Read Full Transcript EXPAND
> HELLO, EVERYONE.
AND WELCOME TO AMANPOUR AND COMPANY.
HERE'S WHAT'S COMING UP.
DO YOU FEEL DAUNTED?
I DON'T THINK SO.
BORIS JOHNSON BECOMES THE NEXT U.K. PRIME MINISTER.
A POP YOU LIST WHO LOOKS AND SOUNDS LIKE DONALD TRUMP.
AND EXHAUSTED EUROPEAN NEGOTIATORS, IRISH, NEP AND VICE PRESIDENT OF THE PARLIAMENT JOINS ME.
THEN --
THERE IS NO NOTHING.
THEY'RE WASTING THEIR TIME.
MARLA MANIA STRIKES IN THE UNITED STATES.
I SPEAK WITH PAT TUMI.
PLUS --
PRACTICES OF RETALIATION ARE THE FIRST THING WE NEED TO TACKLE WHEN WE BEGIN TO TACKLE THESE SORT OF ME TOO ISSUES.
THE WOMEN WALKING OFF THE GOOGLE CAMPUS SPEAK OUT AGAINST WHAT THEY CALL A CULTURE OF RETALIATION.
> WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM, EVERYONE.
TODAY THE UNITED KINGDOM GOT ITS NEW PRIME MINISTER.
TO NO ONE'S SURPRISE, BORIS JOHNSON WAS SELECTED BY AN INNER CIRCLE OF CONSERVATIVE PARTY MEMBERS.
HE WHIPPED UP THE CROWD WITH HIS TYPICAL BOMBAST.
I READ THERE ARE NO INCOMING LEADER, NO INCOMING LEADER HAS EVER FACED SUCH A DAUNTING SET OF CIRCUMSTANCES, IT SAID.
WELL, I LOOK AT YOU THIS MORNING AND I ASK MYSELF, DO YOU LOOK DAUNTED?
DO YOU FEEL DAUNTED?
I DON'T THINK SO.
I DON'T THINK YOU LOOK REMOTELY DAUNTED TO ME.
AND I THINK THAT WE KNOW THAT WE CAN DO IT AND THAT THE PEOPLE OF THIS COUNTRY ARE TRUSTING IN US TO DO IT AND WE KNOW THAT WE WILL DO IT.
AND WE KNOW THE MANTRA OF THE CAMPAIGN THAT HAS JUST GONE BY.
IN CASE YOU HAVE FORGOTTEN IT -- YOU PROBABLY HAVE.
IT IS DELIVER BREXIT, UNITE THE COUNTRY AND DEFEAT JEREMY CORBIN.
AND THAT IS WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO.
[ APPLAUSE ]
I KNOW SOME WAG ALREADY POINTED OUT DELIVER, UNITE AND COMPETE WAS NOT THE PERFECT ACRONYM.
BUT THEY FORGOT THE FINAL E, DUDE, WE ARE GOING TO ENERGIZE THE COUNTRY.
WE'RE GOING TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF ALL THE OPPORTUNITIES THAT WILL BRING IN A NEW SPIRIT OF CAN DO.
UNUSUAL LANGUAGE AND STYLE FOR A BRITISH PRIME MINISTER, A POITICIAN WHO FRONTED THE CAMPAIGN.
HE WON THE LEADERSHIP CONTEST BY A MARGIN OF 40,000 VOTES WHICH IS A LOT CONSIDERING IT WAS ONLY OPEN TO THE PARTY MEMBERSHIP SOME 160,000 PEOPLE.
THAT'S 0.2% OF THE WHOLE ELECTOR CAT.
TOMORROW HE WILL ENTER AS PRIME MINISTER.
THERESA MAY EXITS AND THE COUNTRY FACES NOT ONLY AN UPHILL STRUGGLE WITH BREXIT BUT SERIOUS TENSIONS WITH IRAN.
LET'S GET STRAIGHT TO WHAT THIS CHANGE AT THE TOP MEANS WITH MICHAEL FALLON.
HE BACKED BORIS JOHNSON DURING THE CAMPAIGN AND IS JOINING ME NOW HERE IN OUR LONDON STUDIO.
WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM.
THANK YOU.
I ALWAYS WANTED TO ASK FOR EVERYBODY WHO HAS BEEN SAYING BORIS JOHNSON BEARS A DISTINCT RESEMBLANCE IN LOOK AND IN STYLE TO DONALD TRUMP.
AND PRESIDENT TRUMP TODAY GAVE A SPEECH IN WASHINGTON WHERE HE CALLED BORIS JOHNSON BRITAIN'S TRUMP.
WE HAVE A REALLY GOOD MAN WHO IS GOING TO BE THE PRIME MINISTER OF THE UK NOW, BORIS JOHNSON.
GOOD MAN.
HE'S TOUGH AND HE'S SMART.
THEY SAY BRITAIN TRUMP.
THAT'S A GOOD THING.
THEY LIKE ME OVER THERE.
THAT'S WHAT THEY WANTED.
THAT'S WHAT THEY NEED.
THAT'S WHAT THEY NEED.
HE'LL GET IT DONE.
BORIS IS GOOD.
HE'S GOING TO DO A GOOD JOB.
IS THAT WHAT YOU BARGAINED FOR?
YOU WANT A BRITISH TRUMP?
NOT NECESSARILY A BRITISH TRUMP BUT TO HAVE SOMEBODY WHO IS ALREADY AN ALLY OF THE PRESIDENT, HAS A GOOD RELATIONSHIP WITH HIM, I REMEMBER THE FIRST TIME THEY MET AT A NATO SUMMIT AFTER THE PRESIDENT TOOK OFFICE.
THEY CLEARLY GET ON WELL.
WHEN BORIS WAS FOREIGN SECRETARY, THEY WORKED WELL TOGETHER.
THAT'S IMPORTANT TO US IN BRITAIN, TO HAVE SOMEBODY WHO WORKS WELL WITH YOUR PRESIDENT, WHOEVER YOUR ELECTED PRESIDENT IS.
BUT PEOPLE HAVE POINTED OUT THAT HE'S VERY MUCH LIKE OUR TRUMP IN THAT TRUMP HAS PLAYED THE, YOU KNOW, DIVISIVE CARD.
YOU'VE GOT THE RACIST TWEETS, THE ANTI-IMMIGRANT SENTIMENT.
YOU HAVE GOT THE POPULISM THAT HAS BECOME DE FACTO IN POLITICS TODAY.
WE HAVE TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT THIS.
BORIS FOR EIGHT YEARS WAS MAYOR OF LONDON, ONE OF THE MOST ETHNICALLY DIVERSE CITIES AROUND AND WAS VERY MUCH A SOCIAL LIBERAL IN OUR TERMS, IN OUR TERMS IN THE CONSERVATIVE PARTY AND WAS AN EARLY ADOP TOR OF THE UK RIGHTS LEGISLATION.
I DON'T THINK HE'S LIKE YOUR PRESIDENT IN THAT RESPECT.
BUT, YES, HE'S POPULIST AND YES HE'S AN OPTIMIST.
HE IS VERY MUCH THAT SEES THE BEST OF BRITAIN AND THINKS WE CAN GET THROUGH THE CHALLENGE OF BREXIT AND FIND A NEW ROLE FOR OURSELVES IN THE WORLD.
I JUST WANTED TO PICK YOU UP A LITTLE BIT ON THIS POINT AND PERHAPS YOU CAN PUT IT TO BED.
HE USED WORDS LIKE PICKANINNIES.
HE'S TALKED ABOUT BARACK OBAMA WHEN HE WAS PRESIDENT HAVING A HISTORICAL ANCESTRAL DISLIKE OF BRITAIN BECAUSE HE WAS BORN TO A KENYAN FATHER.
PUT TOGETHER THESE THINGS HE SAYS.
I MUST BE CAREFUL HOW I DO THAT BECAUSE HE WAS A JOURNALIST.
AND SAYING THAT TO YOU I'VE GOT TO BE CAREFUL.
HE'S BEEN USING COLORFUL LANGUAGE IN HIS JOURNALISM.
BUT THAT ARTICLE ON THE RIGHTS OF WOMEN TO WEAR THE BURKA, HE WAS STANDING UP FOR THAT RIGHT.
HE'S APOLOGIZED ALL ALONG IN THIS CAMPAIGN FOR ANYBODY WHO MIGHT HAVE BEEN OFFENDED BY HIS PREVIOUS JOURNALISM.
BUT THAT'S WHAT HE IS.
HE WAS A JOURNALIST.
THAT WAS HIS STOCK AND TRADE.
I HATE AGAIN TO PICK YOU UP AGAIN BECAUSE HERE WAS A JOURNALIST THAT GOT FIRED FOR TELLING SOME LIES ABOUT STORIES AND MISQUOTING PEOPLE.
AND PEOPLE HAVE SAID AGAIN THAT THIS IS A VERY, VERY IMPORTANT TIME.
AND AS I QUOTED 'THE NEW YORK TIMES,' HIS RELATIONSHIP WITH THE TRUTH AND WITH PRINCIPAL IS SOMEWHAT SKETCHY.
YOU KNOW, THE BIG EMBLAZENED FIGURE ON THE CAMPAIGN WAS TOTAL NONSENSE.
ISN'T IT HAPPENING.
WHAT HE SAID ABOUT TURKS WANTING TO INVADE BRITAIN WAS A NONSENSE, VERY INFLAMMATORY STUFF.
I GUESS I'M ASKING YOU THIS TO KNOW HOW HE'S GOING TO UNITE A COUNTRY, HOW HE'S GOING TO WORK WITH PEOPLE AND POLITICIANS FROM EUROPE AND THE REST TO ACTUALLY, YOU KNOW, ACHIEVE SOMETHING THAT THIS COUNTRY NEEDS, AND THAT IS A PROPER BREXIT DEAL AND A PROPER EXIT.
I'M NOT GOING TO GO BACK OVER ALL THE INDIVIDUAL PHRASES HE USED WHEN HE WAS A JOURNALIST AND DURING THE REFERENDUM CAMPAIGN WHETHER HE SHOULD STAY IN THERE OR NOT.
BUT I THINK THE POINT ABOUT BORIS JOHNSON IS HE ALSO HAS SOLID SENIOR EXPERIENCE IN PUBLIC OFFICE, RUNNING THE CITY OF LONDON FOR TWO CONSECUTIVE TERMS FOR EIGHT YEARS, BEING FOREIGN SECRETARY FOR TWO YEARS, ALONGSIDE ME AS DEFENSE SECRETARY.
WE SHAPED THE COALITION WITH THE HELP OF OUR ALLIES INCLUDING THE UNITED STATES TO FIGHT DASH, ISIS AND TERRORISM IN THE MIDDLE EAST.
HE STOOD UP TO RUSSIA.
IF YOU REMEMBER THE SALISBURY POISONINGS.
THIS IS A MAN THAT LOOKED AFTER THE BRITISH INTERESTS WHEN THE GOING GOT TOUGH.
DO YOU WORRY THAT -- HE WAS FOREIGN SECRETARY WHEN YOU WERE DEFENSE SECRETARY.
YOU HAVE SEEN ALL THE ARTICLES.
YOU HAVE SEEN THE FOREIGN SERVICE OFFICERS WHO TALKED ABOUT THE DAY HE RESIGNED A YEAR AGO AS LIBERATION DAY IN THE FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE.
THEY CALLED HIM UNPREPARED, GAFFE PRONE, UNFOCUSSED.
ARE YOU CONCERNED ABOUT THAT GIVEN THE MASSIVE NATURE, AS WE HAVE SEEN, OVER THE PAST THREE YEARS OF TRYING TO SECURE A BREXIT.
ARE YOU CONCERNED ABOUT THAT?
HOW WILL HE DO ANY DIFFERENT THAN WHAT PRIME MINISTER MAY DID?
WELL, DIPLOMATS ARE ALWAYS CONCERNED ABOUT LANGUAGE AND WORDS.
THAT'S THEIR STOCK AND TRADE.
I THINK EVERY FOREIGN SECRETARY WE'VE HAD, AND WHO KNOWS PERHAPS YOUR SECRETARIES OF STATE HAVE TRIPPED UP OCCASIONALLY FOR THE ODD SLIP OF THE TONGUE FOR WHICH THEY HAD TO APOLOGIZE BECAUSE THESE THINGS DO MATTER IN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMACY.
BUT WHEN IT CAME TO THE REALLY TOUGH DECISIONS AND SOME OF THE OPERATIONS THAT HE HAD TO AUTHORIZE, SOME OF THE STEPS THAT HAD TO BE TAKEN TO PROTECT US FROM TERRORISM, I HAVE NO DOUBT AT ALL THAT BORIS JOHNSON WAS THEN AND WILL BE A VERY SERIOUS DEFENDER OF THE BRITISH INTEREST.
HE'S NOT THE SAME AS THERESA MAY, QUITE CLEARLY.
HE WAS A VERY DIFFERENT POLITICAL ANIMAL, IF YOU'D LIKE.
MORE INTROVERTED, VERY SHY, VERY DUTIFUL, BUT VERY DIFFERENT.
WHAT MAGIC SOURCE WILL HE BRING TO THIS MIX THAT SUDDENLY MAKES EUROPE SAY, WHOA, THERE IS A NEW PRIME MINISTER WHO IS SAYING WE'RE GOING TO BE OUT, DEAL OR NO DEAL.
WE DON'T WANT THE BACKSTOP.
WE DON'T WANT THIS DEAL THAT THERESA MAY NEGOTIATED PAINSTAKINGLY.
WHAT IS HE GOING TO DO?
WHAT IS HE GOING TO OFFER?
WHAT'S DIFFERENT?
THE BIG THING THAT'S DIFFERENT IS THAT BORIS JOHNSON IS A BREXITEER.
HE BELIEVES IN US LEAVING THE EUROPEAN UNION.
THERESA MAY DIDN'T.
SHE WANTED TO REMAIN.
BUT BORIS BELIEVES IN THIS.
HE BELIEVES THERE IS A FUTURE, STRONG FUTURE FOR BRITAIN OUTSIDE THE EUROPEAN UNION.
HE'S BRINGING AMBITIOUS AND OPTIMISM AND ENERGY TO THIS TASK.
AND HE'S ALSO TRADING ON THE FACT THAT PARLIAMENT DOES NOT LIKE THE PRESENT DEAL THAT WAS NEGOTIATED BY THERESA MAY.
PARLIAMENT WANTS A BETTER DEAL.
IT IS NOT JUST BORIS JOHNSON WHO WANTS A BETTER DEAL.
PARLIAMENT ITSELF WOULD NOT ACCEPT THE INTERIOR DEAL THAT THERESA MAY PRESENTED.
OF COURSE EVERYBODY WANTS TO KNOW WHAT WILL THE INGREDIENTS OF THAT BETTER DEAL BE AND HOW WILL HE DO A BETTER JOB OF GETTING THE EUROPEANS TO AGREE?
TO THAT POINT I'D LIKE TO READ FROM WHAT THE FORMER PARTY LEADER AND FORMER SECRETARY HAS WRITTEN IN THE DAILY TELEGRAPH.
HE SAID, YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE CONSISTENTLY ADVOCATED AN IMPROVED DEAL WITH THE EU BUT YOU MADE THAT IMPOSSIBLE TO OBTAIN WHEN YOU RULED OUT CHANGES TO THE IRISH BACKSTOP LAST WEEK AND INSISTED IT MUST BE REMOVED ALTOGETHER.
YOU DISMAYED SOME OF YOUR ADVISERS AND DELIGHTED OTHERS.
THOSE WHO BELIEVE THAT THE EU WILL BACK AWAY COMPLETELY FROM THE WITHDRAWAL AGREEMENT THEY SPENT TWO YEARS NEGOTIATING IN FAVOR OF SOMETHING YOU LIKE AND HE CALLS THAT FANTASY.
WELL ALREADY YOU HAVE SEEN TODAY THE EUROPEAN LEADERS WELCOME THE ELECTION OF BORIS JOHNSON AS OUR LEADER, SAYING THEY'RE READY TO SIT DOWN AND WORK WITH HIM.
THEY WANT TO AVOID, BY THE WAY, NO DEAL.
THEY WANT TO AVOID A DISORDERLY EXIT.
BORIS SAYS DEAL OR NO DEAL, DO OR DIE.
HE'S HAD TO SAY THAT TO MAKE SURE THEY UNDERSTAND WE'RE SERIOUS ABOUT THIS.
BUT THEY'RE NEIGHBORS PARTICULARLY WOULD BE PARTICULARLY HURT BY NO DEAL.
THEY DON'T WANT THAT EITHER.
SO EVERYBODY WILL BE SITTING DOWN TO SEE, OKAY, CAN WE IMPROVE THIS?
PARTICULARLY AS PARLIAMENT WANTED BETTER ARRANGEMENTS FOR NORTHERN IRELAND AND WE DON'T WANT TO BE TRAPPED IN SOMETHING THAT LOOKS LIKE THE EXISTING CUSTOMS UNION FOREVER.
SO THERE ARE WAYS IN WHICH LANGUAGE CAN BE IMPROVED AND THAT WE CAN GET SOMETHING WE'LL GET THROUGH PARLIAMENT.
YOU CAN ONLY DO THAT IF YOU BELIEVE IN IT AND BORIS JOHNSON DOES BELIEVE IN IT.
I'M IMPRESSED BY YOUR FAITH AND HIS FAITH AND OPTIMISM, BUT THIS IS A VERY DIFFICULT I DON'T NEED TO TELL YOU NEGOTIATION THAT'S BEEN GOING ON FOR THE BETTER PART OF TWO YEARS.
WE TALKED ABOUT PRESIDENT TRUMP AND THE NEED TO HAVE A STRONG RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE LEADERS OF BOTH COUNTRIES.
FORMER LABOR PRIME MINISTER, GORDON BROWN, WAS IN THE STUDIO THIS WEEK.
AND HE WAS CONCERNED FOR WHAT APPEARS TO BE EGGING ON BORIS JOHNSON TO TAKE THE AMERICAN VIEW COME WHAT MAY AND TO, YOU KNOW, SOMEWHAT MAKE EUROPE A SECOND PARTY.
LET'S JUST LISTEN TO WHAT HE SAID.
BORIS JOHNSON IS UNDER A HUGE AMOUNT OF PRESSURE FROM HIS OWN BREXITEERS, THOSE PEOPLE WHO ARE VERY HARD LINED ANTI-EUROPEAN.
AND THEY WOULD PREFER TO SEE AN EVEN STRONGER RELATIONSHIP WITH THE UNITED STATES, EVEN IF IT'S BASED ON EFFECTIVELY TAKING INSTRUCTIONS FROM PRESIDENT TRUMP.
SO I THINK HE IS UNDER A GREAT DEAL OF PRESSURE IN THAT RESPECT.
BUT I DO FEEL THAT HE IS GOING TO HAVE TO SHOW THAT HE IS ALSO INDEPENDENT.
AND I THINK THIS WILL BE THE TEST OF THE FIRST FEW DAYS.
FOR EXAMPLE, YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU BECOME PRIME MINISTER, YOU HAVE CALLS.
THEY GO IN A ROW.
WHO DO YOU CALL FIRST?
WHO TAKES THE CALL FIRST?
IS IT GOING TO BE PRESIDENT TRUMP OR ANGELA MERKEL, EMANUEL MACRON.
I THINK HE'S MAKING DECISIONS RIGHT FROM THE WORD GO ABOUT WHAT HIS PRIORITIES ARE IN FOREIGN POLICY.
CLEARLY HE HAS TO GET A DEAL ON BREXIT OR TRY TO GET A DEAL ON BREXIT, GET A RESOLUTION ON BREXIT.
BUT OBVIOUSLY THE AMERICAN RELATIONSHIP IS INCREDIBLY IMPORTANT AND HE HAS GOT TO WORK HARD.
IN WHICH AREAS WILL HE AGREE WITH PRESIDENT TRUMP?
IN WHICH AREAS WILL HE BE AT ODDS WITH HIM?
HE WAS DISCUSSING THE FIRST DAYS IN OFFICE.
SO WHAT DOES BORIS JOHNSON HAVE TO DO TO PROVE THAT HE'S NOT GOING TO QUOTE, UNQUOTE, TAKE INSTRUCTIONS FROM THE UNITED STATES?
YOU KNOW, WE KNOW THAT HE THREW ERIC UNDER THE BUS BECAUSE PRESIDENT TRUMP WASN'T HAPPY.
THAT'S WHAT THE COMMENTARY IS.
IT'S A TOUCHY SITUATION NOW.
LET'S JUST REEL BACK A BIT.
HE'S ALREADY PROVED HE DOESN'T HAVE TO TAKE INSTRUCTIONS FROM PRESIDENT TRUMP BECAUSE OF THE STANCE HE TOOK ON IRAN, IF YOU REMEMBER WHEN HE WAS FOREIGN SECRETARY AND AMERICA DECIDED THEY WANTED TO WITHDRAW FROM THE NUCLEAR AGREEMENT.
WE DIDN'T GO THAT WAY.
BORIS JOHNSON HAS DEFENDED THE EUROPEAN AGREEMENT BECAUSE HE BELIEVED AT THE TIME THAT ACTUALLY IT WAS THE BEST WAY OF DELAYING IRAN'S NUCLEAR PROGRAM.
SO THERE IS ALREADY A DIFFERENCE OF VIEW BETWEEN BORIS JOHNSON AND DONALD TRUMP.
AND THERE WILL BE OTHER EXAMPLES OF WHERE, AS A GOOD FRIEND AND A STRONG ALLY THE BRITISH PRIME MINISTER OCCASIONALLY BE DISAGREE WITH THE AMERICAN PRESIDENT.
DO YOU THINK HE WILL ACTIVELY AS THERESA MAY ADVISED ACTIVELY TRY TO LOBBY PRESIDENT TRUMP TO GET BACK INTO THE DEAL OR SOME VERSION OF THE DEAL?
WOULD YOU SUPPORT THAT?
WELL, I THINK THERE IS GOING TO HAVE TO BE.
I THINK HE'S ALREADY MADE THAT CLEAR AND YOU HAVE SEEN WHAT'S BEEN HAPPENING ON THE INTERNATIONAL WATERWAY SINCE WE'VE LOST ONE OF OUR TANKERS THAT'S BEEN CAPTURED.
SO IN THE END, SOMEBODY IS GOING TO HAVE TO RENEGOTIATE WITH IRAN TO BRING SOME SENSE INTO THIS SITUATION, WHICH IS FAIRLY DANGEROUS AT THE MOMENT.
BUT THE POINT I'M MAKING IS IT DOES NOT FOLLOW THAT BORIS JOHNSON WILL DO WHAT THE PRESIDENT WANTS.
HE BELIEVES IT IS BETTER TO HAVE SOME FORM OF AGREEMENT WITH IRAN THAT BUYS US ALL A BIT OF TIME.
SHOULD WE INTRODUCE YOU IN THIS SEGMENT RIGHT NOW AS BEING AMIDST A BREXIT STRUGGLE BUT ALSO IN A CRISIS IN THE GULF.
WHAT DOES THE NEW GOVERNMENT DO TO GET BACK THE TANKER, TO RESOLVE THIS SITUATION, PRESUMABLY DIPLOMATICALLY?
BUT I THINK WE ALSO HAVE TO SHOW IRAN THAT THESE WERE CRIMES TO SELL OIL TO THE SYRIAN REGIME, WHICH IS WHAT IS ALLEGED IS A CRIME.
BUT TO TAKE ONE OF OUR TANKERS OUT OF WATERS IS ALSO A CRIME.
THESE ARE CRIMINAL ACTS.
AND THEY CAN'T BE ACCEPTED.
SO WE WILL HAVE TO DIVORCE THIS FROM THE NUCLEAR PROGRAM AND MAKE IT CLEAR TO IRAN WE'LL HAVE TO TAKE EXTRA STEPS NOW TO PROTECT THE INTERNATIONAL WATERWAY WITH A MULTINATIONAL TASK FORCE WHICH I HOPE WILL INCLUDE THE AMERICAN NAVY AND AMERICAN SUPPORT.
BUT WILL ALSO INCLUDE SHIPS FROM OTHER EUROPEAN NAVIES.
SO YOU SEE IT GETTING MORE TENSE, MORE OF A BUILD-UP?
IT IS GETTING MORE TENSE.
EVERYBODY WANTS TO DEESCALATE IT.
BUT THAT SHOULDN'T EXCUSE WHAT IRAN HAS DONE AND WE SHOULDN'T ALLOW OUR CONCERNS ABOUT IRAN'S NUCLEAR PROGRAM OR THE SURVIVAL OF THE AGREEMENT TO IN ANY WAY EXCUSE WHAT IRAN HAS DONE OR THE NEED TO PROTECT OUR IRELAND GAS SUPPLIES THROUGH THAT PARTICULAR STRAIT.
THE IRANIAN FOREIGN MINISTER REACHED OUT TO BORIS JOHNSON SAYING IRAN WAS NOT LOOKING FOR CONFLICT.
IN A STRANGE WAY NOT TO LOOK FOR CONFLICT BUT CAPTURING ONE OF OUR TANKERS AND REFUSING TO HAND IT BACK.
SO, YOU KNOW, THIS IS, I'M AFRAID, A VERY TENSE SITUATION AT THE MOMENT.
OBVIOUSLY WE DON'T WANT TO ESCALATE IT.
BUT EQUALLY, WE WILL HAVE TO START PROPERLY PATROLLING THIS INTERNATIONAL WATERWAY.
VERY INTERESTING TIMES.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR WEIGHING IN.
NOW WE'RE GOING TO GET THE VIEW FROM EUROPE.
SO WHILE BORIS JOHNSON HAS OVERWHELMING SUPPORT FROM THE PRO BREXIT CONSERVATIVE PARTY LEADERSHIP, THE EUROPEAN UNION WILL BE HARDER TO WIN OVER.
THE EU AND BORIS JOHNSON HAVE A STORIED AND DOUBLED RELATIONSHIP.
THE INCOMING EU CHIEF AND THE FRENCH PRESIDENT EMANUEL MACRON REACHED OUT WITH TALK OF FUTURE CHALLENGES.
I AM WILLING TO WORK CLOSELY WITH HIM, NOT ONLY ON EUROPEAN ISSUES INCLUDING THE BREXIT NEGOTIATIONS BUT ALSO IN INTERNATIONAL ISSUES ON WHICH WE ARE TIGHTLY COORDINATED, SPECIFICALLY WITH THE BRITISH AND THE GERMANS.
COULD IT BE THE IRAN SITUATION OR ANY INTERNATIONAL SECURITY ISSUE?
I'M LOOKING FORWARD TO HAVE A GOOD WORKING RELATION WITH HIM.
THERE ARE MANY DIFFERENT AND DIFFICULT ISSUES TO TACKLE TOGETHER.
WE HAVE CHALLENGING TIMES AHEAD OF US.
SO WHAT IS IN STORE FOR THE FUTURE OF THIS RELATIONSHIP?
THE VICE PRESIDENT OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT JOINS US FROM BRUSBRUSSELS.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR JOINING OUR PROGRAM AGAIN.
GOOD EVENING.
YOU HEARD WHAT THE FORMER DEFENSE SECRETARY JUST SAID, THAT THE EU IS GOING TO SEE AN ENERGIZED OPTIMISTIC BORIS JOHNSON, CAN DO AND HOPEFULLY YOU WILL ALL BE OPEN TO SOME KIND OF RENEGOTIATION OR OPENING WHERE YOU WEREN'T TO THERESA MAY.
WELL, I THINK THE FIRST PART I'LL ACCEPT.
THE SECOND PART NOT SO.
I THINK IT'S WELCOME THERE IS A NEW LEADER IN THE UNITED KINGDOM WHO TALKS ABOUT ENERGY ALL OF THESE STRONG WORDS WHICH MAKES THE PEOPLE FEEL GOOD.
I THINK LEADERS NEED TO DO THAT.
THE INCOMING PRESIDENT OF THE COMMISSION IS VERY CLEAR THERE ARE HUGE CHALLENGES AHEAD OF US.
TODAY IS THE DAY REALLY TO WISH THE NEW LEADER OF THE UNITED KINGDOM, THE PRIME MINISTER BORIS JOHNSON WELL BECAUSE HE HAS A LOT ON HIS SHOULDERS.
BUT I THINK IT IS OVER TIME WE'LL SEE WHAT CAN HAPPEN IN TERMS OF THE RELATIONSHIP AND ON THE DIFFICULT ISSUE OF BREXIT.
I THINK IT IS QUITE INTERESTING THE LANGUAGE IS SHARP AND CLEAR.
BUT ON THE OTHER HAND, SOMETIMES THE CLEAREST OF LANGUAGE IS THE MOST OPAQUE.
THIS SUGGESTS THAT ONCE AND FOR ALL WE CAN DO IT ON A DAY AND MOVE ONWARD.
BUT WE KNOW THAT IS NOT THE CASE.
WITH A WITHDRAWN AGREEMENT THAT IS ACCEPTABLE, WE CAN MOVE ON TO THE IMPLEMENTATION AND GET TO THE NEW RELATIONSHIP.
WITH A NO DEAL BREXIT, IN THAT CASE THERE WOULD STILL BE ISSUES TO DEAL WITH AFTER THERE IS A DEPARTURE WITH NO DEAL AND I HOPE I'M MAKING SENSE.
THIS IS A VERY COMPLICATED PROCESS.
WE JUST HAVE A NEW LEADER ELECTED IN THE UNITED KINGDOM, AND WE HAVE TO WAIT AND SEE WHAT WILL HAPPEN WHEN I SUPPOSE THERE ARE FILES READ AND ISSUES TO BE DEALT WITH BOTH DOMESTIC, WHICH ARE QUITE SERIOUS INTERNATIONAL ISSUES LIKE IRAN AND CLEARLY THE RELATIONSHIP WITH THE EUROPEAN UNION.
HERE WE HAVE BEEN GETTING OUR WORK.
BUT PEOPLE ARE TALKING ABOUT NEEDING TO HAVE A GOOD RELATIONSHIP WITH THE PRIME MINISTER, WHOEVER IT IS.
ONE OF THE VERY KEY POINTS, AND I NEED TO STRESS THIS, IS THAT REGARDLESS OF WHOSE NAME IS OVER THE DOOR AND THERE IS A CHANGE NOW FROM THERESA MAY TO BORIS JOHNSON, THE FACTS AND THE ISSUES REMAIN THE SAME.
THE APPROACHES MIGHT BE DIFFERENT.
BUT WE HAVE TO STILL DEAL WITH THE ISSUES THAT THE PRIME MINISTER THERESA MAY IN ALL GOOD FAITH WORKED WITH US ON THOSE AND SHE HAD TO TURN CORNERS WHEN SHE REALIZED HER COMMITMENTS TO NORTHERN IRELAND, TO THE GOOD FRIDAY AGREEMENT COULD NOT BE DEALT WITH IF SHE KEPT TO HER RED LINES.
I WONDER WHAT YOU THINK THAT --
THE DEAL ON THE TABLE REFLECTS HER CONCERNS.
I WONDER IF YOU THINK, AND I WILL PLAY A LITTLE BIT OF BORIS JOHNSON'S EXPLANATION AND REACHOUT TO THE EU AND TO HIS OWN PARTY OBVIOUSLY WHETHER HE MAY HAVE BOXED HIMSELF IN AS WELL.
SO LET'S JUST PLAY THIS FOR A MOMENT.
WE'RE GOING TO GET BREXIT DONE ON OCTOBER 31st.
WE'RE GOING TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF ALL THE OPPORTUNITIES IT WILL BRING IN A NEW SPIRIT OF CAN DO.
AND WE ARE ONCE AGAIN GOING TO BELIEVE IN OURSELVES AND WHAT WE CAN ACHIEVE.
LIKE SOME SLUMBERING GIANT, WE WILL RISE AND PING OFF SELF-DOUBT AND NEGATIVITY.
HOW DO YOU READ THAT, PING OFF THE ROBES, ACHIEVE BREXIT, CAN DO.
HE DID ACTUALLY SAY THE OTHER DAY THAT IF 50 YEARS AGO ONE CAN PUT PEOPLE ON THE MOON THEN SURELY ONE CAN OVERCOME TECHNICAL DIFFICULTIES TO MONITOR THE IRISH BORDER.
BEFORE I ADDRESS THAT POINT, THE LINE THAT STUCK OUT FOR ME IS WHERE HE IS SAYING WE HAVE TO BELIEVE IN OURSELVES AGAIN.
WHAT TROUBLES ME IS WHEN DID BRITAIN AND THE UNITED KINGDOM STOP BELIEVING IN THEMSELVES?
THAT'S QUITE A STAGGERING STATEMENT AND THAT HE BELIEVES THAT OVERNIGHT HE CAN CHANGE THAT DYNAMIC.
I WOULD HOPE THAT THE BRITISH PEOPLE WHO ARE A VERY PROUD PEOPLE AND A BIG NATION HAVE SELF-BELIEF.
WE ALL NEED THAT AS NATIONS AND PEOPLES.
THEN TO YOUR QUESTION ABOUT HIS ANALOGY WITH SPACE AND THE IRISH BORDER AND MIXING THESE THINGS UP, YOU KNOW, PERHAPS GETTING TO THE MOON IS SIMPLER THAN DEALING WITH THE COMPLEXITIES OF RELATIONSHIPS OF PEOPLE THAT WERE STRAINED FOR DECADES WHERE WE BUILT A PEACE PROCESS THAT IS STILL DELICATE BUT WORKING AND WE NEED TO CONTINUE THAT PROCESS AND NOT PUT OBSTACLES IN ITS WAY.
I THINK THE COLORFUL LANGUAGE IS GREAT AND MAKES GREAT HEADLINES.
I TOO WAS A JOURNALIST.
I THINK PERHAPS THE DIFFERENCE IS THAT WHEN I MOVED AND WAS ELECTED TO POLITICS I DROPPED ALL MY JOURNALIST FRIENDS.
I DON'T BELIEVE I'M A JOURNALIST NOW.
I'M A POLPOLITICIAN.
I'M NOT HERE TO MAKE HEADLINES.
I THINK THAT PERHAPS THE NEW PRIME MINISTER WITH ALL THE HUGE RESPONSIBILITIES TAKING ON, HE WANTED THIS JOB I THINK MORE THAN ANYTHING ELSE.
HE NOW HAS IT.
AND I'M WONDERING IN PRIVATE AND QUIET MOMENTS IF HE GETS THEM WILL HE LOOK IN THE MIRROR AND SAY, MY GOSH, I HAVE ACHIEVED THIS, MY DREAM, BUT I WANT TO MAKE SURE IT DOESN'T BECOME A NIGHTMARE AND THEREFORE WE ALL HAVE TO WORK TOGETHER ON BREXIT TO MAKE SURE THAT IF IT'S GOING TO HAPPEN IT DOES IT IN A VERY SENSIBLE AND COHERENT WAY THAT AND IT DOESN'T DAMAGE ANY OF US, EITHER THE UNITED KINGDOM OR THE EUROPEAN UNION.
THE TRUTH IS IT WILL DAMAGE US A LITTLE, ALL OF US, BUT WE HAVE TO MINE MIEZ THAT DAMAGE AND I HOPE WE CAN WORK TOGETHER AND ACHIEVE THAT.
LET ME ASK YOU THIS.
YOU HAVE TO WORK TOGETHER.
BUT THE FORMER PRIME MINISTER SAID HE PROMISED UK VOTERS HE WILL NOT PAY DUES TO THE EU.
THAT IS A REAL PROBLEM TO THE EU.
IT LOOKS LIKE A DECLARATION OF ECONOMIC WAR.
I MEAN, THAT'S NOT A FRIENDLY COLLEAGUE THING TO SAY AS HE'S TRYING TO INTRONEGOTIATIONS WITH YOU.
LOTS OF THINGS ARE SAID IN THE HEAT OF BATTLE.
THOSE AMONGST US THAT HEAR ALL THESE THINGS AND WRITE THEM DOWN REFLECT QUIETLY ON THEM AND DEAL WITH WHERE WE'RE AT TOE DAY.
IF YOU TAKE THAT PLACE OF A HARD BREXIT AND PULLING AWAY FROM COMMITMENTS ENTERED INTO IN GOOD FAITH, I THINK THAT WILL HIT BACK MORE ON THE UNITED KINGDOM AS A NATION TRYING TO GO OFF ON ITS OWN AND BUILD RELATIONSHIPS PERHAPS WITH THE U.S. AND ELSEWHERE.
AND IT WILL NEED TO HAVE A REPUTATION THAT IT RESPECTS ITS AGREEMENTS.
THAT'S VERY IMPORTANT IN GLOBAL RELATIONSHIPS.
AND THE IDEA OF WALKING AWAY AND NOT PAYING THE BILL WOULDN'T LOOK PARTICULARLY WELL.
I DON'T THINK THE PRIME MINISTER WOULD LIKE IT TO BE PRESENTED AS THAT.
AT THE END OF THE DAY, THE EUROPEAN UNION OF 28 CAME TOGETHER VOLUNTARILY, INCLUDING THE UNITED KINGDOM.
THE UK MADE A DECISION TO LEAVE, BUT WE HAVE TO DO IT RESPECTING EACH OTHER.
WE ALSO HAVE TO RESPECT THE RULES OF THE EUROPEAN UNION.
WE DON'T WANT TO CHANGE OUR RULES BECAUSE ONE IS LEAVING.
BUT WE DO WANT TO TRY AND HAVE A VERY GOOD RELATIONSHIP IN THE FUTURE WITH THIS COUNTRY THAT IS STILL VERY CLOSE TO US PHYSICALLY AND OTHERWISE WE HOPE.
BUT IT IS NOT GOING TO BE THE SAME AS FULL MEMBERSHIP.
MY WORRY ABOUT THE EVENTS OF TODAY IS NOT SO MUCH WE HAVE MORE NEGOTIATIONS BUT THE TIME LINES ARE VERY TIGHT.
THERE WILL BE A PARTY CONFERENCE ON THE 29th OF SEPTEMBER AND THEN THERE IS TO BE THIS D-DAY OF BREXIT AGAIN OCTOBER 31st.
AND THEN THERE IS THE AUGUST RECESS.
SO IN TERMS OF GETTING DOWN TO, YOU KNOW, DEALING WITH EACH OTHER, UNDERSTANDING EACH OTHER, GOING THROUGH THE DETAILS OF THE WITHDRAWAL AGREEMENT, PERHAPS EXPLAINING IT MORE IN DETAIL TO THE PRIME MINISTER, THERE ISN'T A LOT OF TIME TO DO ALL OF THAT.
AND I THINK I ALREADY MET, YOU KNOW, SECRETARIES TODAY FOR EXAMPLE FROM THE EQUINE INDUSTRY FROM THE REPUBLIC OF IRELAND FROM ACROSS EUROPE WHO ARE DEEPLY CONCERNED ABOUT BREXIT HAPPENING IN A VERY DISORDERLY WAY, AND THEY'RE JUST ONE SECTOR.
THERE ARE OTHERS THAT WILL BE WATCHING AND WAITING FOR ALL THE COMMENTARY OF TODAY AND TOMORROW AND THE NEXT DAY'S TRYING TO UNDERSTAND WHAT WILL HAPPEN.
AND HERE IS THE THING FOR ALL OF US.
THREE YEARS AGO WHEN THE UK VOTED TO LEAVE THE EUROPEAN UNION, NO ONE WOULD HAVE PREDICTED A CHANGE OF LEADER, A LENGTHY PROCESS, U-TURNS ALONG THE WAY, DIFFERENT RED LINES, ALL SORTS OF THINGS THAT HAPPENED.
NO ONE WOULD HAVE PREDICTED TODAY WE WOULD HAVE A THIRD LEADER OF THE CONSERVATIVE PARTY AND PRIME MINISTER OF THE UNITED KINGDOM.
AND THERE IS NOT ONE OF US, ME INCLUDED, WHO CAN PREDICT THE NEXT STEPS EVEN IF THEY ARE ONLY WEEKS AWAY.
INDEED.
THESE ARE TRICKY TIMES.
THANK YOU FOR TRYING TO GUIDE US THROUGH THEM.
THANK YOU SO MUCH.
> NOW, BORIS JOHNSON WORKING WITH WASHINGTON.
IT IS SOMETHING PRESIDENT TRUMP HAS REPEATEDLY HINTED AT.
BUT EASIER SAID THAN DONE AND IT IS HARDLY THE TOP OF THE PRESIDENT'S AGENDA RIGHT NOW WITH THE HUGELY ANTICIPATED PUBLIC TESTIMONY OF ROBERT MUELLER BEFORE CONGRESS TOMORROW.
JOINING ME FOR MORE ON ALL OF THIS IS THE REPUBLICAN FROM PENNSYLVANIA.
HE'S BEEN ONE OF THE FEW IN HIS PARTY WHO ISN'T AFRAID TO CRITICIZE THE PRESIDENT AND HE'S JOINING US NOW FROM WASHINGTON.
SENATOR TUMI, WELCOME BACK TO THE PROGRAM.
THANKS FOR HAVING ME.
CAN I JUST ASK YOU FIRST OF MAKING A CONNECTION BETWEEN OUR PROOEF YUS GUEST AND YOURSELF OVER THE ISSUE OF BREXIT BUT MOST PARTICULARLY THE RELATIONSHIP OF BRITAIN GOING FORWARD WITH THE UNITED STATES AND A POSSIBLE PREFERENTIAL TRADE DEAL.
WE HEARD PRESIDENT TRUMP TODAY PRAISE BORIS JOHNSON.
HE SAID EVERYBODY IN BRITAIN LIKES ME AND THAT'S GREAT BECAUSE BORIS IS LIKE ME.
I WANT TO KNOW WHETHER YOU THINK IT IS IN THE PRESIDENT'S PURVIEW TO CARVE OUT THIS PREFERENTIAL DEAL THEY THINK THEY CAN GET.
I THINK IT IS.
I THINK IT WOULD BE VERY, VERY GOOD FOR THE ECONOMIES OF BOTH COUNTRIES TO HAVE A FREE TRADE AGREEMENT.
AND IT IS SOMETHING, AS YOU POINT OUT, THAT THE PRESIDENT HAS ELUDED TO.
I'M NOT AWARE OF A LOT OF PROGRESS BEING MADE ON THAT FRONT.
BUT I HAVE ENCOURAGED THE ADMINISTRATION TO PURSUE EXACTLY THAT.
THERE IS A MAJOR ISSUE HERE THAT'S VERY CLOSE TO THE U.S.
AND THAT IS MAINTAINING FREEDOM AND THE INTEGRITY OF THE PEACE AGREEMENT BETWEEN IRELAND AND BRITAIN AND THE FREEDOM OF THAT BORDER.
I SPOKE TO NANCY PELOSI, LEADER OF THE HOUSE JUST A FEW MONTHS AGO ABOUT THIS, AND SHE LAID OUT HOW A TRADE DEAL WITH THE UNITED STATES WOULD BE INTRICATELY LINKED WITH THIS FREEDOM AND THE INTEGRITY OF THE GOOD FRIDAY AGREEMENT.
TAKE A LISTEN, SIR.
THE U.S. WAS VERY MUCH A PART OF THIS HISTORIC PEACE AGREEMENT.
BUT IT'S NOT JUST THAT AGREEMENT.
IT WAS SOMETHING BIGGER.
IT'S A VALUE THAT JUST TOOK US TO THIS PLACE OF SUCCESS ON THE PART OF THE UK HAVING A ROLE IN IT, IRELAND, NORTHERN IRELAND AND THE UNITED STATES.
AND WE ARE GUARANTORS OF THAT.
NOT JUST THE AGREEMENT, GOOD FRIDAY OF COURSE, BUT THE IDEA OF IT AND WHAT IT IS AS A MODEL TO THE REST OF THE WORLD.
AND AS A MODEL TO THE REST OF THE WORLD, IT CAN'T BE SOMETHING THAT IS UNRAVELLED.
IT IS VERY HARD TO PASS A TRADE AGREEMENT IN CONGRESS.
VERY, VERY HARD.
AND AT ONE -- AT A U.S., UK TRADE AGREEMENT THAT WOULD BE A REWARD FOR WEAKENING THE GOOD FRIDAY ACCORDS IS JUST NOT APPROPRIATE.
BUT MAYBE THEY CAN ACCOMPLISH IT WITHOUT DOING THAT.
WE JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE THEY UNDERSTOOD THAT AS A CONSOLATION FOR LEAVING THE EU THEY'RE NOT GETTING THE U.S.
SENATOR, DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT, THAT THERE CAN BE NO REWARDING OF BREXIT BRITAIN IF NORTHERN IRELAND AND IRELAND AND THE PEACE AGREEMENT IS PUT AT RISK?
WELL, I DON'T THINK OF IT IN TERMS OF REWARDING ENGLAND OR THE UK FOR BREXIT.
BUT I DO AGREE THAT AMERICAN LAWMAKERS WILL BE VERY CAREFUL TO ADD TO THE STATUS OF THAT BORDER.
OBVIOUSLY WE ALL REMEMBER ALL TOO PAINFULLY HOW TRAGIC AND HOW DIFFICULT THAT HISTORY WAS AND HOW REMARKABLY SUCCESSFUL THE GOOD FRIDAY AGREEMENT HAS BEEN.
SO THIS, OF COURSE, IS VERY MUCH ON THE MINDS OF THE IRISH AND THE BRITS AND IT'S ONE OF THE CHALLENGES IN NEGOTIATING A DEAL WITH BREXIT.
IT WOULD CERTAINLY BE ONE OF THE CHALLENGES THAT WE WOULD HAVE.
BUT I WOULDN'T PRECLUDE THE POSSIBILITY THAT WE COULD WORK OUT AN ACCEPTABLE SOLUTION.
ALL RIGHT.
LET'S TURN BACK NOW TO WHAT'S TAKING UP ALL THE OXYGEN OR A LOT OF IT IN WASHINGTON.
AND THAT IS TOMORROW'S PLANNED PUBLIC TESTIMONY OF THE FORMER SPECIAL COUNSEL ROBERT MUELLER.
JUST TELL ME WHERE YOU STAND ON THIS.
ARE YOU GLAD HE'S COMING TO TESTIFY?
DO YOU THINK THERE ARE ANY QUESTIONS THAT STILL NEED TO BE ANSWERED?
WHERE DO YOU STAND ON THIS.
FIRST OF ALL, THERE IS A LOT MORE INTEREST IN THIS AMONG THE MEDIA THAN THERE IS AMONG MY CONSTITUENTS AND PROBABLY AMONG MANY SENATORS.
YOU KNOW, I DON'T THINK WE'RE GOING TO LEARN VERY MUCH.
BOB MUELLER HAS SAID THAT HIS REPORT SPEAKS FOR ITSELF.
HE HAD TO BE SUBPOENAED IN ORDER TO COME.
I THINK HE'S PROBABLY GOING TO STICK PRETTY CLOSELY TO HIS REPORT AND OUR DEMOCRATIC COLLEAGUES ARE GOING TO TRY TO MAKE A TO-DO OVER AN OBSTRUCTION OF AN INVESTIGATION THAT WAS NOT OBSTRUCTED INTO A CRIME FOR WHICH THERE IS NO EVIDENCE THERE WAS A CRIME COMMITTED.
SO I'M NOT TERRIBLY CURIOUS ABOUT IT, BUT WE'LL SEE WHAT HAPPENS.
SO I JUST WANT TO ASK YOU HOW YOU RECONCILE THIS FROM THE MUELLER REPORT.
WE HAVE HEARD IT OVER AND AGAIN, BUT IT STILL BEARS REPORTING.
MUELLER'S REPORT SAID IF WE HAD CONFIDENCE AFTER A THOROUGH INVESTIGATION OF THE FACTS THAT THE PRESIDENT CLEARLY DID NOT COMMIT OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE, WE WOULD SO STATE.
WELL, THEY DIDN'T STATE.
DOES THAT NOT GIVE YOU SOME CAUSE FOR WHATEVER, DISCOMFORT?
NO, NOT REALLY BECAUSE THEY WENT THROUGH THE LITANY OF THE BEHAVIORS THAT SOME PEOPLE FIND OBJECTIONABLE.
I DON'T THINK THEY RISE TO OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE.
BOB MUELLER FINISHED HIS REPORT.
HE FINISHED HIS INVESTIGATION UNIMPEDED.
HE HAS HUNDREDS OF WITNESSES, ALL THE TIME IN THE WORLD, A HUGE BUDGET.
AND NOBODY STOPPED HIM.
HE FINISHED.
SO HIS REPORT IS WHAT IT IS.
IT STRIKES ME PRETTY CLEAR THERE WAS NO OBSTRUCTION OF HIS INVESTIGATION.
AND AS I SAY, IT'S PRETTY CLEAR THERE WAS NO UNDERLYING CRIME COMMITTED AS WELL.
SO THAT'S WHY I THINK THERE IS -- THIS IS MOSTLY POLITICALLY MOTIVATED.
SO REGARDING THE IDEA BECAUSE I THINK YOU DO ALL AGREE THAT RUSSIA HAS PLAYED A VERY NEFARIOUS ROLE IN YOUR DEMOCRATIC PROCESS AND YOU SAY RUSSIA'S GOAL IS TO UNDERMINE THE TRUST OF THE AMERICAN PEOPLE IN OUR DEMOCRATIC PROCESS, ARE YOU CONFIDENT THIS ADMINISTRATION IS DOING ALL IT CAN TO STOP THIS INTERFERENCE AND BEHAVIOR?
I THINK THERE HAS BEEN A LOT OF GOOD PROGRESS MADE ON THAT FRONT.
YES, I TOTALLY BELIEVE THAT THE RUSSIANS WOULD LOVE TO DISRUPT AMERICA'S POLITICAL PROCESS, OUR ELECTIONS.
THEY WANT TO DISCREDIT OUR MODEL.
THAT'S THE REAL ULTIMATE MOTIVATION FOR PUTIN IN MY VIEW, DISCREDIT IT AND WEAKEN OUR INSTITUTIONS.
IF YOU LOOK AT THE 2018 ELECTIONS, I THINK IT'S PRETTY CLEAR THEY DIDN'T HAVE MUCH SUCCESS, IF ANY.
AND I THINK WE HAVE CREATED A MORE ROBUST PROCESS.
SO I DO FEEL GOOD ABOUT WHERE WE ARE.
I'M SURE THEY WILL CONTINUE TO TRY TO BE DISRUPTIVE.
BUT WE'RE AWARE OF THAT NOW AND BETTER ABLE TO DEFEND AGAINST IT.
SO CAN I ASK YOU AS ONE OF THE RARE SITTING SENATORS IN THE REPUBLICAN PARTY WHO DO DISTANCE THEMSELVES FROM THE PRESIDENT ON ISSUES WHERE IT MATTERS TO YOU, YOU HAVE TALKED OUT AGAINST THE RACIST TWEETS, AGAINST THE WOMEN OF COLOR IN CONGRESS.
YOU HAVE ALSO TALKED OUT AGAINST USING EMERGENCY FUNDS FOR THE BORDER WALL AND YOU KNOW THIS IS GOING TO BE ADDRESSED BY THE SUPREME COURT NEXT WEEK.
WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THE CASE TO STOP THOSE FUNDS BEING USED FOR, YOU KNOW, THE BORDER WALL?
DO YOU SUPPORT THAT?
SO I THINK THE PRESIDENT HAS THE FUNDS AT HIS DISPOSAL, THE FUNDS THAT HE NEEDS TO A PERFECTLY LEGAL FASHION TO ADD TO THE BORDER WALL THAT HE WANTS TO BUILD.
BY THE WAY, THE BORDER PATROL SAYS WE NEED AS YOU MAY KNOW.
WE HAVE SEVERAL HUNDRED MILES OF EXISTING PHYSICAL BARRIERS INCLUDING WALLS AND OUR BORDER PATROL FOLKS SAY THAT WE NEED SEVERAL HUNDRED MILES MORE, NOT THE ENTIRE 1,900 MILES BY ANY MEANS BUT ADDITIONAL PHYSICAL BARRIERS THAT I THINK EVERY ONE OF THE LAST AT LEAST HALF DOZEN OR SO PRESIDENTS HAVE ADDED TO.
I THINK THE PRESIDENT IS RIGHT TO WISH TO ENHANCE THAT PHYSICAL SECURITY.
MY POSITION ON THIS HAS ALWAYS BEEN THAT HE SHOULD SIMPLY USE THE FUNDS THAT CONGRESS HAS AUTHORIZED FOR THAT PURPOSE, AND IT IS ENOUGH TO ACCOMPLISH WHAT HE HAD SAID HE WANTED TO ACCOMPLISH.
THAT'S THE WAY THE PRESIDENT OUGHT TO DO IT.
SENATOR, SOME 90% OF THE REPUBLICAN PARTY OBVIOUSLY SUPPORTS PRESIDENT TRUMP.
IN OTHER WORDS, BASICALLY THE PARTY HAS BECOME THE PARTY OF TRUMP.
YOU HAVE GOT DISSENTING SENATORS THAT RESIGNED OR LEFT POLITICS OR DOING OTHER SUCH THINGS.
DO YOU EVER FEEL ANY PRESSURE TO TAMP DOWN YOUR CRITICISM ON ISSUES?
I DON'T.
THE WAY I LOOK AT IT IS I WAS ELECTED SEPARATELY FROM PRESIDENT TRUMP.
HE'S THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES.
I'M A SENATOR FROM PENNSYLVANIA.
AND IF I THINK THAT THE PRESIDENT IS ADVOCATING A POLICY THAT'S NOT GOOD FOR PENNSYLVANIA OR FOR OUR COUNTRY, I THINK I HAVE A RESPONSIBILITY TO STAND UP AND ARTICULATE IN AN OPPOSING POINT OF VIEW.
I HAVE DONE THAT ON TRADE VERY CONSISTENTLY.
AND I WILL CONTINUE TO DO THAT.
I THINK, YOU KNOW, THE PRESIDENT HAS PUT TOGETHER A COALITION.
HE HAS THE VERY PROD SUPPORT AMONG REPUBLICANS.
YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT ABOUT THAT.
BUT THERE IS A LOT OF REPUBLICANS THAT ARE STILL ASKING QUESTIONS ABOUT SOME OF THE INDIVIDUAL POLICIES.
I THINK PEOPLE LOOK AT THE OVERALL ECONOMIC THRUST AND WE HAVE THE BEST ECONOMY OF MY ADULT LIFETIME, LITERALLY THE BEST ECONOMY IN 50 YEARS, AND I THINK THAT'S CLEARLY ATTRIBUTABLE TO THE PRESIDENT WORKING WITH REPUBLICANS IN CONGRESS ON ROLLING BACK EXCESSIVE REGULATION, REFORMING OUR TAX CODE.
IT'S BEEN TERRIFIC.
AND I THINK A LOT OF REPUBLICANS ACROSS PENNSYLVANIA ANY WAY SAY, HEY, THE RESULTS HAVE BEEN REALLY GOOD.
SENATOR, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US TONIGHT.
THANKS A LOT.
> WE NOW TURN TO SILICON VALLEY, TURMOIL FOR BIG TECH.
ALLEGATIONS OF SEXUAL HARASSMENT, GENDER INEQUALITY AND RACISM SPARKED A WALKOUT.
TWO OF ITS LEADERS BOTH WORKED AT THE COMPANY FOR OVER A DECADE.
THEY SAY THEY WERE SIDELINED FOR SPEAKING OUT, TELLING US THAT GOOGLE NEEDS TO BE HELD TO ACCOUNT.
HERE'S THEIR CONVERSATION.
WHAT DREW YOU TO GOOGLE?
AND THEN WHEN DID YOU REALIZE YOUR EXPECTATION OF WHAT IT WOULD BE WAS DIFFERENT THAN SOME OF THE REALITIES?
YEAH.
SO I USED TO WORK ON A WEEKLY EVENT THAT HAPPENS AT GOOGLE HOSTED BY THE FOUNDERS WHERE IT USED TO BE.
AND THAT IS IT IS A CULTURAL HALLMARK OF GOOGLE.
WE TALK ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED DURING THE WEEK, ANSWER QUESTIONS FROM EMPLOYEES.
IT IS THIS INCREDIBLY OPTIMISTIC -- IT'S A PROFOUND CULTURAL EXPERIENCE FOR PEOPLE THAT COME TO GOOGLE.
I USED TO BE AT THE SIDE OF THE STAGE EVERY WEEK WATCHING THIS AND THINK I AM AT THE BEST COMPANY IN THE WORLD.
THIS IS THE MOST PROGRESSIVE WORKPLACE, THE MOST FORWARD THINKING, WE ARE CHANGING THE WORLD.
AND THAT CARRIED THROUGH A LOT OF THE DIFFERENT ROLES I HAVE.
WHAT CHANGED IT FOR ME WAS IN THE FALL OF LAST YEAR THERE WAS A HUGE BOMBSHELL STORY ABOUT AN EXECUTIVE PAYOUT THAT HAD BEEN MADE TO A KNOWN SEXUAL HARASSER AT GOOGLE.
IT WAS ON THE ORDER OF $90 MILLION AS REPORTED.
THAT WAS INCREDIBLY DISAPPOINTING.
BUT WHAT IT SPARKED WAS WOMEN TELLING THEIR STORIES AT THE COMPANY.
TO EACH OTHER.
YES.
I WAS ON AN ANONYMOUS MOMS LIST WHERE MOMS DISCUSSED EVERYTHING THAT'S GOING ON AT HOME AND AT WORK.
AND PEOPLE STARTED SHARING THEIR STORIES OF DIFFERENT DISCRIMINATION EXPERIENCES THEY HAVE HAD, SEXUAL HARASSMENT, TALKING ABOUT THEIR VERY PROFOUND, VERY PERSONAL REACTION TO THE STORY WE WERE READING IN THE NEWS BECAUSE IT WASN'T REALLY ABOUT ANDY RUE BIN AND THIS HUGE PAYOUT.
IT WAS ABOUT THE INJUSTICE AND UNFAIRNESS THAT A LOT OF WOMEN WERE EXPERIENCING EVERY DAY.
IT INSPIRED ME TO SAY, LET'S REGISTER OUR DISSATISFACTION AT MANAGEMENT.
THEY HADN'T ADDRESSED IT THAT SHOWED US HOW CHANGE WAS GOING TO HAPPEN IN THE ORGANIZATION.
AND TOGETHER WE SET OUT TO WALK OUT.
AND THAT NEXT WEEK WE DID.
AND IT WAS -- I THINK IT WAS 40 -- WAS IT 20,000 PEOPLE?
20,000 PEOPLE IN 40 OFFICES.
WHAT WERE THE STORIES?
WHAT WERE THE CHANGE OF STORIES YOU WERE HEARING FROM OTHER WOMEN ABOUT THE CONDITIONS THEY WERE FACING AT WORK?
YES.
I THINK IT WAS EVERYTHING FROM I REPORTED SEXUAL HARASSMENT ON MY TEAM AND MY MANAGER PROJECTED THE GUY AND I ENDED UP HAVING TO TRANSFER.
THAT WAS INCREDIBLY COMMON.
IT WAS ALMOST AN ARCHITECT THAT CAME OUT.
IT DOESN'T FEEL SAFE.
I HEARD A LOT ABOUT OPPORTUNITY OF DISCRIMINATION, THAT IT IS A BOYS CLUB, THAT THE BEST PROJECTS ARE GIVEN TO THE MANAGERS FRIENDS, THE VP'S FRIENDS, THE BEST OPPORTUNITIES ARE CHERRY PICKED FOR THE FAVORITES.
I HEARD GENERALLY THAT PEOPLE DON'T HAVE A LOT OF FAITH IN FAIRNESS AND OPPORTUNITY.
I THINK PEOPLE IN GENERAL HAVE AN EXPECTATION OF FAIRNESS IN THEIR WORKPLACE, PARTICULARLY GOOGLE WHERE I HAVE HAD A ROSIE AND POPULAR VIEW OF.
IT GETS TO ABUSE OF POWER, RIGHT, WHO HAS POWER AND WHO DOESN'T.
AND ULTIMATELY IF SOMEONE IN A POSITION THAT DIDN'T HAVE POWER WAS HARASSED OR RACIALLY DISCRIMINATED AGAINST OR DISCRIMINATED AGAINST BECAUSE OF THEIR GENDER IDENTITY, ET CETERA, IT WAS WAY, WAY TOO OFTEN THEY WERE OS TRY SIZED OR SEEN AS THE PROBLEM AND THE PEOPLE WHO DID HAVE STRUCTURAL POWER WERE, YOU KNOW, ULTIMATELY, I THINK, AND ALMOST MAYBE NOT EXPLICITLY ENCOURAGED TO DO IT BUT IF YOU ARE NOT PUNISHED FOR IT, IF YOU ARE SORT OF, YOU KNOW, IF YOU NEVER SEE ANY CONSEQUENCES, THAT IS AN IMPLICIT ENDORSEMENT FOR THAT TYPE OF BEHAVIOR.
THIS IS SOMETHING WE NEED TO GET TO THE HEART OF, RIGHT?
WHO WINS FROM THIS TYPE OF BEHAVIOR.
YOU RELEASE A JOINT LETTER INTERNALLY TO THE COMPANY SPEAKING OUT ABOUT THE CULTURE OF REALLATION.
YOU WROTE, MY MANAGER STARTED IGNORING ME.
MY WORK WAS GIVEN TO OTHER PEOPLE AND I WAS TOLD TO GO ON MEDICAL LEAVE, EVEN THOUGH I'M NOT SICK.
YEAH.
WHAT HAPPENED?
SO IN JANUARY, TWO MONTHS AFTER THE WALKOUT, I HAD A CONVERSATION WITH MY MANAGER WHERE SHE LAID OUT WHAT WAS CLEARLY A DEMOTION.
I WOULD BE LAYERED.
MY TEAM WOULD BE SPLIT IN TWO.
AND, YEAH, MY --
DID YOU RECOGNIZE IT AS RETALIATION AT THE TIME?
I DIDN'T.
IT CROSSED MY MIND BECAUSE SHE MENTIONED THE WALKOUT AND SHE SUGGESTED A NEW PROJECT FOR ME, WORKING ON YOUTUBE KIDS.
I ASKED HER WHY.
SHE SAID, OH, I THOUGHT YOU WOULD BE INTERESTED IN THAT BECAUSE OF THE WALKOUT.
I SAID WHAT'S THE CONNECTION THERE?
SHE SAID, YOU KNOW, WOMEN'S ISSUES.
SO IT WAS CLEARLY TOP OF MIND EVEN THOUGH IT WAS A CLUMSY COMMUNICATION.
BUT WHAT HAPPENED IN THE FOLLOWING FEW MONTHS WAS I WAS JUST TRYING TO HAVE MY QUESTIONS ANSWERED.
I WAS SO CONFUSED AFTER YEARS ON THIS TEAM HIGHLY ESTABLISHED, STRONG PERFORMER ALWAYS, YOU KNOW, INCREASING MY SCOPE, EXPANDING MY ROLE ON THE TEAM.
ALL OF A SUDDEN IT WAS A HUGE STEPBACK.
AS I ASKED THESE QUESTIONS, THE MORE ISOLATING AND STRANGE THE SITUATION GOT.
AND, IN FACT, THE MORE THAT I WAS ABLE TO CONNECT MY STORY TO THE STORIES OF SO MANY OTHER WOMEN WHO DESCRIBED RETALIATION WHEN THEY HAD SPOKEN UP ABOUT SOMETHING THAT WAS HAPPENING IN THEIR WORKPLACE.
THE LETTER CONCLUDES, IF WE WANT TO STOP DISCRIMINATION AND HARASSMENT, WE NEED TO END RETALIATION.
WHAT WAS IT YOU WERE TRYING TO ACHIEVE?
WELL, I THINK WE NEEDED TO CALL OUT ONE OF THE PRIMARY BARRIERS TO ENDING RACISM MISOGYNY, SEXUAL HARASSMENT AND ABUSE WITHIN THE WORKPLACE.
THERE IS NICOLE PORTER WHO IS A LEGAL SCHOLAR WHO WROTE AN ESSAY IN THE STANFORD LAW REVIEW THAT MAKES AN EXTREMELY COMPELLING ARGUMENT THAT PRACTICES OF RETALIATION ARE THE FIRST THING WE NEED TO TACKLE WHEN WE BEGIN TO TACKLE THESE SORT OF ME TOO ISSUES, THE SORT OF MASSIVE, YOU KNOW, THE ONGOING ISSUE OF PERSISTENT SEXUAL HARASSMENT AND DISCRIMINATION WITHIN WORKPLACES IN TECH AND WELL BEYOND.
AND THAT THE FEAR OF SPEAKING UP, THE, YOU KNOW, LEGITIMATE FEAR OF SPEAKING UP, THE PERSONAL COST, THE, YOU KNOW, COST TO YOUR CAREER AND YOUR LIVELIHOOD THAT RETALIATION, YOU KNOW, THAT RETALIATION CREATES IS A HUGE ONE.
IT IS NO ACCIDENT THAT A LOT OF THE BIG ME TOO STORIES ARE STORIES TOLD ABOUT INCIDENTS THAT HAPPENED YEARS BEFORE.
THESE AREN'T PEOPLE COMING OUT AND PUTTING THEMSELVES AT RISK WITHIN THEIR WORKPLACES.
WHAT WE SAW WHEN CLAIRE AND I CAME FORWARD WITH OUR STORY, IT WAS LIKE A DAM BROKE.
WHAT WERE YOU HEARING?
WHAT WERE THOSE STORIES?
WELL, YOU KNOW, ALL SORTS OF THINGS, BUT THEY SHARE -- YOU KNOW, THEY SHARE SOME KEY FEATURES.
YOU BEGIN TO BE ISOLATED.
YOU BEGIN TO BE ICED OUT OF CONVERSATIONS.
YOU BEGIN TO BE -- SUDDENLY PEOPLE WHO WERE WARM AND FRIENDLY TURN COLD AND SO THE ENVIRONMENT YOU ARE IN CHANGES SUDDENLY.
YOU'RE TAKEN OFF PROJECTS.
YOU ARE TOLD THAT YOU'RE NOT DOING WELL.
YOU ARE -- YOU KNOW, ARE YOU TOO SENSITIVE, TOO NEGATIVE?
NOT PERFORMING WELL, ALL OF THESE THINGS, A FORM OF PERSISTENT STRUCTURAL GASLIGHTING WHERE YOU ARE TOLD THAT, YOU KNOW, THE DAY BEFORE YOU WERE DOING WELL.
SUDDENLY YOU BRING A PROBLEM TO THE ATTENTION OF MANAGEMENT AND YOU ARE THE PROBLEM.
RIGHT.
HOW DOES THAT THEN FUNCTION FOR SOMEONE WHO IS A CONTRACT WORKER?
WELL, I MEAN, THAT IS -- THAT FUNCTIONS -- IT IS SORT OF A DOUBLE LAYER OF VULNERABILITY, RIGHT?
BECAUSE GOOGLE NOW HAS OVER 50% OF THE WORKERS AT GOOGLE ARE CONTRACT WORKERS.
THESE ARE PEOPLE WHO DON'T HAVE THE PRIVILEGES OF FULL EMPLOYMENT.
THEY DON'T HAVE HEALTH INSURANCE.
THEY ARE OFTEN PAID IN ASSISTANCE WAGES.
THEY DON'T GET TO REPORT DIRECTLY TO GOOGLE'S HR SYSTEM.
AND THE POWER ASIMILAR IS HUGE.
IT HAPPENS PERSISTENTLY TO CONTRACT WORKERS BECAUSE IF YOU LOOK AT THE RACIAL MAKE JUNE AND GENDER MAKEUP OF GOOGLE'S WORKFORCE, YOU WILL SEE THERE ARE VERY -- GOOGLE'S WORKFORCE IS 4% BLACK PEOPLE.
AND CONTRACT WORKERS, DON'T HAVE THE NUMBERS OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD, I DON'T KNOW THEY'RE REPORTED, BUT IT IS FAR -- YOU WILL SEE MANY MORE WOMEN OF COLOR, MANY MORE BLACK PEOPLE IN THE CONTRACT WORKFORCE.
AND YOU SEE VERY TECHNICALLY LIKE USING THIS TERM CORRECTLY, YOU SEE A PATTERN OF STRUCTURAL RACISM WHERE THOSE AT THE BOTTOM ARE THE PEOPLE THAT ARE MOST VULNERABLE AND MORE LIKELY TO BE PEOPLE OF COLOR AND WOMEN AND THE PEOPLE WITH THE MOST PRIVILEGES ARE MUCH MORE LIKELY TO BE MEN, WHITE MEN OFTEN.
TELL ME ABOUT YOUR ULTIMATE DEPARTURE FROM THE COMPANY.
I THINK THAT WHEN WE WENT OUT WITH OUR STORIES WE KNEW THAT WE RISKED OUR JOBS BECAUSE THIS IS HOW RETALIATION WORKS.
I THINK THAT WE KNEW THAT WE WERE SPEAKING OUT FOR PEOPLE THAT FELT LIKE THEY COULDN'T RISK THEIR JOBS.
ULTIMATELY, I FOUND OUT THAT I WAS PREGNANT IN THE SPRING.
AND I HAD BEEN GOING THROUGH SUCH STRESS AND ISOLATION.
I THINK THAT THE MEDICAL LEAVE ANTIDOTE IN MY STORY REALLY SUMS UP HOW CRAZY MAKING SHARING YOUR RETALIATION CAN BE BECAUSE ULTIMATELY I WAS RAISING A SERIOUS RETALIATION CLAIM TO THE HIGHEST RUNGS OF THE COMPANY AND THE ONLY SOLUTION THEY CAME BACK TO ME WITH WAS NOT LET'S FIGURE OUT A WAY TO MAKE SENSE OF THIS BETWEEN YOU AND YOUR MANAGER, FIND YOU A NEW TEAM, TRANSFER YOU SOMEWHERE WHERE YOU CAN THRIVE, THIS WAS YOU MUST DECLARE YOURSELF SICK AND UNABLE TO WORK.
AND I REALLY SAT WITH THAT.
I REALLY CONSIDERED THAT.
AM I CRAZY?
AM I THE SICK ONE?
IS THE FACT THAT I'M SPEAKING OUT, AM I AS PROBLEMATIC AND AS CRAZY AS THEY SAY?
RIGHT?
SO I HAVE BEEN TREMENDOUSLY BOLSTERED BY THE MEN AND WOMEN FORMED AROUND THE WALKOUT.
BUT ULTIMATELY FOR MY HEALTH AND SANITY AND FOR HI FAMILY, IT MADE SENSE FOR ME TO LEAVE.
THE THINGS YOU ARE SAYING ABOUT GOOGLE ARE VERY SERIOUS.
BACK IN APRIL THE SAID WE PROHIBIT RETALIATION IN THE WORKPLACE AND PUBLICALLY SHARE OUR VERY CLEAR POLICY TO MAKE SURE IN COMPLAINT RAISED GOES UNHEARD.
WE GIVE EMPLOYEES MULTIPLE CHANNELS TO REPORT CONCERNS AND INVESTIGATE ALL ALLEGATIONS OF RETALIATION.
THE COMPANY ALSO SAID THEY DID AN INVESTIGATION AND SAW NO EVIDENCE OF RETALIATION.
SO HOW DO YOU RESPOND?
YEAH.
I MEAN, THEY SAID THAT.
I WOULD LOVE TO UNDERSTAND WHAT HAPPENED TO MY ROLE AS AFTER NOT JUST, YOU KNOW, FOUR OR FIVE YEARS ON THIS TEAM AS A HIGH PERFORMER AND RISING STAR BUT 12 YEARS OF A SOLID TRACK RECORD AT THE COMPANY.
THE FIRST TIME IT EVER HAPPENED TO ME WHERE MY ROLE HAD BEEN SET BACK, DIMINISHED, WHERE I FELT LIKE I COULD NO LONGER TALK TO MY LEADERSHIP WITHOUT -- WITHOUT FEAR OF FURTHER RETALIATION HAPPENED TWO MONTHS AFTER THE WALKOUT.
AND THAT TO ME SEEMS AS CLEAR AS DAY.
I DON'T KNOW, YOU KNOW, SO MANY OF THE STORIES THAT CAME OUT FROM THE WALKOUT AND BEYOND TO THE MANY PEOPLE THAT MEREDITH AND I HAVE CONNECTED WITH OVER THE PAST FEW MONTHS AND STARTING TO SHARE OUR STORIES HAVE SHOWN THAT GOOG LERS DON'T HAVE A LOT OF FAITH IN THESE SYSTEMS OR THE INVESTIGATIONS THAT GET DONE IN THE HR PEOPLE THAT THEY SEEK FOR HELP IN THE EXECUTIVES THAT THEY ASK TO HELP STEP IN AND FIGURE OUT SITUATIONS THAT DON'T FEEL RIGHT.
THIS ISN'T JUST ABOUT ME AND MEREDITH.
WE KNEW WE WEREN'T THE ONLY TWO STORIES OUT THERE.
IN FACT, WHEN WE WENT OUT, WE WERE EMBOLDENED BY KNOWING WE WERE SPEAKING ON BEHALF OF MANY OTHERS.
THESE CLAIMS ARE EXTREMELY DIFFICULT TO PROVE.
THERE IS SOME VERY, VERY, VERY BAD CASE LAW AND SORT OF LABOR PROTECTIONS THAT HAVE BEEN WHITTLED AWAY OVER THE YEARS TO MAKE IT, YOU KNOW -- IT'S DIFFICULT TO PROVE THAT SUDDENLY I WAS GAS LIT.
SUDDENLY MY WORKPLACE WAS SO HOSTILE I GOT SICK COMING IN EVERY DAY.
WE WERE HEARING REPORTS LIKE THIS, RIGHT?
AND ONE OF THE -- I THINK ONE OF THE TRICKIEST AND MOST DIFFICULT THINGS ABOUT RETALIATION IS THAT THE COMPANY NEVER ADMITS THAT ITS RETALIATING.
SO THAT STATEMENT WAS WRITTEN BY A VERY COMPETENT LAWYER.
THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT YOU WOULD SAY IF YOU WANT TO SHORE YOURSELF UP AGAINST ANY LEGAL LIABILITY.
BUT IT'S SIMPLY NOT TRUE, RIGHT?
IT IS NOT TRUE IN OUR EXPERIENCE.
IT'S NOT TRUE IN HUNDREDS OF PEOPLE'S EXPERIENCE.
THIS GETS INTO THIS SYSTEMIC ISSUES WITH HR.
HR IS THERE NOT TO PROTECT WORKERS, RIGHT?
THEY AREN'T YOUR UNION.
I THINK WE DO NEED SOME KIND OF COLLECTIVE WORKER SOLIDARITY THAT CAN PROTECT US.
HR IS THERE TO PROTECT THE COMPANY FROM BEING LIABLE FOR THESE HARMS.
THE REASON YOU HAVE TO WATCH ALL THOSE DEADENING TRAINING VIDEOS ABOUT, YOU KNOW, SEXUAL HARASSMENT COMPLIANCE THAT HAVE OVER 30 YEARS SHOWN THEY DO NOTHING TO EFFECT THIS PROBLEM, THE REASON, YOU KNOW, THEY HAVE THESE SORT OF REPORTING STRUCTURES AND THE REASON THEY'RE SET UP THE WAY THEY ARE IS TO PROTECT THE COMPANY FROM LEGAL LIABILITY.
THAT'S WHAT HR DOES.
AND THEY ACTUALLY DON'T WANT TO HELP YOU BRING A CASE.
IT'S NOW BEEN MONTHS SINCE THE WALKOUT.
WERE THERE ANY SUCCESSES THAT YOU CAN POINT TO?
I MEAN, GOOGLE ENDED FORCED ARBITRATION NOT JUST FOR SEXUAL HARASSMENT BUT ACROSS THE BOARD.
NOW THEY DID THAT FOR FULL-TIME EMPLOYEES.
IT IS UNCLEAR HOW THAT'S GOING TO AFFECT THE MAJORITY OF WORKERS WHO ARE CONTRACTORS.
GOOGLE HAS ALSO PUT IN PLACE, YOU KNOW, A PROMISE TO INCREASE BENEFITS AND GIVE THINGS LIKE HEALTH INSURANCE, HAVE A MINIMUM WAGE FOR CONTRACT WORKERS, WHICH IS ALSO CONTRACT WORKERS HAVE BEEN ORGANIZING SINCE THEN AROUND, YOU KNOW, DEMANDS FOR DIGNIFIED WORK AND REASONABLE BENEFITS.
THOSE ARE THE TWO BIG KIND OF BULL WORKS.
I THINK ONE OF THE OTHER SUCCESSES THAT ISN'T SPECIFICALLY GOOGLE MEETING THE DEMANDS IS JUST HOW MUCH THE ORGANIZING HAS GROWN.
NOW WE HAVE A REALLY FABRIC OF ORGANIZERS WITHIN THE COMPANY WHO ARE TAKING THIS VERY SERIOUSLY AND SORT OF BEGINNING TO TAKE OWNERSHIP FOR THE ENVIRONMENT THAT WE WORK IN AND BEGINNING TO MAKE, YOU KNOW, CLEAR DEMANDS TO LEADERSHIP ABOUT WHAT WE AS WORKERS NEED.
I THINK WHAT'S MOST SHOCKING IS THIS IS THE COMPANY THAT SETS OUT TO SOLVE THE WORLD'S BIGGEST PROBLEMS.
WE ACKNOWLEDGE WHAT WE ARE RAISING WITH THE WALK OUT IS BROAD ISSUES.
THE WOMAN THAT THEY APPOINTED TO REALLY RESPOND TO WHAT EMPLOYEES ARE RAISING LEFT THE COMPANY A FEW MONTHS LATER.
SO CLEARLY THIS IS -- THIS IS NOT QUITE BEING GIVEN THE RESOURCES AND URGENCY, THE HONESTY, THE ACCOUNTABILITY THAT WE'RE ASKING FOR.
HOWEVER, LOTS OF WINS AND WE ARE SO PLEASED TO SEE HOW THE COMMUNITY AS GROWN.
THANK YOU BOTH SO MUCH.
THANK YOU.
> SO YOU HEARD MEREDITH WHITAKER TELL ALICIA SHE STAYED AT GOOGLE UNTIL SHE COULD NO LONGER DO HER JOB WITH SBREGRYTY.
SHE SAID IT IS CLEAR GOOGLE IS NOT A PLACE WHERE I CAN CONTINUE THIS WORK.
THAT'S IT FOR OUR PROGRAM TONIGHT. THANKS FOR WATCHING AND