New York Icon Oskar Eustis: How Theater Sustains Democracy

OSKAR EUSTIS WITH HITS LIKE HAMILTON AND SO MANY MORE.

HE'S MADE A ZOOM-INSPIRED DRAMA CALLING WHAT DO WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT?

IT'S AVAILABLE FOR FREE ONLINE.

HE TELLS MICHEL MARTIN WHY THIS MIGHT BE A RETURN TO THE ESSENCE OF THE CRAFT.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR TALKING WITH US.

IT'S A PLEASURE.

AS WE ARE SPEAKING NOW, YOU PLANNED A BIG BASH FOR THE PUBLIC ATHLETE ORDER JUNE 1st.

CAN YOU JUST TELL ME ABOUT IT?

AND OBVIOUSLY IT WILL BE VERY DIFFERENT FROM THE KINDS OF BENEFIT YOU'RE USED TO PUTTING ON.

THE BAD NEWS, IT IS A VIRTUAL BENEFIT WEST CAN'T ALL GATHER IN THE GREATEST PARK IN THE WORLD, CENTRAL PARK.

THE GOOD NEWS IS FOR THE FIRST TIME IN HISTORY, THE GALA WILL BE AVAILABLE FOR EVERYBODY.

IT IS FREE.

YOU CAN JUST GO TO THE WEBSITE AND LOGON AND WATCH SOME OF THE GREATEST STARS OF OUR TIME SING, REMINISCE ABOUT THE PUBLIC, HELP DRUM UP SUPPORT NOT ONLY SUPPORT FOR THE PUBLIC BUT THE FEELING OF SOLIDARITY.

SO I'M ACTUALLY THRILLED ABOUT THE REACH THIS WILL HAVE.

NOT TO BE CRUDE ABOUT IT, HOW WILL YOU MAKE ANY MONEY OFF IT?

WE'LL ASK PEOPLE TO CONTRIBUTE.

WE'VE BEEN ASKING PEOPLE BEFORE THE GALA AND I HAVE TO SAY, THE RESPONSE HAS BEEN EXTRAORDINARY.

PEOPLE KNOW THAT IT IS VALUE.

FOR PEOPLE WHO ARE NOT AWARE OF WHAT THE PUBLIC IS ALL ABOUT, TELL US ABOUT THE PUBLIC THEATER AND WHY DOES IT MATTER SO MUCH?

I THINK MANY PEOPLE MIGHT REMEMBER IT.

THAT IT HAS STAGED SORT OF A PLAY OF A GENERATION, HAMILTON.

THE FIRST STAGE AT THE PUBLIC.

WHAT ELSE?

THE PUBLIC IS AT ITS CORE, A DEMOCRAT IIC INSTITUTION.

THE IDEA IS THAT THE PUBLIC BELONGS TO EVERYBODY.

WE MAKE THEATER OF, BY, AND FOR THE PEOPLE.

AND WE MANIFEST THAT IN A WHOLE VARIETY OF WAYS.

AND THE VARIETY IS THE ESSENCE OF IT.

WE DO FREE SHAKESPEARE IN THE PARK.

OUR FLAGSHIP WHERE WE GIVE AWAY THE GREATEST WRITER AND THE GREATEST ACTORS AWAY FOR FREE EVERY NIGHT, ALL SUMMER.

WE DO MOBILE THEATER AROUND ALL FIVE BURROUGHS.

WE DO HAMILTON, CHORUS LINE, ALL CAME OUT OF THE THEATER AND ALL ARE ABOUT TURNING THE STAGE OVER TO PEOPLE WHO HAVEN'T HAD VOICE BEFORE IN OUR CULTURE.

TO AMERICA SURE PEOPLE WHO ARE THE OBJECTS OF HISTORY GET TO BE THE SUBJECTS OF HISTORY.

AND THAT IMPULSE INFUSES EVERYTHING WE DO.

PEOPLE HAVE THIS IDEA THAT THEATER IS NOT SOMETHING THAT BELONGS TO EVERYBODY.

THEATER, BROADWAY, PROFESSIONAL THEATER IS SOMETHING THAT IS REALLY EXPENSIVE.

THAT IT IS ONLY FOR THE FEW.

WHAT YOU ARE DESCRIBING IS ALL TOO OFTEN EXACTLY THE CASE IN OUR CULTURE.

IT WAS DELIBERATELY SWINGING AGAINST THE CURRENT.

JOE WAS A BROOKLYN BOY WHO GREW UP WITH ENGLISH AS A SECOND LANGUAGE.

HE'D BEEN IN THE NAVY AND BECOME A CRAZY SHAKESPEARE FANATIC WITHOUT EVER GOING TO COLLEGE.

EVEN THE POST-WAR OPTIMISM, THE IDEA THAT WE COULD ACTUALLY SHARE, BE EQUAL, THE GI BILL AND LET EVERYONE GO TO COLLEGE, JANE ADAMS, WE COULD PROTECT OUR CITIES, WE COULD MAKE THEATER AS MUCH OF A BIRTH RIGHT FOR THE PEOPLE IN NEW YORK AS THE PUBLIC LIBRARIES.

THE PUBLIC LIBRARY HAD TO FIGHT ITS BATTLES 200 YEARS AGO.

THE IDEA OF A FREE LENDING LIBRARY WAS RADICAL AT ONE TIME.

IT WAS PART OF AGAIN A DEMOCRATIC EXPANSION IN OUR CULTURE.

FOR THE 65-YEAR SINCE, WE'VE BEEN TRYING TO HOLD DOWN THAT CORNER.

MAKE THAT ARGUMENT.

AND NOT JUST BY GIVING THINGS AWAY FOR FREE BUT BY LETTING PEOPLE PLAYING IT THEMSELVES.

BY BLURRING THE DISTINCTION.

AT THE SAME TIME PROVING THAT DOING SOMETHING FOR FREE DOESN'T MEAN IT SBLT THE BEST.

DOESN'T MEAN THAT IT IS CHEAP.

IT MEANS IT CAN TAKE THE GREATEST ACTORS, MERLE STREEP, AL PACINO, JAMES EARL JONES, AND OFFER THEM UP FOR FREE AS WELL.

YOU'LL GAVE A TED TALK ABOUT THAT IN 2018 SAYING THEATER WAS ESSENTIAL TO DEMOCRACY.

YOU SAID THAT THEATER IS THE ESSENTIAL ART FORM OF DEMOCRACY.

WHY DO YOU SAY THAT?

WELL, PARTLY WE HAVE HISTORICAL EVIDENCE FOR IT.

THE IDEA OF DEMOCRACY, AND THE CREATION OF THE THEATER BEGAN IN THE SAME DECADE AT THE END OF THE SIXTH CENTURY BC IN THE SAME CITY, ATHENS.

THE IDEA THAT POWER SHOULD FLOW FROM THE PEOPLE TO THE TOP.

NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND.

AND IN THAT SAME DECADE, DRAMA STARTED.

DRAMA INVOLVES ALL THE THINGS THAT YOU NEED TO BE A SUCCESSFUL DEMOCRACY.

IT INVOLVES THE IDEA THAT THERE IS ALL THE CONFLICTS OF DRAWL.

ARGUING WITH EACH OTHER.

SO WHAT THE THEATER POSITS, THEATER IS NOT FROM JUST ONE PERSON'S VISION.

IT ASKS YOU TO IMAGINE WHAT OTHER PEOPLE ARE FEELING LIKE.

TO EMPATHIZE WITH CHARACTERS, TO PUT YOURSELF IN SOMEBODY ELSE'S SHOES.

THAT'S NECESSARY FOR DEMOCRACY TO WORK.

SO THE BUILDING BLOCKS, THE FORM OF THEATER ARE EXERCISES IN CITIZENSHIP.

WHO WOULD HAVE EVER THOUGHT THAT THEATERS THROUGHOUT NEW YORK, REALLY THROUGHOUT THE COUNTRY, WOULD BE SHUT DOWN?

TWO THINGS I WANT TO SAY.

ONE IS FROM AN HIS, TO DIFFERENCE.

THIS IS NOT THE FIRST TIME THEATERS HAVE BEEN SHUT DOWN BY EPIDEMICS.

SHAKESPEARE'S THEATER, THE GLOBE IN HONORED, WAS SHUT DOWN FOR AT LEAST THREE SEASONS BY THE PLAGUE IN LONDON.

WHAT DID SHAKESPEARE DO?

HE WENT AWAY AND WROTE THE SONNETS, WHICH I'M GLAD HE DID, AND HE DID A LOT OF WORK ON THE PLAYS.

WE'VE SURVIVED PLAGUES BEFORE.

I SPENT MOST OF THE FIRST FEW WEEKS KIND OF REELING.

I WAS IN THE HOSPITAL.

I HAD COVID WHEN THE THEATER SHUT DOWN.

WHEN I CAME OUT, I WAS STILL RECOVERING AND REELING FROM IT.

THE FIRST COUPLE WEEKS I WAS SAYING, WE WON'T BECOME A FILM STUDY.

WE'RE NOT A TELEVISION PRODUCTION.

WE WON'T BE DOING THEATER UNTIL WE CAN ALL COME BACK TOGETHER AGAIN.

THEN AFTER A COUPLE WEEKS, I REALIZED HOW PATHETICALLY DEFEATIST THAT WAS.

WHAT I REALIZED IS THAT IT IS OUR JOB, OUR OBLIGATION, OUR MORAL OBLIGATION, TO TRY TO FULFILL OUR MISSION UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES THAT HISTORY THROWS AT US.

SO WE'RE ACTUALLY ALREADY DID ONE PLAY WRITTEN DURING COVID, WHICH IS WHAT WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT.

IT IS STILL AVAILABLE THROUGH THE END OF JUNE ON THE PUBLIC'S WEBSITE.

AND WE ARE PLANNING TO ROLL OUT AN ENTIRE SEASON FEATURING DIGITAL PLAYS ON PUBLIC TELEVISION, PUBLIC RADIO, PUBLIC LIBRARIES, AND STRIVE TO DO WHAT WE'RE SUPPOSED TO DO, WHICH IS CREATE.

IF WE HAVE TO CREATE UNDER THESE CIRCUMSTANCES, THAT'S DIFFICULT BUT WE HAVE TO TRANSCEND OUR AUDIENCE.

DID I HEAR YOU SAY THAT YOU WERE IN THE HOSPITAL WITH COVID YOURSELF?

YES.

WHAT WAS THAT LIKE?

IT WAS VERY EARLY ON.

I WAS HOSPITALIZED IN MID-MARCH.

I DIDN'T KNOW I HAD IT.

I JUST KNOW THAT I FELT REALLY, REALLY BAD.

I WAS SURPRISED THEY PUT ME IN THE HOSPITAL.

IT WAS A GOOD THING THEY DID BECAUSE THERE WERE SOME HEART COMPLICATIONS.

IT WAS GOOD THEY WERE HELPING ME WITH.

I SUSPECTED IT MIGHT BE COVID.

BUT HERE'S GIVING YOU A SNAP SHOT OF NEW YORK IN MID-MARCH.

THEY DID NOT HAVE THE TEST FOR COVID AT THE HOSPITAL I WAS IN.

THEY COULDN'T TEST ME.

WHAT THEY DID WAS TEST ME FOR EVERYTHING ELSE.

AND IT WAS NEGATIVE.

SO WE ASSUMED AT THAT TIME IT WAS COVID AND SINCE THEN I'VE TESTED POSITIVE FOR THE ANTIBODIES OF COVID.

MOST IMPORTANTLY, COULD I TELL THE HOSPITAL I WAS IN, IT WAS ALREADY BEING OVERWHEN HE TOLD.

MID-MARCH, THEY WERE ALREADY NOT BEHAVING LIKE A HOSPITAL I'VE SEEN BEFORE.

AND IT JUST BROUGHT HOME TO ME THE TREMENDOUS ABSENCE OF PREPARATION ON THE PART OF OUR FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.

THE TREMENDOUS LACK OF FORETHOUGHT AND LACK OF SUPPORT THAT ONLY THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT CAN MOBILIZE.

DOES THEATER IN YOUR WAY HAVE SOME ROLE IN HELPING US ACKNOWLEDGE THIS MOMENT COLLECTIVELY?

I MEAN, WE ARE USED TO SEEING THE PRESIDENT LEAD US IN NATIONAL MOURNING IN IMPORTANT MOMENTS FOR US.

THE THEATER HAS SOMETHING TO SAY ABOUT THIS OR ART IN GENERAL HAS SOMETHING TO SAY IN THE ABSENCE OF LEADERSHIP.

WELL, EVERYTHING THAT WE'RE WORKING ON RIGHT NOW AND PRODUCING HAS GRIEF AS ITS BASELINE.

BECAUSE I THINK WHAT YOU'RE PLAYING TO IS A HUGE NEED THAT WE HAVE AS A COUNTRY.

THAT WE ARE NOT ABLE TO DO RIGHT NOW.

WE ARE NOT ABLE TO GRIEVE APPROPRIATELY.

A, WE'RE BUSY FIGHTING THE EPIDEMIC BUT ALSO THE STRANGE PARTISAN BATTLE ABOUT FIGHTING THE EPIDEMIC.

AND WE'RE GOING TO NEED SPACES TO MOURN.

WE'VE ALL LOST PEOPLE.

WE'RE ALL SCARED OF LOSING MORE AND WE WILL LOSE MORE PEOPLE.

AND YET THERE IS BEEN NO PLACE, NO SITE, NO VENUE OF TIME WHEN WE GET TO EXPERIENCE THAT GRIEF.

BUT WE WILL BE EXPERIENCING IT AND WE'LL BE EXPERIENCING IT TOGETHER IN A HEALTHY AND CATHARTIC WAY OR IN AN ISOLATED, DAMAGING, MAYBE SELF-DESTRUCTIVE WAYS.

I THINK THE THEATER --

WHAT ABOUT YOU?

HOW DO YOU ENVISION HELPING US THROUGH THIS?

WELL, LET ME GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE.

THE ONE PLAY THAT WAS PRODUCED SO FAR, IT WAS WHAT DO WE NEED TO TALK WITH, A ZOOM PLAY THAT HE WROTE IN LATE MARCH AND WE PREMIERED IN LATE APRIL, OR MID MAY.

AND IT WAS ABOUT GRIEVING.

IT WAS A WORK OF ART, NOT AS A MEMORANDUM.

SO IT IS SUBTLE BUT VERY, VERY MUCH ABOUT GRIEF.

TO MY ASTONISHMENT, THE LIVE BROADCAST WAS SEEN BY PEOPLE IN 17 COUNTRIES AND 40 STATES.

AND UP TO NOW, WE'VE HAD 60,000 VIEWERS.

WHAT THAT MADE ME REALIZE WAS THE ADVANTAGE OF THIS VIRTUAL THEATER.

THE INSTANT GEOGRAPHIC SPREAD WE HAVE.

FOR THE FIRST TIME IN HISTORY, PEOPLE, EUROPE AND ASIA AND ON THE WEST COAST.

PEOPLE ARE WATCHING THE SAME THING IN NEW YORK ARE WATCHING.

SO IT WAS TRULY A NATIONAL, INTERNATIONAL THING.

AND BOY, THAT SPARKED OFF SOME EXCITEMENT.

WE MAY BE SACRIFICING SOME IMMEDIACY OF US GATHERING TOGETHER, BUT MAYBE THAT'S REPLACED BY THE BREADTH OF OUR REACH.

AND MAYBE WE CAN DO STUFF THAT WILL REALLY RECEIVE BEYOND OUT TO A BROADER AUDIENCE.

I HOPE SO.

PUM THEATER HOLDS UP A VISION TO AMERICA THAT SHOWS A SENSE OF WHO WE ARE AS A COUNTRY.

WHAT DO YOU THINK THAT FUTURE PLAYS WILL TELL US ABOUT THIS TIME?

YOU KNOW, I THINK THERE WILL BE MAZE ABOUT THE DWIGSS AND THE INEQUALS REVEALED UNDER THIS STRESS.

I HOPE THERE WILL BE PLAYS ABOUT HUMAN AN.

I REREAD THE PLAGUE OVER THE LAST FEW WEEKS.

IT IS SUCH A BEAUTIFUL DISSECTION OF THE WAY SPECIFICALLY A PLAGUE, AN EPIDEMIC, CAN BRING OUT THE BEST IN SOME PEOPLE.

AND I HOME THAT'S WHAT WILL HAPPEN AND I HOPE WE HAVE MAZE CELEBRATING THAT.

THANK YOU FOR TALKING WITH US.

THANK YOU.

I REALLY ENJOYED IT.