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>>> HELLO EVERYONE AND WELCOME TO "AMANPOUR AND COMPANY."
HERE'S WHAT'S COMING UP.
>> WE ARE GOING TO FIX OUR BORDERS.
WE ARE GOING TO FIX EVERYTHING ABOUT OUR COUNTRY.
>> THE TRUMP TEAM ASSEMBLES.
I ASKED VETERAN DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST JAMES CARVILLE WHAT WENT WRONG FOR HIS PARTY AND HOW THE RESULT COULD UPEND THE WORLD ORDER.
>> I TAKE THIS OPPORTUNITY TO EXPRESS GRATITUDE AND ADMIRATION TO THE 46th PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES.
MY DEAR FRIEND, JOE BIDEN.
>> ISRAEL'S PRESIDENT ISAAC HERZOG COMES TO WASHINGTON.
I GET THE LATEST FROM REPORTER JEREMY DIAMOND.
>>> THE NUCLEAR QUESTION.
WHAT TRUMP 2.0 COULD MEAN FOR A DEAL WITH IRAN.
WE ARE JOINED FROM TEHRAN.
THE ORIGINAL DON'T KNOW WHERE IT'S HEADED AND THAT'S EXCITING TO ME.
>> FROM A CULT CLASSIC FILM TO A NEW STAR-STUDDED ALBUM, LIN- MANUEL MIRANDA AND LISA DAVIS TALK ABOUT THEIR NEW PROJECT, WARRIOR.
>> "AMANPOUR AND COMPANY" IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE ANDERSON FAMILY ENDOWMENT.
JIM ATTWOOD AND LESLIE WILLIAMS.
CANDACE KING WEIR.
THE SYLVIA A.
AND SIMON B. POYTA PROGRAMMING ENDOWMENT TO FIGHT ANTISEMITISM.
THE FAMILY FOUNDATION OF LAYLA AND MICKEY STRAUSS.
MARK J. BLECHNER.
THE FILOMEN M. D'AGOSTINO FOUNDATION.
SETON J. MELVIN.
THE PETER G. PETERSON AND JOAN CHARLES ROSENBLUM.
KOO AND PATRICIA YUEN.
COMMITTED TO BRIDGING CULTURAL DIFFERENCES IN OUR COMMUNITIES.
BARBARA HOPE ZUCKERBERG.
JEFFREY KATZ AND BETH ROGERS.
AND BY CONTRIBUTIONS TO YOUR PBS STATION FROM VIEWERS LIKE YOU.
THANK YOU.
>> WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM, EVERYONE.
I'M CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR IN LONDON.
IT IS SAID THAT PERSONNEL IS POLICY.
WITH HIS CABINET PICS, DONALD TRUMP IS LAYING ON HIS AGENDA.
A HARD LINE ON NATIONAL SECURITY AND FOREIGN POLICY INCLUDING UKRAINIAN SKEPTICS LIKE SENATOR MARCO RUBIO, WHO HAS BEEN PICKED TO BE SECRETARY OF STATE AND CONGRESSMAN MIKE WALLACE, SELECTED AS NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISOR.
THE REGULATION ON ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION MEASURES WITH CONGRESSMAN LEES ELDON PICKED TO MEET THE EPA.
AND DEPORTATION AT THE SOUTHERN BORDER AS STEPHEN MILLER, EXTREME ANTI-IMMIGRATION ADVISOR, WILL BE CHIEF OF POLICY.
AS THE INCOMING ADMINISTRATION RAPIDLY FILLS UP A LOYALIST, CAN DEMOCRATS DO ANY MORE THAN WATCH IT UNFOLD?
ALLIES OVERSEAS ARE ALSO BUCKLING UP AND SEEKING FAVOR WITH THE NEW ADMINISTRATION WHILE ALSO TRYING TO TRUMP PROOF.
WHO BETTER TO OFFER ADVICE THAN LONGTIME DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST JAMES CARVILLE, THE ARCHITECT OF BILL CLINTON'S DECISIVE VICTORIES IN THE 1990S.
HE POPULARIZED THE LINE IT'S THE ECONOMY, STUPID.
CARVILLE SEEMS TO HAVE AN INSTINCT FOR WINNING, ALTHOUGH HE FAILED TO PREDICT THE HARRIS LOSS.
HE IS THE SUBJECT OF A NEW DOCUMENTARY ON MAX.
CARVILLE , WINNING IS EVERYTHING, STUPID.
HE JOINS THE SHOW FROM NEW ORLEANS.
JAMES CARVILLE, WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM.
>> THANK YOU.
I'M GLAD TO BE HERE WITH YOU.
>> AS YOU SAY, WINNING IS AS YOU SAID, DONALD TRUMP WON EVERYTHING.
THE ELECTORAL, THE SENATE, THE HOUSE.
DOMINATED THE SUPREME COURT AND HAS REALLY MADE INROADS WITH DEMOGRAPHICS THAT USED TO BE OVERWHELMINGLY FOR THE DEMOCRATS.
HOW DO YOU EXPLAIN, PARTICULARLY FOR AN INTERNATIONAL AUDIENCE, THE BIGGEST SWING IN THE RIGHT IN THE UNITED STATES SINCE RONALD REAGAN?
>> WELL, FIRST OF ALL, WINNING IS EVERYTHING.
IT IS EVERYTHING THAT'S ABOVE LOYALTY.
WITHOUT WINNING, OF COURSE, THE COUNTRY DOESN'T CHANGE.
THEY ASKED VICE PRESIDENT HARRIS WHAT SHE WOULD HAVE DONE DIFFERENT THAN PRESIDENT BIDEN AND SHE SAID SHE CAN'T THINK OF ANYTHING.
>> HOLD ON BECAUSE I HAVE THAT AND I WANT TO PLAY IT.
HOLD ON BECAUSE I'M GOING TO DESCRIBE IT LET'S JUST PLAY THIS BIT.
>> A FLOOD OF ILLEGALS, SKYROCKETING PRICES, GLOBAL CHAOS.
SHE WOULD NOT CHANGE A THING.
>> WHAT YOU HAVE DONE SOMETHING DIFFERENTLY THAN PRESIDENT BIDEN DURING THE PAST FOUR YEARS?
>> THERE IS NOT A THING THAT COMES TO MIND.
>> NOTHING WILL CHANGE WITH KAMALA.
>> SO JAMES CARVILLE, THAT WAS A TRUMP AD.
WOULD YOU SAY THAT WAS DECISIVE AND EXTREMELY EFFECTIVE?
>> I DO.
I THINK THAT ANSWER WAS A DECISIVE MOMENT IN THE ENTIRE CAMPAIGN.
WE SHOULD NOT OVER INTERPRET IT.
IT'S NOT A 1980 ELECTION.
HE WILL NOT GET 50% OF THE POPULAR VOTE.
THE HOUSE WILL PROBABLY WIN BY A RAZOR THIN MINORITY -- MAJORITY.
IT WAS A BAD NIGHT.
PEOPLE WANTED CHANGE.
WE HAVE GIVE A DIFFERENT DIRECTION THAN THEY WANTED, WHICH WE COULD HAVE DONE.
WE COULD HAVE HAD AN OPEN PRIMARY PROCESS.
STAGGERING TALENT IN THE PARTY.
WE COULD HAVE DEMONSTRATED THAT.
WE CHOSE NOT TO DO THIS.
A LOT OF THESE DECISIONS WERE MADE AT THE TOP LEVEL OF THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY AND THEY WERE NOT VERY WISE DECISIONS.
>> JAMES CARVILLE, YOU SAY DON'T OVERTHINK THIS.
YOU SAY IT'S NOT AS BIG A SWING AS 1980, BUT TRUMP CAN GENUINELY CLAIM A MANDATE FROM THE AMERICAN PEOPLE.
LET'S FACE IT, THE CONVICTIONS, THE IMPEACHMENTS, ALL THE OTHER THINGS THAT HAVE BEEN GOING ON ALL THIS TIME, AND HE CAN SAY, AND THE ASSASSINATION ATTEMPT.
I SURVIVED ALL OF THIS AND I'M HERE YOUR KEY CAN TAKE IT AS A MANDATE IF HE WINS ALL THE LEVERS OF GOVERNMENT, CAN'T HE?
>> WELL, HE CAN TAKE ANYTHING THAT HE WANTS, BUT WHAT THE DEMOCRATS NEED TO DO IS BE AN OPPOSITION PARTY.
OPPOSITION STARTS RIGHT NOW.
WHEN THE INAUGURATION IS GOING TO BE LIKE EVERYTHING ELSE IN TRUMP LAND.
A GIANT CRAFT.
IT TO BE EXPOSED AND IT NEEDS TO BE EXPOSED PRONTO .
IT'S THE DEMOCRATS' PLACE TO DO THAT.
I DON'T KNOW YOU CLAIM A MANDATE IF YOU DON'T GET 50%.
HE WON THE ELECTION.
HE CAN CERTAINLY SAY I TOLD PEOPLE I WAS GOING TO DO ALL THIS AND A MAJORITY OF THEM VOTED FOR ME ANYWAY BUT I WOULD BE VERY RELUCTANT TO SWING INWARD AROUND HERE.
I WOULD SAY HE WON THE ELECTION.
>> TRUMP HAS SHOWN US THAT HE CAN CREATE A REALITY, AND WHAT HE HAS DONE WITH THIS MANDATE THAT HE APPARENTLY THINKS HE HAS IS SO FAR PUT ALL OF THE LOYALIST IN, AND IT'S A VERY, YOU KNOW, IT'S A HUGE SIGN POST TO THE VERY HARD-LINE POLICIES THAT HE SAID HE WOULD DO.
WHAT CAN THE DEMOCRATS DO ABOUT IT?
>> YOU LIVE IN A PLACE WHERE YOU HAVE AN OPPOSITION PARTY.
YOU ACT LIKE AN OPPOSITION PARTY.
SO YOU RESEARCH, YOU LAUNCH INVESTIGATIONS, YOU MAKE TALKING POINTS, YOU GET PEOPLE OUT IN FRONT.
YOUR ORGANIZE OPPOSITION, YOU POINT OUT THE WEAKNESSES OF WHAT THEY ARE DOING.
THEY ARE GOING TO DO THINGS THAT PEOPLE NEVER DREAMED OF , AND WHEN THEY DO, YOU HAVE TO BE THERE WITH AN ALTERNATIVE, BUT YOU ARE THE OPPOSITION PARTY.
OPPOSITION PARTIES DO NOT HAVE POWER.
WE NEED TO GET OVER THAT.
BUT WE HAVE THE POWER TO EXPOSE.
WE HAVE THE POWER TO POSE ALTERNATIVES.
WE HAVE THE POWER TO SPEAK DIFFERENTLY.
WE HAVE TO EXERCISE THAT POWER.
I CANNOT SIT AROUND AND MOPE AROUND ABOUT AN ELECTION THAT IS ALREADY OVER.
I HAVE TO THINK ABOUT THE NEXT ELECTION, 2026.
AND WE HAVE TO THINK ABOUT HOW WE ORGANIZE OPPOSITION WHEN IT'S THE RALLYING POINT.
WHEN DOES THE OPPOSITION START?
THERE'S A LOT OF UNANSWERED QUESTIONS HERE THAT NEED TO BE ANSWERED PRONTO.
>> WITH THAT IN MIND, CAN I ASK YOU ABOUT ONE OF THE ISSUES THAT WAS BROUGHT UP BY THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN?
AND SOME DEMOCRATS WERE ALSO UNCOMFORTABLE WITH IT.
THE IDEA OF WOKE AND THE CULTURE WARS, RIGHT?
THIS WAS MOST DEFINITELY AGAIN , AND BY THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN.
BUT JON STEWART, WHO DOES A LITTLE DIGGING, AS YOU KNOW, PUT TOGETHER A VERY INTERESTING COMPILATION OF WHITE A FEW DEMOCRATIC CANDIDATES' ADS AND HE SAID I DID NOT SEE ANYTHING WOKE HERE.
I'M GOING TO PLAY IT FOR YOU.
>> I ONLY HAVE ONE PROBLEM WITH THE WOKE THEORY.
I JUST DON'T RECALL SEEING ANY DEMOCRATS RUNNING ON WOKE --.
THESE WERE THE COMMERCIALS I SAW FOR THE DEMOCRATS.
>> WORKING TO FIX OUR ORDER CRISIS.
>> JONES IS WORKING TO SECURE OUR BORDER.
>> RESTORING ORDER AT THE SOUTHERN BORDER.
>> AND LAURA DILLON AND I'M HERE AT THE BORDER OF NASSAU COUNTY, 2000 MILES FROM MEXICO, BUT WE ARE FEELING THE MIGRANT CRISIS ALMOST EVERY DAY.
>> SO WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF THAT COMPILATION?
AND WAS WOKE OVERDONE?
>> I WILL TELL YOU EXACTLY WHAT I MAKE OF IT.
THE NEW YORK TIMES THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE READ, THAT I'M SURE YOU READ.
I WILL GIVE HER CREDIT.
SHE DID NOT USE ANY OF THE WOKE LANGUAGE.
BUT IT'S LIKE TRYING TO WASH CLOSE THAT'S GOT SMOKE ALL OVER THEM.
YOU CAN'T GET THE STENCH OUT.
YOU CAN ASK SENATOR MANCHIN, SENATOR CASEY, SENATOR BROWN, SENATOR TESSA, IF THEY DON'T THINK THAT THE FUND THE POLICE HAD AN ADVERSE EFFECT ON ATTITUDES TOWARD THE DEMOCRATIC ALREADY, MY GOD.
YOU ARE RIGHT.
IT WAS SO STUPID, NO ONE WANTED TO BRING IT UP THREE YEARS LATER, BUT THE RESIDUE OF IT JUST STUCK WITH US.
AND YOU'VE GOT TO READ EXACTLY WHAT WAS SAID.
EXACTLY WHAT I SAID.
AND IT'S GOING TO TAKE MORE THAN ONE CYCLE TO GET THIS STENCH OFF OF THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY.
AND IT'S THE STENCH OF THE HIGHEST ORDER, LET ME TELL YOU.
>> I'M GOING TO ASK YOU ABOUT THE STENCH IN A MOMENT.
YOU BROUGHT UP THE IDEA THAT AMERICA IS STILL NOT READY FOR A FEMALE PRESIDENT.
LAST SPRING YOU SAID A SUSPICION OF MINE IS THAT THERE ARE TOO MANY PREACHY FEMALES DOMINATING THE CULTURE OF THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY.
YOU STAND BY THAT?
FEMALES?
>> WELL, WOULD YOU LOOK AT OUR MAIL VOTE?
LOOK AT HOW WE DID WITH MALES AND HOW WE DID WITH NONWHITE MALES AND TELL ME THAT THE DEMOCRATS DON'T HAVE A MESSAGING PROBLEM MESSAGE COMES ACROSS AS TOO FEMININE?
OF COURSE, I WAS RIGHT WHEN I SAID THAT.
THERE IS NOT A PERSON IN THE WORLD THAT I'VE TALKED TO THAT DOUBTS THAT I'M RIGHT RIGHT NOW.
I MEAN, I SAY PROVOCATIVE THINGS TO GET A PROVOCATIVE REACTION.
THAT IS SOMEBODY REALLY GOING TO TELL ME WE DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH MALE VOTERS?
>> THAT'S REALLY INTERESTING BECAUSE -- >> IF WE DO, IT'S SOMETHING I'M COMPLETELY UNAWARE OF.
>> I WILL REVIEW THE STATS.
ONE IN THREE VOTERS OF COLOR VOTED FOR TRUMP.
HE IMPROVED SUPPORT WITH YOUNGER VOTERS COMPARED WITH 2020 AND YOU'RE RIGHT, HE DID WIN THE MALE VOTE.
I JUST NEED TO UNDERSTAND THIS .
WHAT ARE YOU SAYING THEN THAT THE DEMOCRATS NEED TO DO ABOUT THE SO-CALLED GENDER GAP?
WHAT SHOULD THEY DO?
>> WELL, FIRST THING, THEY COULD HAVE DONE A LOT OF MUSCULAR ECONOMIC QUESTIONS THAT WE DID NOT DO.
MINIMUM WAGE TO $15 AN HOUR.
TALK MORE ABOUT RAISING TAXES ON INCOMES ABOVE 400,000, USING THAT MONEY TO HELP YOUNG PEOPLE BUY A HOUSE.
WE COULD CERTAINLY SHOVEL THE ENTIRE IDENTITY POLITICS ABOUT 50 FEET INTO THE GROUND AND BURY IT.
I MEAN, YOU CAN START BY DOING THINGS LIKE THAT.
YOU COULD HAVE GOT OUT IN FRONT OF THE CLIMATE ISSUE.
BY THE WAY, RAKING DOWN IN THE UNITED STATES BY A HISTORIC 30%, BUT WE WERE NOT ABLE TO TALK ABOUT CRIME, BECAUSE THE LOCAL POLICE WOULD NOT ALLOW THAT.
ONE OF THE GREAT ACCOMPLISHMENTS OF THE BIDEN- HARRIS ADMINISTRATION.
SO THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS THAT YOU CAN DO.
YOU CAN CHANGE YOUR LANGUAGE AROUND.
YOU KNOW, DON'T USE CODED LANGUAGE.
LIKE I SAID, IT'S GOING TO TAKE ONE CYCLE BEFORE WE CAN WASH THIS SMELL OFF OF OUR SHIRT BUT I THINK THERE'S A GOOD CHANCE THAT IF WE ACT CORRECTLY, IT WILL BE GONE BY '26 AND GONE, GONE BY '28.
BUT PLEASE DON'T LET ANYBODY SAY WE DIDN'T WELL WITH MALES BECAUSE WE DID NOT.
>> NO, I WAS REFERRING TO THE PREACHY FEMALE THING.
HERE IS THE THING.
I WANT TO PICK UP ON WHAT YOU JUST SAID.
FIRST OF ALL, YOU CAN IMAGINE ALL THE LIKE-MINDED GOVERNMENTS AND POLITICIANS HERE IN EUROPE ARE THRILLED TO SEE THAT THEY HAVE A BIG CHAMPION NOW AGAIN IN THE UNITED STATES.
I WANT TO ASK YOU ABOUT THE MESSAGING, BECAUSE YOU JUST SAID THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION HAD MANY, MANY SUCCESSFUL POLICIES BUT THEY DID NOT SEND THEIR MESSAGE ACROSS.
EVEN HERE IN THE UK, THE ECONOMIST, A CENTER-RIGHT FINANCIAL MAGAZINE AS YOU KNOW EMMA CALLED AMERICA THE ENVY OF THE WORLD.
AND I WONDER WHETHER YOU THINK CONSERVATIVE MEDIA LANDSCAPE, WHETHER IT IS ON TV, CABLE, YOU KNOW, ON STREAMING, PODCASTS AND ALL THE REST OF IT, THAT DO A MUCH BETTER JOB THAN YOU DO?
>> YES.
THERE WAS AN EXCELLENT ARTICLE IN THE NEW REPUBLICAN THAT I WILL NAME ON MY PODCAST TOMORROW.
THE MEDIA INFRASTRUCTURE IN THIS COUNTRY HAS BEEN FOR THE LARGE PART TAKEN OVER BY RIGHT- WINGERS.
TO SOME EXTENT, WE'VE ALLOWED IT TO HAPPEN.
SO THAT'S A VALID THING.
THAT'S JUST RIGHT NOW.
WE HAVE TO BE THREE TIMES AS GOOD AS THEY ARE BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE THE SAME MEDIA POWER THEY DO.
WE'VE GOT TO GO ABOUT OUR BUSINESS .
WE CANNOT JUST MULL ON IT, STU AND DESPAIR AND TALK ABOUT HOW UNFAIR EVERYTHING IS.
WE'VE GOT TO GET GOING HERE.
WE'VE GOT TO BE THE OPPOSITION PARTY.
CRITICIZE, PROPOSE, DO ALL THE THINGS THAT OPPOSITION PARTIES DO.
>> AND ABOUT YOUR FILM, IT'S ALL ABOUT WINNING, STUPID.
THERE IS A REALLY NICE BIT IN THEIR ABOUT YOU AND YOUR WIFE AND THERE'S A QUOTE FROM A FORMER DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST, AS WELL.
AND IT SHOWS --WELL, I'M GOING TO PLAY THIS CLIP AND THEN I WILL ASK YOU.
>> IS ABOUT REPUBLICAN.
HE'S A REPTILE.
AND YET, THEY'VE MADE IT WORK OVER THE YEARS.
>> I'M REALLY CONSERVATIVE.
HE IS REALLY A LIBERAL.
>> THERE'S THREE THINGS I AIN'T CHANGING.
NOT CHANGING LIVES, ORIENTATION OR POLITICAL PARTIES.
WE ARE GOING TO GO TO THE HOUSE WITH WHAT WE'VE GOT, OKAY?
>> SO TWO INCREDIBLY POWERFUL PEOPLE AS STRATEGISTS BUT DIFFERENT PARTIES.
IS IT TOO GLIB TO ASK YOU, YOU MADE THIS UNION AMERICA IS SO POLARIZED.
IS THERE ANY ROUTE --HOW DO YOU MAKE IT WORK AND WHAT WOULD YOUR MESSAGE BE FOR REPUBLICANS AND DEMOCRATS NOW?
>> WE HAVE OUR 31st WEDDING ANNIVERSARY ON THANKSGIVING WITH OUR CHILDREN.
I DON'T KNOW.
I DON'T REALLY GET MARRIED TO BE AN EXAMPLE.
I GOT MARRIED BECAUSE I WAS IN LOVE WITH THE WOMAN.
I'M STILL IN LOVE WITH THE SAME WOMAN.
PEOPLE MIGHT FIND IT INTERESTING.
MY MARRIAGE IS WHAT IT IS.
I DON'T KNOW IF IT PRESENTS A LARGER LESSON TO OTHER PEOPLE, BUT IT'S BEEN 31 YEARS THANKSGIVING.
SO THE FOUND DID A GOOD JOB, AND I THINK MARY REALLY MADE THE FILM A LOT BETTER BECAUSE OF THAT.
I WILL GO BACK TO WINNING IS WINNING IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN LOYALTY.
I HATE TO SAY THAT BUT IT'S THE NUMBER ONE OBJECTIVE OF ANY POLITICAL CAMPAIGN, TO WIN THE ELECTION.
YOU CAN FIX EVERYTHING LATER.
WHAT HAPPENED TO VICE PRESIDENT HARRIS, SHE WAS VERY LOYAL TO PRESIDENT BIDEN.
SHE DID NOT WANT TO CRITICIZE HIM OR SAY SHE WAS DIFFERENT.
THAT FRANKLY WAS A PIVOTAL MOMENT IN THE CAMPAIGN.
WHEN IT HAPPENED, I KNEW IT, THEY KNEW IT.
IT TOOK THEM, YOU KNOW, TWO HOURS TO GET AN AD OUT BECAUSE THAT IS WHAT THEY WERE LOOKING FOR.
PEOPLE WANT TO CHANGE.
AND WE DECIDED WE WEREN'T GOING TO GIVE IT TO THEM AND WE SHOULD HAVE HAD AN OPEN PROCESS, SHOULD HAVE LET SOME OF THE TALENT OUT AND PUT IT ON THE RACETRACK.
>> JAMES CARVILLE, THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR ANALYSIS.
>>> ISRAEL'S PRIME MINISTER BENJAMIN NETANYAHU AND HIS FAR RIGHT ALLIES ARE CONVEYING THEIR DEEP SATISFACTION WITH TRUMP'S VICTORY, JUST AS THE COUNTRY'S PRESIDENT ISAAC HERZOG MEETS TODAY WITH PRESIDENT BIDEN IN WASHINGTON.
THE U.S. IS SO FAR END THE WAR.
IN THE LAST TWO DAYS, MORE THAN 62 PEOPLE WERE KILLED IN ISRAELI AIRSTRIKES ACCORDING TO THE HEALTH MINISTRY IN GAZA.
NORTHERN GAZA HAS TURNED INTO A GRAVEYARD.
JEREMY DIAMOND JOINS ME WITH THE LATEST FROM JERUSALEM.
JEREMY, JUST TELL THE VIEWERS WHAT SPECIFICALLY ARE, AS I SAID, SOME OF THE GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS SAYING AND THINKING ABOUT HOW THEY WILL BE ABLE TO BENEFIT FROM A TRUMP WIN?
>> THERE IS NO QUESTION THAT THERE IS A FEELING INSIDE THE ISRAELI GOVERNMENT THAT A DONALD TRUMP PRESIDENCY WILL BE FAR MORE FAVORABLE TO THEM THAN A KAMALA HARRIS PRESIDENCY WOULD HAVE BEEN.
AND THAT THEY WILL HAVE FAR MORE LEEWAY UNDER TRUMP AND THEY HAVE HAD UNDER BIDEN AND THEY WOULD HAVE HAD UNDER KAMALA HARRIS.
THAT IS WHY WE ARE SEEING THIS MOVE BY THE FINANCE MINISTER WHO OVERSEES TWO KEY DEPARTMENTS IN THE MINISTRY OF DEFENSE RESPONSIBLE FOR SETTLEMENT IN THE WEST BANK, NOW TAKING THIS STEP TO LAY THE GROUNDWORK TO TRY AND ANNEX THE ISRAELI SETTLEMENTS IN THE WEST BANK NEXT YEAR.
THIS IS JUST AN INITIAL STEP THAT HE IS LAYING OUT.
WE DON'T KNOW WHETHER THE ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER IS ON BOARD WITH THIS, BUT HE MADE VERY CLEAR THAT HE IS TAKING THIS STEP BECAUSE OF DONALD TRUMP'S ELECTION.
AND BECAUSE HE BELIEVES THAT PRESIDENT TRUMP WILL ULTIMATELY SUPPORT ISRAEL ANNEXING THESE ISRAELI SETTLEMENTS.
AND THERE IS CERTAINLY REASON FOR HIM TO BELIEVE THAT, BECAUSE DONALD TRUMP'S PEACE PLAN RELEASED IN 2020 FOR THE ISRAELI-PALESTINIAN CONFLICT CALLED FOR ISRAEL TO BE ABLE TO ANNEX THESE SETTLEMENTS, MAKE NO TERRITORY SWAPS.
EFFECTIVELY TAKING 30% OF THE WEST BANK AND MAKING IT A PART OF THE STATE OF ISRAEL, EVEN AS THEY CALLED FOR ESTABLISHING A ON WHAT REMAINED OF THE WEST BANK AND THE GAZA STRIP.
IT SHOULD BE NOTED THAT THERE'S REPORTS THAT TRUMP ENCOURAGED NETANYAHU NOT TO MOVE FORWARD WITH ANNEXATION.
NONETHELESS, IN HIS FIRST TERM, HE WAS EXTREMELY SUPPORTIVE OF ISRAEL.
HE TOLD THE LINE WITH THE ISRAELI GOVERNMENT IN TERMS OF GIVING THEM THE RECOGNITION OF JERUSALEM AS THE CAPITAL, RECOGNIZING THE ANNEXATION OF THE OCCUPIED HEIGHTS, AND A SLEW OF OTHER DECISIONS.
WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE WAY HE IS ALREADY STARTING TO FILL HIS CABINET AND THE RANKS OF HIS ADMINISTRATION, EVERY PERSON THERE IS EXTREMELY SUPPORTIVE OF ISRAEL.
NOT SOMEONE YOU WOULD EXPECT IT TO BRING ANY KIND OF PRESSURE TO BEAR ON THE ISRAELI GOVERNMENT.
THERE IS NO QUESTION THAT TRUMP WANTS THE WARS TO END AND HE HAS MADE THAT HE AFFECT THE BLUE WANTED TO BE SETTLED BEFORE HE COMES INTO OFFICE.
BUT THAT'S NOW.
WHAT HAPPENS WHEN HE COMES INTO OFFICE, HOW DOES HE HANDLE IT ADMINISTRATION?
>> AND AGAIN, WE KNOW THAT QATAR HAS SUSPENDED THEIR EFFORT TO NEGOTIATE AN END TO THE WAR AND THE HOSTAGE RELEASE.
TODAY IS THE DEADLINE FOR THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION SAYING UNLESS YOU LET AID INTO GAZA, WE WILL HAVE TO RECONSIDER SENDING MILITARY TO YOU BASED ON OUR RULES.
SOME STARTED TO GET IN TODAY.
HOW DO YOU ASSESS THE AMOUNT AND WHY, AND WILL THAT BE THE BEGINNING OF A LOT OF AID GOING ON?
>> I DON'T NEED TO ASSESS IT.
YOU CAN LOOK UP THE ASSESSMENT OF THESE HUMANITARIAN AID ORGANIZATIONS WHO PUT OUT A LETTER SAYING THAT THE ISRAELI GOVERNMENT HAS NOT ONLY FAILED TO MEET THE DEMANDS OF THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION TO IMPROVE THE CONDITIONS TO GET MORE HUMANITARIAN AID IN.
BUT IN FACT THAT THE SITUATION HAS WORSENED IN THE MONTHS SINCE THEY SENT THE LETTER TO THE GOVERNMENT.
THESE ARE REPUTABLE GROUPS LIKE OX CORE, SAVE THE CHILDREN MAKING LAID OUT BY WHAT HAPPENED YESTERDAY IN GAZA.
14 TRUCKS FROM THE WORLD FOOD PROGRAM GOT AUTHORIZATION TO GO INTO GAZA.
ONLY THREE OF THEM ACTUALLY MADE IT TO THE CITY IN NORTHERN GAZA, BECAUSE OF ISRAELI MILITARY ACTIVITY ON THE GROUND.
ONCE THEY ACTUALLY MADE IT THERE, THEY MADE IT THERE LAST NIGHT.
THIS MORNING THERE WERE REPORTS THAT THE ISRAELI MILITARY MOVED IN AND NEAR THE SITES WHERE AID WAS DELIVERED, FORCING HUNDREDS OF PEOPLE IN THE VERY SAME SHELTERS WHERE AID WAS DELIVERED TO FLEE.
ISRAELI GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS ARE STILL MEETING WITH U.S. OFFICIALS TO TRY TO FIND WAYS TO SEE TO SOME OF THESE DEMANDS THAT THE U.S. HAS BEEN MAKING.
I CAN TELL YOU THAT IS REALLY OFFICIALS HAVE BEEN CONCERNED ABOUT THIS LETTER AND WANTED TO SHOW A GOOD FAITH EFFORT TO THE U.S.
THEY ARE STILL NOWHERE CLOSE TO THE BENCHMARKS THAT THE U.S. HAS SET.
FOR NOW IT DOES NOT APPEAR THAT THE U.S. IS INCLINED TO MAKE ANY POLICY CHANGES, DESPITE IN THAT LETTER.
>> JEREMY DIAMOND, THANK YOU SO MUCH, FROM JERUSALEM.
>>> NEXT THE ANNUAL COP CLIMATE SUMMIT IS TAKING PLACE IN AZERBAIJAN.
MANY WORLD LEADERS ARE CONSPICUOUSLY ABSENT FROM THIS SUMMIT.
MANY OF COURSE ARE GRAPPLING WITH THEIR OWN DOMESTIC CRISES AND THE IMMINENT ARRIVAL OF TRUMP 2.0.
HIS NATIONAL SECURITY TEAM IS GRADUALLY BEING FILLED WITH HAWKISH FIGURES TOWARDS IRAN.
THE NEW YORK TIMES HAS REPORTED THAT SOME IN IRAN'S GOVERNMENT ARE HOPING TO EXPLORE A POSSIBLE NEW NUCLEAR DEAL WITH THE PRESIDENT ELECT.
IT WOULD BE A SURPRISE OUTCOME THAT SUCH A TENSE MOMENT WHEN ISRAEL AND IRAN HAVE EXCHANGED MISSILE STRIKES.
THE DEFENSE MINISTER ALSO SAYS THAT THIS IS THE MOMENT TO THWART THE IRANIAN NUCLEAR PROGRAM.
THE INTERNATIONAL ATOMIC ENERGY AGENCY HAS ASSESSED THAT TEHRAN HAS THE MATERIALS TO MAKE SEVERAL NUCLEAR BOMBS IF HE CHOOSES TO DO SO.
TOMORROW, A GENERAL WILL TRAVEL THERE FOR TALKS ON THEIR NUCLEAR PROGRAM.
HE IS CURRENTLY AT THE SUMMIT, JOINING THE PROGRAM FROM THERE.
RAFAEL, WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM.
>> THANK YOU.
>> SO WHAT IS YOUR MOST URGENT AGENDA ITEM GOING TO IRAN AS YOU ARE GOING TO DO TOMORROW?
AND AGAIN IN YOUR OWN WORDS, TELL ME WHAT THEY HAVE, WHAT THEY COULD DO, AND WHAT DECISIONS YOU THINK THEY'RE GOING TO MAKE ON THE NUCLEAR BREAKOUT ISSUE.
>> THEY HAVE A BIG, BIG NUCLEAR PROGRAM.
THEY HAVE A LOT OF NUCLEAR MATERIAL THAT COULD BE USED EVENTUALLY TO MAKE A NUCLEAR WEAPON.
THEY DO NOT HAVE A NUCLEAR WEAPON AT THIS POINT.
AND WE HAVE TO NEGOTIATE AND WE HAVE TO WORK SO THAT IT DOES NOT HAPPEN.
THIS IS ONE OF THE REASONS I AM HEADING TO IRAN.
OF COURSE, IT WILL NOT BE MY VERY IMPORTANT ONE.
IN THE MANY CIRCUMSTANCES, SOME OF THEM YOU WERE DISCUSSING JUST NOW.
WE ARE IN A MOMENT OF PARTICULAR ATTENTION.
A MOMENT WHERE PRECISELY THE POSSIBILITY THAT IRAN COULD TAKE THIS POSITION COULD TRIGGER A RESPONSE FROM ISRAEL AS WELL.
SO OUR IDEA IS TO RELENTLESSLY LOOK FOR REASONABLE STRONG SOLUTIONS.
THIS IS WHAT I NEED TO DO.
IT WILL BE MY FIRST TIME.
NEW PRESIDENT.
THE FOREIGN MINISTER WHO I KNOW VERY WELL, AND EXPERIENCED FORMER NEGOTIATOR.
SO HE KNOWS THE ISSUE VERY, VERY WELL.
I'M HOPING THAT I WILL BE ABLE TO RUN STRAIGHT INTO THE MOST IMPORTANT MATTERS AS I GET INTO >> YOU HAVE BEEN HELPING OBVIOUSLY FOR COOPERATION.
YOU GOT THESE MEETINGS.
WHAT'S YOUR GUT?
WHAT INFORMATION HAVE YOU HAD AHEAD OF YOUR VISIT?
ARE YOU GETTING SIGNALS AS THE NEW YORK TIMES REPORTED, THAT THEY ARE POTENTIALLY, AT LEAST SOME MEMBERS OF THE GOVERNMENT, INTERESTED IN PURSUING ANOTHER NUCLEAR DEAL, EVEN WITH PRESIDENT TRUMP?
>> WELL, THIS IS NOT A SECRET, CHRISTIANE.
SINCE THE NEW GOVERNMENT TOOK OFFICE BACK IN THE SUMMER, THEY SAID IT TO ME IN A LETTER THAT THEY WANT TO ENGAGE, THEY WANT TO LOOK FOR SOLUTIONS.
SO FOR NOW, WE HAVE NOT SEEN FUNDAMENTAL CHANGES IN THEIR BEHAVIOR, BUT THEY CONTINUE TO PROFESS THIS IDEA TO REENGAGE IN A MORE SUBSTANTIVE WAY.
AND I SHOULD TAKE THIS FOR ME FROM THE PRESIDENT THAT HE WANTS TO HAVE A CONVERSATION ABOUT THAT.
OTHERWISE I GUESS HE WOULD NOT BE INTERESTED IN HAVING THIS CONVERSATION.
THAT BEING SAID, WE HAVE TO HAVE WITH REAL CONTENT THIS CONVERSATION.
AND THIS IS THE CRACKS OF THE MATTER.
>> AND I ASKED FOR A BASELINE OF WHAT VIEWERS DO NEED TO KNOW?
REMIND US WHERE IRAN WAS IN THE MONITORING MECHANISM UNDER THE JCP AWAY AT THE TIME THAT PRESIDENT TRUMP PULLED THE UNITED STATES OUT OF THAT AGREEMENT AND THEN FRANKLY, IT COLLAPSED BECAUSE IT JUST COLLAPSED WITHOUT THE UNITED DATES.
WHERE ARE THEY NOW COMPARED TO THAT?
>> INDEED, THAT AGREEMENT, AMONG THE MANY THINGS IT HAD.
IT WAS A COMPLEX DIPLOMATIC AGREEMENT FOR THE AUDIENCE TO BE REMINDED.
A NUMBER OF LIMITATIONS ON THE AMOUNT OF NUCLEAR MATERIAL THAT IRAN COULD HAVE.
THE MACHINES WITH WHICH YOU ENRICH URANIUM TO GET IT TO THE LEVEL.
MANY, MANY THINGS THERE.
IN 2018, THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION DECIDED TO LEAVE THIS AGREEMENT.
THAT AGREEMENT INCLUDED A NUMBER OF ADDITIONAL VERIFICATION MEASURES, WHICH MEANS THAT THE AGENCY COULD SEE MUCH, MUCH MORE , BECAUSE WE ARE INSPECTING IRAN.
PEOPLE SHOULD NOT THINK WE HAVE INTERRUPTED OUR WORK THERE.
WE ARE STILL INSPECTING.
WHAT WE SEE , THE NEED TO SEE MUCH MORE.
ALL OF THIS MACHINERY WAS IN PLACE.
OF COURSE, ONCE THE AGREEMENT WAS ABANDONED BY ONE SIDE, IRAN TOOK SOME TIME BUT EVENTUALLY LEFT THE AGREEMENT, AS WELL, LEAVING IT PERHAPS NOMINALLY ALIVE, BUT ACTUALLY AS AN EMPTY SHELL, IN A CERTAIN SENSE.
SO NOW WE ARE IN A SITUATION WHICH IS RADICALLY DIFFERENT.
IN WHAT SENSE, IRAN HAS BEEN ENRICHING URANIUM AT LEVELS NOT DONE BEFORE.
NO NON-NUCLEAR WEAPON STATES , A COUNTRY WITHOUT NUCLEAR WEAPONS, ARE REACHING THESE HEIGHTS.
AT THE SAME TIME, THEY HAVE A NUMBER OF SOPHISTICATED MACHINES, WHICH THEY DID NOT HAVE IN THE PAST, SO THE PROGRAM, THEY HAVE MORE FACILITIES WERE THERE DOING ALL THESE THINGS, SO THE PROGRAM IS MUCH BIGGER.
THE THING THAT WE HAVE IN OUR HANDS IS A MORE COMPLEX OBJECT OF NEGOTIATION THAT WIRES ADEQUATE SOLUTIONS.
AMONG THOSE, WHAT I AM PLEADING NOW BECAUSE WE WILL NOT GO FOR A DEFINITE AGREEMENT.
THE NEW AMERICAN ADMINISTRATION WE HAVE TO SEE WHAT THEIR POSITION WILL BE.
THERE WILL BE A NUMBER OF THINGS.
BUT AT THIS POINT IN TIME, I'M NOT GOING THERE TO JUST HAVE A CONVERSATION.
I AM GOING THERE TO TRY TO REINFORCE OUR MONITORING AND VERIFICATION MECHANISM AND SO THAT THE ROAD TO DIPLOMACY AS POSSIBLE AND THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT, BECAUSE WITHOUT THAT, AS INSPECTOR, I WILL NOT BE ABLE TO TELL ANYBODY, THE AMERICANS, THE EUROPEAN THREE, CHINA OR RUSSIA, ALL THE PLAYERS.
I AM NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO TELL THEM WHAT THERE IS THERE AND IRAN.
SO THIS IS WHY WHAT WE ARE DOING NOW IS FOR EVERYBODY'S BENEFIT.
I'M TELLING MY URANIAN COUNTERPARTS AND I HOPE WE WILL BE ABLE TO HAVE THIS CONVERSATION WITH THE PRESIDENT.
THIS IS SOMETHING IN YOUR BENEFIT.
IF THERE'S GOING TO BE ANY AGREEMENT, THE NEW AGREEMENT YOU'RE MENTIONING OR THE OLD NEW FORMAT, WE NEED TO PUT THINGS MORE OR LESS IN ORDER.
WE NEED TO ALLOW THE IAEA TO SET A BASELINE WHICH IS NOT EXISTING AT THE MOMENT.
>> OKAY, THAT IS AN IMPORTANT POINT.
BASICALLY YOU ARE SAYING ONE TREMBLED OUT AND SAID HE WOULD MAKE AN EVEN BETTER DEAL, IT DID NOT HAPPEN?
NO DEAL HAPPENED AND THEY CONTINUED THE IN RICHMOND.
THAT I SAY BECAUSE ISRAEL HAS MOOTED THE NOTION OF POTENTIALLY BOMBING IRAN'S NUCLEAR FACILITIES.
A FORMER ADVISOR TO PRIME MINISTER NETANYAHU SAYS THE LIKELIHOOD OF ISRAEL ATTACKING IRAN'S NUCLEAR FACILITIES HAS INCREASED.
YOU MIGHT REMEMBER IN THEIR EXCHANGE OF MISSILE ATTACKS AND AIRSTRIKES, THE U.S.
ASKED HIM NOT TO HIT IRAN'S NUCLEAR SITES.
I'M ASKING YOU WHAT WOULD BE THE RESULT OF MAJOR AIRSTRIKES AGAINST A NUCLEAR WHATEVER, WHAT WOULD BE THE EFFECT?
>> THERE ARE MANY --OF COURSE, YOU KNOW, WE ARE MAKING OUR OWN ASSESSMENTS.
THERE ARE MANY FACILITIES IN EUROPE.
A NUCLEAR POWER PLANT, LIKE THE MANY WE HAVE AROUND THE WORLD THAT HAVE LOTS OF NUCLEAR MATERIAL INSIDE.
THEN THERE ARE OTHER FACILITIES, SOME OF WHICH CONTAIN NUCLEAR MATERIAL.
THE MOTHERS DO NOT, BUT THEY ARE RELATED BECAUSE THEY ARE FABRICATING CENTRIFUGES OR DOING THINGS THAT ARE ANCILLARY AND NECESSARY FOR THE PROGRAM.
SO IT IS NOT AN EASY THING.
IF YOU ARE THINKING ABOUT INSTALLATIONS THAT HAVE NUCLEAR MATERIAL INSIDE, URANIAN AND, ET CETERA.
THEN YOU WOULD HAVE RADIOLOGICAL IMPACTS THAT WOULD DEPEND, THE MAGNITUDE OF WHICH WOULD DEPEND ON THE NATURE OF THE STRIKE.
AS A NUCLEAR FACILITY, NUCLEAR INSTALLATIONS SHOULD NEVER BE ATTACKED.
THERE IS A BODY OF LAW AND NUMEROUS RESOLUTIONS FROM THE GENERAL CONFERENCE AND GENEVA IN THE 1940S SAYING THESE THINGS.
EVEN NOW IN MY WORK IN UKRAINE AND RUSSIA.
I HAVE BEEN BEFORE THE UNITED NATIONS COUNCIL SAYING NUCLEAR FACILITIES SHOULD NOT BE ATTACKED.
SO APART FROM SPECULATIONS OR POLITICAL POSITIONING'S THAT I DON'T HAVE A VIEW ON, JUST TO SAY THAT OUR WORK THERE IS TO AVOID THAT SCENARIO FROM HAPPENING.
>> CAN I ASK YOU A QUESTION ABOUT COP?
YOU HAVE BEEN THERE.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE MOOD SEEMS TO BE THERE.
NOT MANY OF THE WORLD LEADERS ARE THERE.
ISSUE OF NUCLEAR POWER.
YOU HAVE PROPOSED TAKING CONCRETE STEPS FOR DECARBONIZATION VIA NUCLEAR POWER.
YOU HAVE ALSO SAID TO TRIPLE THE NUCLEAR CAPACITY BY 2050 IS A GOAL.
AND YOU SAY IT WOULD REQUIRE 150 MILLION --SORRY, BILLY AND OF INVESTMENT PER YEAR FOR A PERIOD OF TIME UNTIL 2050.
THAT SOUNDS LIKE A MASSIVE AMOUNT.
I JUST WONDER WHETHER THERE IS ANY GOVERNMENT THAT IS RECEPTIVE TO THAT, WHERE THE NUCLEAR POWER IS BEING SEEN AT THIS POINT AS A ALTERNATIVE?
>> TWO THINGS, NUCLEAR POWER IS DOING THIS.
NUCLEAR POWER AT THE MOMENT, AS WE SPEAK, CHRISTIANE, PROVIDES A THIRD OF THE CLEAN ENERGY PRODUCED IN THE WORLD TODAY.
HALF OF THE CLEAN ENERGY IN EUROPE.
HALF OF THE CLEAN ENERGY IN THE UNITED STATES PRODUCED NOW TODAY WITHOUT ANY DOUBLING, TRIPLING OR WHATEVER.
SO THE IDEA IS THAT NUCLEAR BE --IN FACT, IN THE PREVIOUS COP, THERE WAS INTERNATIONAL CONSENSUS.
NOT ONLY NUCLEAR USERS SAYING NUCLEAR SHOULD BE ACCELERATED.
SIDE-BY-SIDE RENEWAL.
IT SHOULD BE ACCELERATED BECAUSE WE SEE THAT WE ARE NOT GOING TO MAKE IT BY 2050 WITHOUT THIS.
SO THE ISSUE IS THERE.
THERE ARE MANY ISSUES FINANCING.
MANY TECHNICAL ASPECTS.
WE ARE DISCOUNTING THOSE.
CERTAINLY THE TREND IS AN UPWARD TREND.
WHETHER IT'S AS FAST AS IT'S NEEDED, THAT'S ANOTHER QUESTION.
>> I WISH WE COULD TALK MORE BUT WE'VE RUN OUT OF TIME.
RAFAEL GROSSI, THANK YOU.
WE WILL CHECK IN HOPEFULLY AFTER YOUR TRIP TO IRAN.
>>> REIMAGINING A CULT CLASSIC MOVIE 45 YEARS AFTER ITS RELEASE.
THE WARRIORS IS GETTING A MUSICAL TREATMENT FROM HAMILTON CREATOR LIN-MANUEL MIRANDA.
HE HAS TEAMED UP WITH PLAYWRIGHT EISA DAVIS TO CREATE WARRIORS, A CONCEPT ALBUM WHICH BRINGS TOGETHER A STAR-STUDDED ROSTER OF MUSICIANS FROM LAURYN HILL TO MARK ANTONY TO HONOR THE 1979 THRILLER THAT FOLLOWS A NEW YORK CITY GANG ON THEIR JOURNEY FROM THE BRONX TO CONEY ISLAND.
THEY JOIN US TO DISCUSS THE LOVE LETTER TO THE FILM AND THE LASTING LEGACY.
>> THANKS.
THANK YOU BOTH FOR JOINING US.
PEOPLE ARE PROBABLY FAMILIAR WITH YOU FROM HAMILTON.
THEY WILL SAY WHAT'S THE WARRIORS?
WHEN I TRIED TO DESCRIBE THE PLOT TO PEOPLE, THEY ARE LIKE THIS CANNOT BE REAL.
THIS WAS A ROADMAP OF NEW YORK FOR YOU AT A CERTAIN TIME PERIOD FOR PEOPLE WHO HAVE NOT WATCHED IT, WHAT IS THIS?
>> I THINK EVERYONE HAS A MOVIE THEY SAW WHEN THEY WERE GROWING UP AND ALSO THE MOVIE THEY SAW WITHOUT THE PARENTS PERMISSION GROWING UP.
WARRIORS WAS THAT MOVIE FOR ME.
TOUCHSTONE FOR HIP-HOP CULTURE AND NEW YORKERS BECAUSE IT IS SUCH A SNAPSHOT OF 1979 NEW YORK.
IT IS ABOUT OPENINGS IN THE CITY GOING TO A PEACE SUMMIT.
A TRUCE IN THE SOUTH BRONX.
THE CHARISMATIC LEADER WHO CALLS THE TRUCE IS ASSASSINATED AFTER AN IMPASSIONED SPEECH.
THE ASSASSIN BLAMES THE WARRIORS FROM CONEY ISLAND AND THEY HAVE TO FIGHT THEIR WAY FROM THE BRONX TO CONEY ISLAND, WHICH EVERY NEW YORKER KNOWS IS QUITE A JOURNEY.
>> WHEN YOU WATCH THAT MOVIE, THERE ARE CERTAIN THINGS THAT MAY BE FLEW IN THE '70S THAT WOULD NOT FLY ANYMORE.
THERE ARE LOTS OF LINES THAT ARE HOMOPHOBIC IN THE ORIGINAL MOVIE.
YOU DECIDED TO FLIP THE SCRIPT.
>> YEAH.
I THINK IT IS A VERY AGGRO MOVIE.
VERY TESTOSTERONE LADEN MOVIE.
WE TRIED TO CONNECT THE DOTS NO ONE ELSE HAS CONNECTED YET.
THAT'S WHAT OUR BRAINS DO NATURALLY.
WHEN GAMER GAIT WAS UNFOLDING, I REMEMBER PEOPLE WERE.INNOCENT WOMEN AND SAYING HERE'S THE HOME ADDRESS.
GO GET THEM.
DO WHAT YOU WILL WITH THIS INFORMATION.
I THOUGHT THAT SUCH A LOSER ACT.
IN THE MOVIE, HE SHOOTS CYRUS, POINTS AT ANOTHER GANG AND SAYS THEY DID IT AND THERE LEFT TO FEND FOR THEMSELVES FOR THE REST OF THE MOVIE.
SO DISCONNECTING THOSE TWO DOTS SLIPS THAT FOR THE WARRIORS FOR ME.
IT ALSO COMPLICATED EVERY SUBSEQUENT PLOT POINT FOR ME.
LIKE IF THEY ARE WOMEN, HOW WOULD THEY DEAL WITH THIS SCENARIO?
HOW WOULD THEY DEAL WITH THIS UNDERCOVER COP?
THERE'S TWO THINGS.
ONE, WE CARVE OUT OUR OWN LANE.
THE ALBUM IS VERY MUCH A LOVE LETTER TO THAT MOVIE BUT IT WILL ALSO NEVER BE CONFUSED WITH THAT MOVIE AS A RESULT OF OUR DECISIONS.
AND I THINK IT ALLOWS US TO FIND A FRESH TERRAIN AND OUR ADAPTATION.
IN SO MANY ADAPTATIONS OF WORK, WHEN THEY ARE VERY, VERY FAITHFUL, YOU EITHER MEET THE STANDARD OF THE ORIGINAL FILM OR YOU DON'T READ BUT WHEN WE CHANGE KEY THINGS, BOTH THE NEWCOMER AND THE FAN OF THE ORIGINAL DO NOT KNOW WHERE IT IS HEADED AND THAT IS EXCITING TO ME AS AN ARTIST.
>> THIS WRITING PARTNERSHIP, EXPLAIN HOW THAT ARTISTIC CREATION WORKS, AND WHAT DO YOU DO?
DO YOU RECORD SOMETHING, TEXTED BACK AND FORTH TO EACH OTHER?
>> YEAH.
YOU GOT IT ON THE NOSE.
THAT'S ONE OF THE WAYS WE WERE WORKING TOGETHER.
YOU KNOW, I WOULD SING SOME BASELINES OR SIT AT THE PIANO AND RECORDS AND CHORDS, PROGRESSIONS.
JUSTICE AND VOICE MEMOS TO LIN AND SAY TO YOU KNOW, COULD THIS FIT INTO THE PLOT?
PROVIDING ALL KINDS OF RAW IDEAS.
WHETHER THEY WERE MUSICAL, CONTEXTUAL, STRUCTURAL.
JUST SORT OF SAYING, LET'S SEE HOW WE CAN KEEP EXPLORING EVERY POSSIBILITY.
AGAIN, WE WILL BE BOTH REVERENT ALSO IRREVERENT TO IT, YOU KNOW, AND DO WHAT IT IS WE NEED TO DO IN ORDER TO GET AT THESE IDEAS, THESE LARGER IDEAS AROUND REPRESENTATION AND AROUND THE CULTURAL PURPOSE, YOU KNOW, OF SOUND BEING BORN.
IT WAS AMAZING.
WE GOT TO SIT AT THE DRAMA BOOKSHOP AND JUST THROW IDEAS BACK AND FORTH.
WE DID SOME RETREATS TOGETHER.
WE ACTUALLY DID THE VERY JOURNEY THAT THE WARRIORS TAKE WHERE WE WENT ALL THE WAY UP TO THE BRONX.
IT'S ALL THE WAY UP FOR ME BECAUSE I LIVE IN BROOKLYN.
IT'S CLOSER FOR LIN.
WE WENT TO PORTLAND PARK AND WE WENT THROUGH, WALKED THROUGH TO WOODLAWN CEMETERY, AND FOUND THE TRAIN, MADE OUR WAY BACK DOWN TO THE UPPER WEST SIDE.
GRAZE PAPAYA AND THE RIVERSIDE PARK WHERE THE FAIRIES ARE.
UNION SQUARE.
DOWN TO PORT SHIMMER HORN WHERE THEY SHOT A LOT OF SUBWAY SCENES IN THE FILM AND MADE IT TO CONEY BY SUNSET.
SO THAT WAS OUR METHOD EXPERIENCE.
BUT YOU KNOW, THE WHOLE PROCESS HAS JUST BEEN AMAZING.
HE IS AN AMAZING COLLABORATOR AND ARTIST IN PERSON.
>> YOUR SUCCESS GIVES YOU VERY NICE ACCESS TO PEOPLE WHO RETURN YOUR PHONE CALLS.
YOU CAN HAVE ANYBODY YOU WANTED.
YOU HAD EMCEES REPRESENTING DIFFERENT BOROUGHS HERE.
ALL-STAR LIST.
NAS FROM QUEENS.
STATEN ISLAND.
BROOKLYN.
HOW DID YOU GET IN TOUCH WITH THESE PEOPLE AND WAS IT EASY, ESPECIALLY LAURYN HILL?
TELL US THAT STORY.
>> FIRST OF ALL, YOU ARE VERY KIND.
EVEN MY ROLODEX IS NOT THAT GOOD.
I WANT TO GIVE A LOT OF CREDIT TO OUR EXECUTIVE PRODUCER, NAS.
I HAD BEEN TALKING TO HIM LAST YEAR AROUND THE EVENTS OF HIP- HOP 50.
HE WAS REALLY ONE OF THE KEY EVENTS CELEBRATING HIP-HOP'S 50th ANNIVERSARY.
WE WERE TALKING ABOUT DEVELOPING A ONE-MAN SHOW AROUND HIS INCREDIBLE CATALOG OF MUSIC.
OFFHANDEDLY, HE SAID WHAT ELSE ARE YOU WORKING ON?
I SAID I'M WRITING A WARRIORS CONCEPT ALBUM WITH EISA DAVIS AND HIS EYES POPPED OUT OF HIS HEAD.
HE SAID WARRIORS?
THAT'S MY FAVORITE MOVIE.
SO THE BUY-IN WAS BECAUSE HE REALLY WANTED TO SEE IT EXIST.
IT OPENED A LOT OF DOORS FOR US PARTICULARLY WITHIN THE HIP-HOP COMMUNITY.
AND UNDERSTANDING THAT WE ARE LOOKING TO CREATE OUR BEST SONIC LOVE LETTER TO THIS MOVIE THAT HIP-HOP CULTURE LOVES.
AND THEN THERE ARE THE FOLKS THAT ARE NOT NECESSARILY STARS YET, BUT WE WANT TO BE STARS.
LIKE A LOT OF THE WOMEN PLAYING OUR WARRIORS WERE REALLY FRIENDS OF OURS.
WE ASKED HIM TO COME DO DEMOS OF OUR MATERIAL.
THERE WAS SUCH A CHEMISTRY AND MAGIC HAPPENING IN THE STUDIO THAT WE SAID WE ARE NOT GOING TO TYPE THIS.
WE ARE NOT GOING TO TOP WHAT IS HAPPENING HERE.
THEY KIND OF FELL INTO THE SNOWBALL AS THEY ROLLED DOWN THE HILL.
>> HOW DO YOU FIGURE OUT WHAT KIND OF SONG AND VIBE YOU ARE GOING FOR?
IN THE MOVIE, THERE'S THESE VERY, VERY DIFFERENT GANGS.
COSTUMES, VERY THEATRICAL.
>> VERY STYLIZED, YES.
>> THERE IS CERTAINLY A POINT AND AN INTENTION THAT THE DIRECTOR HAD THAT TIME.
NOW HERE YOU ARE REINTERPRETING IT AND THINKING WHAT IS THE VIBE THAT THIS GROUP WOULD HAVE?
THERE WAS NO K-POP IN 1979.
THERE IS A SAMPLE IN YOUR WORK HERE.
HOW DID YOU SAY OKAY, THIS SOUNDS A LITTLE METAL, A LITTLE R&B.
IT WILL HIP-HOP.
>> THE MOST FUN WAS FIGURING OUT WHAT IS THE TEMPO, WHAT IS THE GENRE OF THIS GAIN?
WHEN WE TALKED ABOUT LUTHER BEFORE EISA CAME ON BOARD , I HAD WRITTEN A COUPLE OF REFERENCES FOR LUTHER, THE ANTAGONIST OF THE FILM BUT THE THINKING FELT TO ORDERED.
IT GIVES US THE CLEAR THAT YOU HAVE A PREMEDITATED MIND.
AND EISA PLAYED ME A METAL BAND WHERE SHE WAS FRIENDS WITH THE LEAD SINGER.
AS SOON AS I HEARD THE SCREAMO, I WAS LIKE I CAN FEEL MY PUERTO RICAN MOTHER'S, GRANDMOTHERS IN HEAVEN, CROSSING THEMSELVES ON MY BEHALF.
SUCH VIRTUOSIC CHAOS.
THIS IS THE SOUND OF LUTHER.
>> >> AND YOU ALLUDED TO THE K- WRAP IN IT.
THE GENDER FLIP MAKES EVERYTHING MORE INTERESTING TO WRITE ABOUT.
THE BOYS ARE EXHAUSTED WHEN THEY ARE THE WARRIORS.
THEY SEE THESE PRETTY GIRLS AND THEY FOLLOW THEM.
WE HAD REAL CONVERSATIONS ABOUT ALL RIGHT, THESE WOMEN HAVE BEEN RUNNING FROM MEN TRYING TO KILL THEM ALL NIGHT.
WHY WOULD THEY TRUST THESE MEN?
AND THE ANSWER, WE LANDED ON IS WE ARE GOING TO CREATE THE MOST BEAUTIFUL, UNTHREATENING BOY BAND OF ALL TIME.
BUT NOT JUST ANY BOY BAND.
WE WANT TO AND THE SOUNDS FROM NEW ADDITION THROUGH STRAY KIDS IN 2024.
>> >> AND SO, YOU'VE GOT WITH JOSH LANDRY CHANNELING HIS BEST BOYZ II MEN.
STEPHEN SANCHEZ CHANNELING HIS BEST JUSTIN TIMBERLAKE PICK YOUR FAVORITE, YOU KNOW, SWEET WHITE BOY FROM THE EARLY '90S.
AND YOU'VE GOT DANIEL REPRESENTING K-RAP AND ABSOLUTELY BREAKING IT DOWN WITH LYRICS BY OUR FRIEND HELEN PARK.
THE CONTENT THAT TAKES FORM.
EACH CHALLENGE MEANT THAT WE HAD TO RISE TO THAT OCCASION IN TERMS OF VARIOUS GENRES.
>> THERE IS SOMETHING THROUGHOUT THE FILM WHERE YOU SEE THESE REPEATED SHOTS OF THE SUBWAY.
EVEN THE ALBUM HERE WITH THE SOUNDS, THE VOICE OF THE ACTUAL NEW YORK SUBWAY IS DOING A VOICEOVER DURING THIS PERIOD AND I WONDER WHY DO YOU THINK IT WOULD BE RELEVANT TODAY FOR AN AUDIENCE LIVING IN 2024?
GOES BACK TO THE WAY THAT I WANTED TO LOOK AT THE FOUND FROM THIS 2024 PERSPECTIVE.
AND I JUST THINK THAT THE WHOLE CONCEPT OF COMING TOGETHER AS A COMMUNITY ORGANIZATION WHICH IS AN ALTERNATIVE WAY TO LOOK AT A GANG, AND COMING TOGETHER AND REALIZING THAT THERE ACTUALLY IS NOT ANY NEED FOR THE KIND OF BETWEEN THESE COMMUNITY ORGANIZATIONS.
AND THAT THERE'S A WAY TO STRIVE FOR, COME UP WITH A KIND OF PEACE, AND THAT IS TRULY IMPORTANT TO ME RIGHT NOW IN THIS WORLD THAT WE LIVE IN, TO FIND A WAY TO DO OUR VERY BEST TO FIND A WAY, AND AM VERY INTERESTED IN WOMEN'S LEADERSHIP.
THAT WAS ANOTHER HUGE ASPECT OF HOW WE WERE APPROACHING THIS.
YOU KNOW, HOW DO WOMEN WORK TOGETHER?
AND WHAT KIND OF PEACE CAN A WOMAN CREATE FROM THAT CHARISMATIC PEDESTAL, RIGHT?
AND SO YEAH, THAT'S REALLY THE HEART OF IT FOR ME.
AND ALSO JUST MAKING SURE THAT EVERYONE IS HEARD.
I MEAN, WE JUST DID OUR BEST TO DIFFERENT NEW YORK 'S.
YOU MENTIONED THE K-POP THAT IS THERE, RIGHT?
AND THE, THERE IS A GROUP CALLED THE HURRICANES.
THE HOUSE OF HURRICANES.
AND THAT'S THIS QUEER AND TRANS GROUP THAT IS THERE.
SO HAVING THE TURNBULL ACS, THESE PUERTO RICANS IN THE BRONX.
JUST MAKING SURE THAT EVERYONE HAS A SEAT AT THE TABLE.
EVEN IF IT IS ONE OF STRIFE IN THIS STORY THAT WE ULTIMATELY CAN FIND A PLACE WHERE EVERYONE CAN LIVE, AND THAT IS, I THINK ACTUALLY IN THE CULTURE OF HIP HOP.
THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE ALLUDE TO IN THIS, WHICH IS THAT REAL- LIFE GANG TRUTHS THAT HAPPENED IN 1971 LEADS TO THE BIRTH OF HIP-HOP IN 1973 IN A LOT OF WAYS.
AND THAT THOSE GANGS BECOME CREWS THAT THEN BATTLE AGAINST EACH OTHER WITH THEIR ART AS OPPOSED TO WITH KNIVES OR WITH WEAPONS, AND THAT SOMETHING THAT WAS IMPORTANT TO ME, AND I THINK THAT SOMETHING THAT IS REALLY GREAT FOR US TO LOOK BACK AT FROM THIS VANTAGE POINT.
>> OUR AUDIENCE MIGHT NOT KNOW THAT ART AND ACTIVISM IS KIND OF CENTRAL TO SOME OF YOUR WORK.
IN 2009 YOU DID AND MIXED TAPE IN REFERENCE TO A VERY FAMOUS AND THAT YOU HAVE.
ANGELA DAVIS.
WHAT IS THE ROLE AND RESPONSIBILITY AS YOU SEE YOURSELF IN THESE PRETTY HEAVY TIMES?
>> WELL, I THINK A LOT ABOUT HOW WHAT ART DOES IS IT GIVES US KIND OF LIKE --IT TELLS US HOW WE ARE SUPPOSED TO EXPECT TO BE, YOU KNOW.
IT CREATES OUR NOTIONS OF WHAT IT IS THAT WE HAVE NOT YET ASKED VARIANCE.
AND THAT'S WHERE I THINK THE RESPONSIBILITY COMES AND, BECAUSE OF COURSE I WANT US AS ARTIST TO BE FREE TO DO WHATEVER WE WANT TO DO.
AND I THINK WE ALSO HAVE TO UNDERSTAND WHERE SYSTEMIC AND STRUCTURAL INJUSTICES HAVE OCCURRED AND CONTINUE TO OCCUR.
SO TO PLAY INTO SOME OF THOSE STEREOTYPES , I THINK IT'S IRRESPONSIBLE IF YOU'RE NOT DOING IT IN A VERY CONSCIOUS, PURPOSEFUL WAY.
THERE HAS TO BE SOME KIND OF CRITICAL ENGAGEMENT WITH WHERE IT IS THAT WE ARE AS A SOCIETY, THAT WE CAN ACTUALLY DREAM OF NEW WAYS OF BEING TOGETHER THROUGH THE ARTS.
ALL THE TIME, ABOUT CULTURAL WORK BEING A PRONG OF WHAT IT IS THAT WE ARE TRYING TO DO WHEN IT COMES TO ACHIEVING SOCIAL CHANGE.
I WOULD NEVER SAY THAT AN ARTIST HAS ANY DUTY TO SAY ANYTHING THAT DOES NOT COME FULLBORE FROM THEIR IMAGINATION.
THERE HAS TO BE THAT FREEDOM AT ALL TIMES, AND I ALSO KNOW THAT THERE CAN BE A LAZINESS OR AN INERTIA.
THERE CAN BE A RE-INSCRIBING OF ALL OF THESE VERY HARMFUL NOTIONS, JUST BECAUSE YOU WANTED TO TELL A STORY THAT ENTERTAINS A PREVIOUS VERSION OF WHAT WE THOUGHT OUR REALITY WAS.
WE GET TO CREATE NEW REALITIES, NEW WORLDS.
THAT'S WHAT I TRIED TO DO AND I KNOW THAT'S WHAT LIN TRIES TO DO, AS WELL.
>> YOU GOT SOME LYRICS IN THERE TOWARDS THE END THAT SAYS WE IF YOU WANT TO EXPAND A LITTLE BIT, GIVE US A COUPLE OF THOSE LYRICS, AND WHY, IN THESE INCREDIBLY DIVISIVE TIMES, I WISH MORE PEOPLE THAT HEAR THAT NOW.
>> IT'S INCREDIBLE WHEN YOU FIND SOMETHING THAT RESONATES DEEPLY WITH YOU.
MY FAVORITE SCENE IN THE WARRIORS IS THIS WORDLESS MOMENT.
THE WALTER HILL SHOT WHERE THE WARRIORS HAVE FINALLY MADE THE LAST TRAIN THAT GOES ALL THE WAY TO CONEY ISLAND.
THEY ARE DEAD TIRED AND ASLEEP AND THIS PAIR OF COUPLES COMES ON AND KIND OF DISCO AND THEY ARE HAVING THE TIME OF THEIR LIVES.
IT'S VERY CLEAR THEY LIVE IN A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT NEW YORK AND THE NEW YORK WE'VE BEEN WATCHING FOR THE PAST 80 MINUTES.
AND THEY ASSESS EACH OTHER AND THERE IS THIS WORDLESS MOMENT, AND MERCY, WHO HAS BEEN TRAVELING WITH THE WARRIORS, STARTS TO FEEL SMALL.
SOMEONE GRABS HER ARM AND SAYS BASICALLY ASSERT YOUR DIGNITY LIKE YOU BELONG ON THIS TRAIN, TOO.
THERE IS NO DIALOGUE IN THE CHALLENGE FOR US BECAME HOW DO WE NARRATE A WORDLESS EQUIVALENCE ON THE ALBUM?
SO I WROTE THE SONG CALLED SAME TRAIN HOME, WHICH I THINK IS SUCH A DISTILLATION OF EVERYTHING I LOVE ABOUT THE CITY, WHICH IS THAT WE ALL COME FROM ALL WALKS OF LIFE TO BE HERE.
IF YOU GREW UP HERE, YOU FIGURED OUT HOW TO BE YOURSELF HERE, FIND YOUR NEW YORK.
IF YOU COME FROM SOMEWHERE ELSE, YOU'VE COME HERE TO BECOME YOUR SELF.
AND WE ALL SHARE THE SAME SUBWAY AND WE ALL MANAGED TO LIVE MOSTLY IN PEACE.
>> >> WHAT I LOVE ABOUT NEW YORK, AND WHY I COULD NEVER MOVE TO PLACES WHERE YOU HAVE TO DRIVE EVERYWHERE IS THAT I AM IN COMMUNION WITH NEW YORK BY VIRTUE OF THE PUBLIC TRANSIT SYSTEM.
I LOVE THAT ABOUT OUR CITY, AND I LOVE THAT WE ALL SHARED STRUGGLES EVEN THOUGH IT MAY NOT SEEM LIKE THAT ON THE SURFACE.
>> EISA DAVIS AND LIN-MANUEL MIRANDA, THANK YOU BOTH FOR JOINING US.
>> THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU.
>> WARRIORS THE ALBUM IS OUT NOW.
LISTEN WHEREVER YOU GET YOUR MUSIC.
THAT'S IT FOR OUR PROGRAM TONIGHT.
IF YOU WANT TO FIND OUT WHAT'S COMING UP ON THE SHOW EVERY NIGHT, SIGN UP FOR OUR NEWSLETTER AT PBS.ORG/AMANPOUR.
HAVE A GOOD NIGHT AND THANKS FOR WATCHING.
>> "AMANPOUR AND COMPANY" IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE ANDERSON FAMILY ENDOWMENT.
JIM ATTWOOD AND LESLIE WILLIAMS.
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SYLVIA A.
AND SIMON B. POYTA PROGRAMMING ENDOWMENT TO FIGHT ANTISEMITISM.
THE FAMILY FOUNDATION OF LAYLA AND MICKEY STRAUSS.
MARK J. BLECHNER.
THE FILOMEN M. D'AGOSTINO FOUNDATION.
SETON J. MELVIN.
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CHARLES ROSENBLUM.
KOO AND PATRICIA YUEN.
COMMITTED TO BRIDGING CULTURAL DIFFERENCES IN OUR COMMUNITIES.
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