHER THAN WRITING A TERM PAPER FOR A STUDENT IN COLLEGE.
IT HAS TO BE A BUSINESS BEYOND THAT.
SOME APPLICATIONS IN SEARCH AND IMAGERY ARE REALLY INTERESTING BUT IT'S SORT OF SEARCH ON STEROIDS IF YOU THINK ABOUT IT.
WE'LL SEE IF THAT BECOMES EVERYBODY GOING OH, AWE, IT'S A VERY GOOD DEVICE BUT YOU DON'T USE IT EVERY DAY AND WE'LL SEE IF PEOPLE WANT TO JOIN THE METAVERSE BUT NOT TODAY THEY DON'T.
THERE ARE A LOT OF REASONS.
WE'LL SEE.
WHILE TEENAGERS ARE LOOKING UP HOW TO WRITE TERM PAPERS.
THAT STORY HAS TO STOP.
TEENAGER HAVES BEEN CHEATING FOR MANY, MANY CENTURIES.
IT'S A FRESH WAY TO CHEAT.
WHATEVER.
I DON'T KNOW.
I SAW A COLLEGE PROFESSOR OUT THERE SAYING MY PEERS AND I ARE LOOKING FOR HELP GRADING THE PAPERS.
WHATEVER.
WHATEVER.
BUT I WONDER ALSO, YOU KNOW, CATEGORY OF THE TECH COMPANIES THAT ARE ALSO SUFFERING THROUGH THE PANDEMIC AND MAYBE COMING OUT THE OTHER SIDE IS THE STREAMING PLAYERS.
RIGHT NOW NETFLIX ANNOUNCED THE CO-FOUNDER AND FIRST CEO IS TAKING AN EXECUTIVE CHAIRMAN ROLE AND HE'S GOING TO HAVE TWO CO-CEOs.
SORT OF SOUNDS LIKE HE'S STILL GOING TO BE IN THE MIX.
HE IS.
HE IS.
YOU KNOW, THEY'RE COMING OFF OF MAYBE A BOTTOM.
THEY KIND OF OVER SPEND IN THEIR TIGHTENING THE BELT IN A BIG WAY.
WHAT DO YOU SEE FROM THEM AND HEAR FROM PEOPLE IN THIS ENTERTAINMENT ARENA WHAT NETFLIX HAS TO DO TO TRY TO REGAIN SOME OF THE SWAGGER.
IT'S A MEDIA COMPANY.
IT HAS TO KEEP DOING HITS.
THAT'S HOW YOU WIN.
IT IS A TECH COMPANY BUT NOT REALLY.
IT'S A TECHISH COMPANY DELIVERING.
EVERYONE IS ON HOW TO DO THAT NOW.
IT SORT OF ARE YOU IN THE CAR BUSINESS?
YOU'RE NOT IN THE ENGINE BUSINESS BUT YOU ARE KIND OF THING AND THEN YOU COMPETE ON DESIGN AND COOL CARS AND VARIOUS THINGS THAT CONSUMERS WANT.
WHAT HAPPENED, THERE'S A LOT OF SPENDING GOING ON.
THERE'S STILL A LOT OF SPENDING GOING ON.
NETFLIX MANAGED TO EKE OUT A GOOD BUSINESS DOING IT.
THEY HAVE COMPETITORS SUFFERING LIKE BECAUSE IT COSTS SO MUCH TO GET INTO THIS BUSINESS AND THEN THERE ARE BIG TECH COMPANIES LIKE APPLE AND AMAZON WHICH HAVE MORE MONEY THAT CAN REALLY SPEND HERE SO I THINK IT'S STILL GOING TO BE A SPENDING SPREE BUT A LOT OF PEOPLES LIKE DISNEY WILL HAVE TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO DO COSTS AND MAKE MONEY BECAUSE YOU CAN'T HAVE AN ENDLESS AMOUNT OF MONEY OF THESE STREAMING SERVICES AND CONSUMERS WANTING TO BUY THEM.
WE'LL SEE.
DO PEOPLE WANT OLD I.P. LIKE STAR WARS OR BOND?
THERE IS PLUS ON EVERYTHING AND WILL THEY HAVE TO BE BUNDLED?
WHERE IS THE VALUABLE THING?
I THINK UNBUNDLING AND BUNDLING IS SOMETHING THAT HAPPENS ALL THE TIME BACK AND FORTH BUT NETFLIX HAS AN UNDER READ HASTINGS.
REMARKABLE PIONEER IN THE FACT THEY CONTINUE TO INNOVATE IS IMPRESSIVE.
WE'LL SEE.
THEY'RE GOING TO ALWAYS BE HAVING TO COMPETE FOR TALENT AND GREAT SHOWS AND THINGS PEOPLE LIKE AND QUITE GOOD AT IT.
AND SO WE'LL SEE IF SOMEONE GETS BETTER.
IT'S HIGHLY COMPETITIVE SO KEEP ON THEIR TOES.
LET'S TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT ELON MUSK.
TESLA, THE PRIMARY COMPANY THAT HE MAKES MOST OF HIS MONEY FROM JUST ANNOUNCED EARNINGS RECENTLY AND AT THE SAME TIME MIGHT HAVE MISSED WALL STREET ESTIMATES.
SO GIVEN THAT HE IS SPENDING SOME OF HIS TIME THESE DAYS BETWEEN COURT CASES.
HE WAS IN A FEDERAL COURT ABOUT A TWEET SAYING HE SECURED FUNDING AT $420 TO TAKE THIS COMPANY.
I MEAN, SO THERE IS THAT CASE.
THEN THERE IS --
THERE'S A LOT.
THERE'S A LOT OF DIFFERENT COURT CHALLENGES THAT HE HAS WHILE ALSO MANAGING THIS COMPANY TWITTER HANDS ON, WHICH HE'S DOING.
YOU KNOW, I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHERE TO BEGIN BUT WHAT DO YOU THINK THE KIND OF ACCOUNTABILITY IS THAT PEOPLE CAN EXPECT?
I KNOW THERE IS TESLA SHAREHOLDERS THAT ARE UPSET SAYING HEY, COME BE THE CEO OF THIS COMPANY I HAVE ALL MY MONEY.
IT DIPPED QUITE SIGNIFICANTLY DOWN CLOSE TO $100, WHICH WAS AMAZING.
GIVEN HOW RIDICULOUS THE PRICE WAS.
IT WAS UP IN THE COUPLE HUNDREDS OF DOLLARS AND THAT'S WHERE E D DE -- ELON SOLD.
HE'S GOT THIS BUSINESS IN THIS SPACE.
THAT SAID, THERE'S A LOT OF COMPETITORS AND DECLINE IN DEMAND.
HE HAD TO CUT PRICES.
HE HAD BETTER MARGINS SO HE CAN DO THAT.
BUT PEOPLE WILL GO AND BUY OTHER THINGS AND MANUFACTURING AND PEOPLE TEND TO CATCH UP AND PEOPLE ARE COMMITTED WHETHER MERCEDES OR FORD OR THESE NEWER COMPANIES LIKE LUCID.
HE'S GOT A LOT OF PRESSURE EVEN THOUGH HE DID WELL AND SOLD A LOT OF CARS.
EVERYONE IS NOT GOING TO WANT A TESLA, THEY WILL WANT SOMETHING ELSE.
THE ALTERNATIVES ARE GETTING BETTER AND BETTER.
THAT'S UNDER PRESSURE AND HE SHOULD BE FOCUSSING ON THAT.
IT'S BEEN WHERE HE DOMINATES AND THEN THERE IS SPACEX HE'S DOING WELL DOMINATING IN ROCKETRY AND HE HAS COMPETITORS THERE.
THESE ARE TWO SIGNIFICANT BUSINESSES CHALLENGED AND COSTLY AND YOU NEED TO FIGURE OUTWEIGHS TO -- WAYS TO CONTINUE TO DOING THEM.
IN TESLA'S CASE THEY WANT TO EXPAND BATTERY PLANTS.
GREAT IDEA.
THAT'S WHERE MONEY SHOULD GO.
I THINK MOST THINGS TEND TO FOCUS ON SILLY THINGS THAT AFFECT BUSINESSES.
SILLY AND TERRIBLE THINGS, ACTUALLY.
IT BECOME REALLY KIND OF EVERY DAY HE SAYS SOMETHING OUTRAGEOUS TO ATTRACT ATTENTION TO HIMSELF BECAUSE HE'S OBVIOUSLY SO SHY.
HE'S CREATING PROBLEMS WHEN HE HAS SIGNIFICANT BUSINESSES TO PAY ATTENTION TO AND OVER TWITTER HE'S WRECKING IT FOR REASONS HE SAYS HE'S GOT A MASTER PLAN.
OTHER PEOPLE THINK MAKE HE'S JUST DOING IT BECAUSE HE FEELS LIKE IT.
TWITTER IS NEVER A BIG BUSINESS LIKE TESLA AND SPACEX.
I WONDER ABOUT THE DIFFERENT LEVERS HE HAS OR GOVERNMENTS HAVE OVER HIM.
HE HAS TWO BIG BUSINESSES, TESLA AND SPACEX THAT ARE VERY INTERTWINED, ONE WITH CHINA AND ONE WITH THE UNITED STATES.
CHINA COULD BE WE HAVE THOSE CARS BUT COULD YOU DO SOMETHING ABOUT THE ANTI CHINA STUFF ON TWITTER BECAUSE IT WOULD BE TOO BAD IF THERE WAS A LOCKDOWN AROUND YOUR FACTORIES ON ONE HAND AND IF THE U.S. WANTS TO DO SOME SORT OF REGULATION, HE COULD TURN AROUND AND SAY YEAH, YEAH, CAN YOU FIND YOURSELF A DIFFERENT RIDE TO THE INTERNATIONAL SPACE STATION?
RIGHT, RIGHT.
HE'S GOT TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT THAT THEY WILL FIND ANOTHER RIDE EVENTUALLY.
THIS COULD SEEM RIDICULOUS ON SO MANY DIFFERENT LEVELS WITH A VERY BADLY RAISED 10-YEAR-OLD BOY, I THINK.
EATING A LOT OF SUGAR SPEAKING OF SUGAR AND OTHER THINGS AND SO THAT'S THE PROBLEM THERE AND THEN YOU HAVE THESE SIGNIFICANT BUSINESSES THAT ARE PROMISING.
AT SOME POINT YOU CAN PUSH IT SO FAR WITH EVERYBODY.
EVERYBODY SAYS, YOU KNOW, MY GRANDMOTHER USED TO SAY THE GRAVEYARDS ARE FULL OF INDISPENSABLE PEOPLE.
IF HE PUSHES THE GOVERNMENT TOO FAR IN THE UNITED STATES, THEY WILL FIND OTHER ALTERNATIVES.
IF CONSUMERS GET MAD -- MOST OF THE PEOPLE THAT BUY TESLA ARE THE ONES HE'S ATTACKING NOW, THE WOKE PEOPLE MAYBE THEY WILL GET TIRED OF SOMETHING ELSE.
EVERY BUSINESS WILL BE CHALLENGED BUT YOU'RE RIGHT, IF HE'S USING THEM TO HELP OTHER BUSINESSES, IT STARTS TO GET DICEY FOR HIM AND FOR EVERYBODY ELSE.
THERE WILL BE COMPETITORS AND THERE WILL BE -- HE'LL LOSE A COURT CASE OR THE GOVERNMENT WILL SAY ENOUGH OF YOU.
YOU'RE A SECURITY RISK.
WHATEVER HAPPENS HAPPENS.
IT'S A SHAME.
A LOT OF HIS BUSINESSES ARE REALLY QUITE INNOVATIVE.
AND YOU CAN'T DO ALL THOSE BUSINESSES AT ONCE.
HE IS SPREADING THIN AS A PERSON.
IN THAT CASE, HE'S SORT OF LIKING TO BE THE IRON MAN KIND OF GUY BUT NOBODY -- THAT'S A FICTIONAL CHARACTER.
VERY DELIGHTFUL MOVIE.
WE'LL SEE.
SPEAKING OF SECURITY RISKS, THE UNITED STATES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENTS, FEDERAL GOVERNMENTS HAD CONVERSATIONS HOW TO TREAT TIKTOK.
IS THERE A THERE THERE?
THEY'RE TRYING TO NOW.
THE COMMITTEE ON FOREIGN INVESTMENT IS TRYING HARD TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO SEPARATE INFORMATION USED BY U.S. USERS OF TIKTOK USING ORACLE.
WHATEVER YOU SAY, IT'S OWNED BY THE CHINESE COMPANY AND THE CHINESE COMMUNIST PARTY IS VERY INVOLVED IN THE COMPAIES FROM THERE.
WHETHER ISSUES AROUND PROPAGANDA WHICH IS MORE SIGNIFICANT AND SURVEILLANCE OR THINGS LIKE THAT WHICH IS PROBABLY LESS SIGNIFICANT THERE SHOULD BE A CONCERN ABOUT THAT.
I WROTE A COLUMN THREE YEARS AGO SAYING I LOVE TIKTOK, IT A GREAT PRODUCT.
I USE IT ON A BURNER PHONE.
I DON'T TRUST MOST GOVERNMENTS BUT I REALLY DON'T TRUST THEIRS.
THAT SAID, THEY'RE SUPER INNOVATIVE AND DOING AMAZING THINGS.
PEOPLE LOVE TO USE THEM.
THERE HAS TO BE A WAY TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO MAYBE SEPARATE IT IN SOME FASHION.
I'M NOT SURE WHAT WILL HAPPEN THERE BUT CERTAINLY NOT GOING TO -- ESPECIALLY BECAUSE U.S.
TECH COMPANIES AREN'T ALLOWED IN CHINA.
THEY'RE ALLOWED HERE.
SO, YOU KNOW, THESE THINGS HAVE TO BE SORTED OUT BY GOVERNMENTS AND THAT'S WHERE IT'S REALLY GOING IS THAT THIS IS GOING TO BE SOMETHING SETTLED BY BETWEEN GOVERNMENTS AND WITH GOVERNMENT INTERVENTION AND AS IT SHOULD BE IN THIS CASE.
THANKS SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.
THANK YOU.
THAT MEANS MORE REGULATION FOR THE TECH INDUSTRY IS COMING.
> FINALLY TONIGHT, NEVER FORGET TODAY IS HOLOCAUST REMEMBRANCE DAY MARKING ONE OF THE DARKEST DAYS IN HISTORY.
CHRISTIANE SPOKE TO ONE OF THE LAST REMAINING SURVIVORS OF THE HOLOCAUST.
PEOPLE ASK HOW COME I REMEMBER THIS, BECAUSE I HAVE A FABULOUS MOTHER WHO VERIFIED WHAT I SAW AND I REMEMBER COMING -- I REMEMBER THE TRIP TO AUSCHWITZ WHICH WAS UTTERLY HORRENDOUS, 36 HOURS WITHOUT FOOD AND DRINK AND WITHOUT GOING TO THE BATHROOM.
I REMEMBER AS A LITTLE GIRL, IT WAS SO DIFFICULT FOR ME AND THEN OF COURSE, ARRIVING THERE AND HAVING MY HAIR SHAVEN.
I HAD BRAIDS AND I REMEMBER HOW I WAS STANDING ON A BENCH AND I SAW MY BRAIDS FALLING TO THE FLOOR AND THEN MY HAIR GONE AND I WAS STANDING LATER ON ON THE FLOOR.
IT WAS SO MEMORABLE AND THE TATTOOING.
THESE ARE MOMENTS THAT EVERY CHILD PROBABLY OF EVERY -- YOU CAN'T HELP BUT REMEMBER THAT AND I WAS ALWAYS WORRIED BY THE WAY THAT ALL MY STORY AND THE STORY OF -- ALL THAT HAPPENED WOULD DISAPPEAR BECAUSE I AM THE LAST GENERATION.
I AM THE LAST WEDNESDAY IN A SENSE MY GENERATION IS THE LAST ONCE.
WITH EACH PASSING YEAR, THERE ARE FEWER WITNESSES, FEWER SURVIVORS TO TELL THEIR STORY AND THAT'S WHY IT'S SO IMPORTANT TO HEAR WHAT THEY HAVE TO SAY.
> A DOCUMENTARY THAT JUST PREPARED IN NORTH AMERICA IS EXPOSING ONE OF THE MEN BEHIND THE MASSACRE OF THE HOLOCAUST CALLED 'THE DEVIL'S CONFESSION' CENTRAL ROLE OF ADOLPH THAT WENT ON TO TRIAL IN 1961 TRANSCRIPTS FROM HIS AUDIO TAPES WERE USED TO CHARGE AND EXECUTE HIM.
LAST JULY I SPOKE WITH THE FILM'S DIRECTOR.
THE FIRST THING THAT I LOOKED FOR WAS ALL THESE SIGNS ON THE TAPES THAT MADE THEM AUTHENTIC.
YOU KNOW, I KNEW IT HAPPENED IN ARGENTINA, IN THE LIVING ROOM, THEY WERE SITTING, DRINKING, SMOKING, YOU CAN HEAR THE WIFE.
YOU CAN HEAR THE DAUGHTER SINGING IN THE BACKGROUND.
ALL THESE SIGNS PROVED THESE ARE AUTHENTIC REAL VOICES SO WHEN I REENACTED THE SCENES AND USED ABOUT TOR ACTORS, I TOLD THEM TO REENACT IT BUT THEY HAD TO MOVE THEIR LIPS ACCORDING TO THE REAL TAPE TO THE REAL VOICE SO THE AUDIENCE WILL HEAR FROM THEMSELVES HOW CRUEL AND BRUTAL HE SPEAKS FREELY ABOUT WHAT HE DID.
HOW ANTIS-SEMITIC HE WAS.
YOU TALK ABOUT THE DETAILS, IT'S SO POWERFUL TO SEE IT REENACTED THERE BY THOSE ACTORS AS WE HEAR THE ACTUAL AUDIO TAPE INCLUDING A SCENE WHERE A FLY IS SWATTED.
THAT MAY SEEM TRIVIAL BUT HAVING THE FLY DEPICTED AS HAVING JEWISH NATURE.
LET'S PLAY THAT CLIP.
[ SPEAKING NON-ENGLISH ]
WATCHING THIS GIVES ME CHILLS.
WHAT WAS SOME OF THE UNKNOWN THAT YOU HAD LEARNED FROM WATCHING IT AND LISTENING TO THE TAPES THAT YOU PREVIOUSLY HAD NOT KNOWN, NOT ONLY ABOUT HIM BUT THOSE WHO WERE SUPPORTING HIM AND HIDING THERE AND SYMPATHIZERS AND A LARGE COMMUNITY OF FORMER NAZIS AND SYMPATHIZERS THERE WITH HIM IN BROAD DAYLIGHT FOR MEETINGS IN BUENOS ARES.
WHAT WAS REMARKABLE AND DEFINES WHAT IS HAPPENING TODAY IS THAT THEY THOUGHT THE SCALE OF THE JEWISH COMMUNITY WAS A JEWISH PROPAGANDA.
THEY WERE NAZI OR NEO NAZI FOLLOWERS THAT THOUGHT THAT THESE ARE ALL JEWISH RUMORS THIS IS JEWISH PROPAGANDA.
THEY DIDN'T BELIEVE IT BECAUSE THE FINAL SOLUTION WAS NOT KNOWN TO ALL NAZI OFFICERS AND SUDDENLY HE'S SITTING THERE AMONG HIS COLLEAGUES AND TELLING THEM, WELL, THIS IS THE TRUTH.
I'M NOT GOING TO DENY IT LIKE OTHER NAZIS THAT FACED TRIAL AFTER WORLD WAR II LIKE WHEN HE FACED TRIAL IN ISRAEL, HE DENIED IT.
BUT DURING THOSE MEETINGS HE ALLOWED HIMSELF BECAUSE HE WANTED THE CREDIT.
HE ALLOWED HIMSELF TO ADMIT WHAT HE DID, WHAT THEY DID.
AND I THINK IN A WAY THESE TAPES, THIS SHOW 'THE DEVIL'S CONFESSION' WILL STAND AGAINST HOLOCAUST DENIERS THAT ARE STILL EXISTING UNTIL THIS DAY.
YOU MENTIONED JANUARY 6th AS YOU SAW PEOPLE MARCHING WITH SHIRTS DENYING THE HOLOCAUST.
SO THIS STILL EXISTS.
YOU STILL HAVE NAZI SYMPATHIZERS AMONG US.
THAT'S HORRIBLE.
THE NUMBER OF SURVIVORS.
YOU YOURSELF SAID THE HOLOCAUST SURVIVOR, WE KNOW WHO THE VILLAIN IS IN THE TRIAL AND WHO THE VILLAINS WERE AND PERPETRATORS OF THE HOLOCAUST BUT THERE ARE HEROES YOU HIGHLIGHT WHETHER HOUSNER AND THE HOLOCAUST SURVIVORS AND THE POWERFUL MESSAGES AND VOICES THEY DELIVERED ABOUT THESE ATROCITIES.
YES, I WAS FORTUNATE ENOUGH TO STILL INTERVIEW TWO AMONG THOSE HOLOCAUST SURVIVORS WHO TESTIFIED IN THE TRIAL, TWO OF THEM WERE ALIVE AND GAVE ME AN INTERVIEW.
ONE OF THEM DIED UNFORTUNATELY DURING THE PROCESS OF FILMING AND BUT IT JUST IS AN INDICATION WE'RE LOSING THE FIRST GENERATION OF SURVIVORS WHO WERE WITNESSES TO WHAT HAPPENED THERE AND THIS IS OUR RESPONSIBILITY.
SO TONIGHT, WE REMEMBER ALL THOSE WHO LOST THEIR LIVES IN THAT MASSACRE AND THOSE STILL FIGHTING TODAY TO HONOR THEIR MEMORIES.
AND THAT IS IT FOR OUR PROGRAM TONIGHT.
IF YOU WANT TO FIND OUT WHAT'S COMING UP ON THE SHOW EACH NIGHT, SIGN UP FOR OUR NEWSLETTER AT PBS.ORG/AMANPOUR.
THANK YOU FOR WATCHING.
JOIN US AGAIN NEXT TIME.